The "Anonymous" Scientology Protest is an NSA/FBI Fishing Expedition, page 8
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reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 05:54 AM by Throbber
reply to post by another anon


No doubt they have a few people in that thread on your board, too.

Remember the lessons of yore - the hills have eyes, and though they might not have mouths to speak with or hands to write with, they're damn well watching.

Your own tactics can be used against you!

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 05:58 AM by Anonymous13
Originally posted by neformore
Oddly though, that links into this...S. Spies Want to Find Terrorists in World of Warcraft.


Not all that odd. My prior experience with anonymous discussion boards was rather slim. I saw clips of Densha Otoko (google it) aired in Japan. I knew that 2ch.net was one of the largest discussion sites on the net. Prior to making any posts on an image board, I had watched Mark Bunker make a plea for any activity to be legal. I saw members of the Church of Scientology harrass him on camera, and heard him furious that they would picket him at his home. When I did join into discussions related to Chanology, I focused on trying to advocate ways that members within Scientology could be helped. All discussion participants agreed that members of the church were not the enemy. I was relieved. Perhaps there was no point, really, in my joining in, if the project could take care of itself.

Then the "mind control cults" thread was posted on the board. It was suggested that anonymous posters on the board were being manipulated by the German government, that they were a pawn for foreign powers, that well-known 'forcing' strategies were at work. No one took the claims very seriously, but the claims were argued in intricate detail, with anonymous posters claimed to be a 'shadowy', 'eerie', and 'mysterious' organization, much like that which they were opposing. Like a cult, it was argued. Terrorists, it was argued.

Shortly thereafter, a piece emerged from Fox 11, which had covered the topic of cyber-bullying before. It was covering cyber-bullying again, focusing on members of anonymous boards as sources of bullying, calling them 'cult-like', and 'organized crime'. The video was posted to the board. Its message was clear. The propaganda of the church, calling us a cult, had been echoed by Fox 11. Thread, after thread, after thread was posted in the same vein. After seeing the Fox 11 piece posted as a trophy onto the board, when I thought of what I knew of anonymous culture, Densha Otoko, and what I knew of the movement to reform the Church of Scientology, of Mark Bunker attempting to reform the church, I cried. Because the threads were cruel, and did not represent what I knew of anonymous on-line culture. They did not represent what I saw on the board. They were smears, and propaganda.

Most of the press that Chanology has received has been sympathetic. Prior to my first visiting a related forum, I had seen the Economist's article, which acknowledged the charge that the Church of Scientology was a litigious and vicious cult. Time has slammed the church for its treatment of its members. Still, in the odd article later on, I could see the same words echoing from that early, original 'mind control cults' thread, in which the Church of Scientology laid out its propaganda plan -- 'eerie', 'mysterious', and 'shadowy'. Perhaps placed by the Church's PR apparatus, perhaps not, but very similar.

Governments have assumedly been investigating various anonymous on-line communications for a long time. After the Chanology project began, I've noticed a few articles on this topic come out. This may be coincidence, it may be a function of the Church's PR machine, or it may be something else. But, if you want an interesting case
study in propaganda attempts, visit the sites where Chanology is active. The Church is working hard to influence project members.
Originally posted by neformore
When does the ideology of anonymous suddenly become wanton splintered DOS attacks by people with a particular beef against an organisation that isn't scientology?

The specific decision processes in Chanology have been characterized as democratic consensus, and have yielded a peaceful, worldwide protest. If you're not familiar with anonymous on-line communication, you may wish to learn more about it. The following might be a good start.

en.wikipedia.org...



reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:01 AM by Skyfloating
reply to post by Throbber


I dont know the answer to your question.

But I do know one thing: When a conspiracy-theorist sees two sides lined up in extremist speech and action, surrounded by intense media-hype...

...he asks: Is there a third party involved? Who benefits? What is going on behind the scenes?

In the last few weeks Ive been shocked by the lack of questioning / looking behind the scenes surrounding the event.

The OP may be wrong in his assumptions, but at least he is looking where the frenzied and hysterical hype-makers dont dare look.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Skyfloating]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:04 AM by Throbber
reply to post by Anonymous13


I would, but from my own experience i think i'm up-to-date anyway, i've heard and seen enough from the horse's mouth itself anyway.

Infact, i think the only place i have indeed ever heard anything in-depth about the chan, is from the chan itself.

Or, "anonymous" as they call themselves these days.

You'll forgive me for holding some misgivings, but i like keeping myself at a distance from this kind of massive social loose-cannon.


edit @ skyfloating: There is always the possibility of a third-party, and it's because of this fact that i don't really think that any particular "group" should get to a size of which you can't see what both hands are doing, to be metaphorical.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:07 AM by Throbber
reply to post by anon too


[Mod Edit] knows about what tomsen is on about - i don't argue about the fact that there will be members of Anon who know what they're doing and are being really quite careful.

But tbh you can't be careful enough with the game that Anon is playing.

Anyway, i've shaked my bits about now and i should probably hide them again before someone decides to bite them off.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]





[Mod Edit: Please see ABOUT ATS: Vulgarity and The Automatic ATS Censors. Thank you - Jak]

[edit on 25/2/08 by JAK]

Roger that JAK, i'll sum up what i said without the profanity.

I'm not going to cry if you fail, Anon.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]



reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:08 AM by another anon
Originally posted by freight tomsen
I'm aware that YOU don't believe in Xenu, I was refering to Scientology followers... if they want to believe that, then that is their right, and we don't need a group of Anonymous trouble-makers causing a stir over this pathetic and very small religion. It has plenty of funding from the NWO, so it's all over the world, but the amount of people that are actually suckered into this religion is completely negligable, regardless of the figures/polls you may have seen.

This religion was a psy-op from the beginning and remains the PROBLEM with which to springboard this ridiculously childish "Anonymous" resistence REACTION, and the SOLUTION will be unconstitutional legislation enacted to use against those poor ignorant dupes who fell for Scientology.

Watch as this happens folks. You will see "Anonymous" on the news and they will say there are millions of followers pushing for this draconian legislation to be taken against the CoS. Remember, if everybody's not free to believe what they want, then nobody is.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by freight tomsen]


ah, I think I see what your problem with us is, you misunderstand our motivation and goals. we do not want any legislation that would forbid Scientology, we want an investigation of crimes we believe there leadership has committed, we fully support the freezone which is effectively the CoS's protestant movement. we want to CONVINCE people out of the cult not legislate them out. if the CoS reforms we would drop our grevences, but it would have to be a pretty dramatic reformation, no more demanding hundreds to tens of thousands of dollars for 'services' all the people who have been involved in abuse or any deaths would need to be prosecuted. I don't think what we are asking here is all too rediculus. I mean [Mod Edit] , I wish we had one billionth of the legislative backing you thought we did, we've actually found it very difficult to find anyone in the government willing to even give us a generic email response. and I don't know what you are thinking with the media, we've been all but passed oer by just about every media source of significance so far, I'm not sure what the standard is, but we had somewhere on the order of ten thousand people protesting in cold #ing weather (except Australia were it's summer, lucky [Mod Edit] ) organized with no leadership is like four weeks from nothing, and we got almost nothing, y'know, many of us have actualy thought there were scientologists in powerful positions keeping our actions as quiet as possible.

did you know that on the day of our protest youtube had a mysterious 'bug' which conveniently ensured none of our vids put up from 2/10 would make it to there front page, the timeing was perfict, and it lasted just long enough so that we would be blocked, what the # does that sound like to you? is we were NSA don't you think we'd have been able to make sure something like that didn't happen?!






[Mod Edit: Please see Terms and Conditions of Use section 1b. Thank you - Jak]

[edit on 25/2/08 by JAK]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:11 AM by Throbber
reply to post by another anon


It sounds like someone bribed tech support, if you want to ask me.


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:13 AM by KosherKrackers
Personally I think it's madness to think this is a FBI/NSA operation, but those are certainly valid theories, my opinion is rather biased.

Freight Tomsen, if you think this is a simple issue of religious intolerance then you're an idiot, sorry, but true, there's more than enough evidence to support the anonymous claims of scientologies various human rights violations, covert operations, corruption, etc, etc, and little to none to support the idea that Anonymous is in it to oppose their beliefs.

Thus far that's been claimed by no-one but the Co$ and Co$ sympathisers that know nothing more about this affair than "Co$ is a religion, Anonymous is protesting them, they must be intolerant!" This is non-sequitur, and bypasses any and all research.

www.xenu.net
www.whyaretheydead.net
en.wikipedia.org...

Three really, really, easily accessible sites thatgo into detail about exactly what we're fighting for.

www.forum.exscn.net...
ocmb.xenu.net...
www.lermanet.com...

A few less obvious ones, the first two of stories from ex-scientologists, the third a list of front groups scientology has established.

Tell me, why exactly does a religion need a series of front groups that exapnsive? Nevermind ones that don't advertise their faith?

Why exactly does Co$ hide their core beliefs? Yes, all religions have a kooky story that relies on faith, but they don't charge you to learn them, the practices of scientology's "pay to pray" service, would be akin to a christian priest charging you $350,000 to learn about Jesus, his crucifixion, ressurection, and judgement day.

If you can claim that we're rallying under nothing more than the flag of 'religious persecution' then you need to critically evaluate your critical thinking, as it's lacking.

Severely lacking.


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:21 AM by Throbber
reply to post by Skyfloating


Not just scientology.

Allow me to illustrate a point which might shock or disturb (although i hope not) even though it is what is merely a possibility.

I'm sure everyone remembers watching cartoons when they were kids - the kind of looney toons stuff with bugs bunny and donald duck.

Anyway, this scenario reminds me of the old 'Carrot-on-a-stick' sketch, where a snarling, unstoppable foe was lead to it's demise by a simple and conventional trap.

In real terms, Scientology is the trap.

p.s; i'd love to discuss this in-depth with someone who understood the machinations of Anon implicitly, but that would probably highlight myself as some sort of information addict.

[edit on 25-2-2008 by Throbber]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:23 AM by freight tomsen
Originally posted by another anon

ah, I think I see what your problem with us is, you misunderstand our motivation and goals.

we want to CONVINCE people out of the cult not legislate them out.

did you know that on the day of our protest youtube had a mysterious 'bug' which conveniently ensured none of our vids put up from 2/10 would make it to there front page, the timeing was perfict, and it lasted just long enough so that we would be blocked, what the # does that sound like to you? is we were NSA don't you think we'd have been able to make sure something like that didn't happen?!


You're not hearing what I'm saying about the Hegelian Dialectic, this is how the New World Order has philosophically owned us all for 60 years. Thesis + Antithesis = Synthesis. They make you think you're being blocked, thus giving you encouragement! Now you're sure the "NWO" isn't behind the "Anonymous" movement because it seems like you were short-changed. The reality is you were not short-changed at all! The Anonymous video got a crazy amount of views overnight... I'll tell you who is being short-changed in this war of information and ideas, that's Alex Jones and Alan Watt.

If you Anonymous collectivists want to join something meaningful, join what Alex Jones has deemed the "Infowar." That means raising people's awareness about the New World Order and it's mechanisms like the CFR, Trilateral Commission, Bilderberg Group, the Masons, Skull and Bones, etc. I know that you don't know about these organizations! I know you haven't researched them, because if you did, you would focus ALL your energy there, not on Scientology! The Anonymous movement is taking all these emotions you should be feeling against the New World Order and creating a group of faceless collectivists to rally against a negligable religion.

Go to www.infowars.com and www.cuttingthroughthematrix.com, here you will learn about the NWO and the mechanisms really controlling society. This is where we all must focus our attention. And we need not do it Anonymously! I am Eric Dubay, not Anonymous, my website is: www.myspace.com/sheeplerevolt

That "Sheeple" in the sheeple revolt refers to BOTH Scientology members and Anonymous members.


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:24 AM by Skyfloating
reply to post by Throbber


I understand your theory...and wont rule out the possibility. Anon has to be careful not to get in trouble with CoS or with the Feds.

On the other hand, as some other poster said...scientology is not as powerful as they themselves think or make others think. Membership has taken a fall since the 80s when their leader died.

But they could become powerful again by orchestrating a little "create your own enemy" tactic.


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:27 AM by anon too
Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by Throbber

But I do know one thing: When a conspiracy-theorist sees two sides lined up in extremist speech and action, surrounded by intense media-hype...


I don't know how you can call the coverage "intense media-hype". It's been almost exclusively on the internet. How many news reports have you seen or read about this?

...he asks: Is there a third party involved? Who benefits? What is going on behind the scenes?


That is a darn shame. If said theorist can see what is happening and see the sites where it's taking place and come to the "govt must be behind it" conclusion. As has been stated by many anons, the goal is to free people from the cult of Scientology and collapse the church.

In the last few weeks Ive been shocked by the lack of questioning / looking behind the scenes surrounding the event.


Frankly, so have most of us, for various reasons. We WANT the light of the press to shine on this issue.

The OP may be wrong in his assumptions, but at least he is looking where the frenzied and hysterical hype-makers dont dare look.


Perhaps, but as many anon and non anon have stated, he's looking in the wrong place for the mythic all knowing govt perfect execution of a plan.

EDIT: Whoo hoo, I was late to the party with this post.


[edit on 25-2-2008 by anon too]


reply posted on 25-2-2008 @ 06:29 AM by KosherKrackers
reply to post by freight tomsen


Anonymous is hivemind, no one persons opinions on what we should fight for or against are relevant, ideas are presented all the time, most of them small fry campaigns against various stupidity across the internet or someone with a grudge who wants to harness Anonymous as a personal army.

Your concept of who we shuold be fighting, and for what reason, has no relevance whatsoever on whether we would be fighting these if we really cared or not, what you fail to realise is that if an idea is presented at the right time, people will rally behind it, and as people rally, more input is generated, raising more attention.

Think of it as a political campaign, the more people you attract to your side, the more infleunce you'll gain due to increased attention and increased dissemination of that attention and the communications and ideas that come from it.

The Anonymous declaration against Scientology video came at the right time, garnered the right kind of information, and started out as little more than a laugh amongst the ranks. As it developed, the anonymii involved became more serious as the misinformation and manipulation became more apparent through increased evidence and more exposure from critics, ex-scientologists, etc, etc.

The bigger fish are irrelvant, as this is what caught the public eye, fads come and go, they can be something big, or something insignificant and nothing but a novelty compared to other things, but hey, look at what's caught on, and how it's being continued.
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