Thank you, LdragonFire your rebuttals are quite timely and are rather difficult for me to respond to in the time frame allotted for this debate.
The constitution of the United States has remained unchanged for over 200 years, amendments to that constitution have been ratified since then but
the basic wording and regulations to our government have not changed at all. The Supreme Court does the interpretation of that constitution, as the
judicial branch of our government has the right to do. This interpretation has changed over the years but the core values of the constitution and the
freedoms of the citizens of the United States have relatively remained intact.
It is a fact that the US government has more recently appeared to trump the sovereignty of individual states rights but there are several examples
where US law is indeed trumped by state law. California’s medicinal marijuana law is just such an example.
To me it’s all about the training the individual soldier receives, they are trained to follow orders and the chain of command. They are also
being trained in urban combat tactics to control civilian populations on the pretext it’s for battles or wars in other countries, but could easily
be used right here.
Soldiers are indeed trained to follow orders; this is a hallmark of any great military force. The difference is that in this military if a soldier is
given a direct order that is contradictory to the law or an individual personnel’s moral compass that soldier has the right to (after the order has
been carried out) They may file a grievance with the JAG office and there is a hearing. In these (more often than not) extreme cases, the superior
officer may be found guilty and can lead to discharge.
Q1. What happens if the Civilian Government is labeled incompetent, or unfit for duty, who the soldiers will side with?
Most likely the soldiers will side with the government, however the police would most likely side with the citizenry. The scenario that you describe
above is not a coup but a revolution. These happen sometimes. (in fact it happens every 2 years for a midterm election and every 4 years for a general
election) If the citizenry rise up against the governing body of a country it is much different than a military body forcibly taking over a government
for it’s own power gain.
I don’t believe right now we have a General with enough charisma to be a threat, but what happens when another general like Patton,
MacArthur, or Lee rises to power, and conflicts with the civilian authority. Remember we are engaged in a War on Terrorism, a perpetual war, one
without end. We live in a fear society and the beginning of any coup could very well be played out in the MSM, before any physical action takes
We actually have had a military leader in recent memory that could be considered as charismatic as Patton, Macarthur, or Lee. His name is Colin
Powell. Like the others though he believed in our government and would never seriously consider a military coup of our constitutionally elected
We have lived in this society for quite a while now. It was just like this during the cold war. We lived in perpetual fear of commies during the cold
war and no coup ever took place. A fear society is a great thing for the MIC, it allows them to develop and spend money on arms. This keeps the MIC
happy and content. This in and of itself decreases the already minimal chance of a military coup.
I’m glad you brought this up; this would be just another scenario of what could happen. The civilian government could be labeled as a threat to our
constitution/republic form of government, and the military could step in with the pretext of restoring our constitutional form of government.
In the event that the military would rise up against a government that has been deemed a threat to our constitution this would be a revolution not a
coup. To restore the constitutionally elected government, by the people and for the people would simply be a revolution. This massively differs from a
History has shown that checks and balances can be eroded in time, it is happening right now in America.
Yes you are right, our core values in this country are being usurped. However these atrocities to our civil rights are happening through a corrupt
administration and may not continue in subsequent administrations.
I have to take this next paragraph apart in order to correctly explain this…
How many unprecedented things has this current administration achieved, mostly in the area of the War on Terror,
Our society has
changed dramatically in the wake of September 11, Whether or not that event was a wag the dog event or a legitimate attack on our country has no
bearing on this debate.
Habeas Corpus suspended
only in the cases of foreign nationals held out of this country where the right of
Habeas Corpus does not apply.
holding people indefinitely
All are being held according to the Geneva convention of warfare, These are enemy combatants and according
to the articles of the convention they may not be released until the cessation of hostilities have been concluded.
Being currently debated as what is classified as torture I may not agree with what is considered torture but this in and of
itself is a debatable point., and not applicable here in this debate.
Not applicable in this debate.
I do apologize but I am not familiar with this term. Please explain this to me so that I might understand.
how long till it will be up to the military to just step in to make sure we have a safe and secure country and who ever said that the courts,
and congress would not support a possible coup.
This would not be a coup. In this eventuality that congress gets finally fed up with the
executive branch there is a system in place that would allow them to remove a sitting president without the need for a coup. It is called an
impeachment. It has been done before and is capable of happening again.
A civil war is much different than the taking over of a government by the military. There are major differences in both these scenarios.
Q2. The first American civil war claimed one million lives, and saw our navy go from 90th place in the world to 3rd in the world, millions
where made by the manufacture of weapons, do you think a new civil war here would be any different?
Absolutely not, I in fact think that a civil war in this day and age would be a boon to the manufacturers of military equipment and supplies provided
location availability and who has the money to buy the supplies. But this is different from a military coup of the government.
Again the first thing a person does when they join the United States military is to take an oath to protect and defend the constitution and the
country. While not all persons take this oath literally the indoctrination into the military life leads one to uphold these tenants fiercely. Not all
persons do so and eventually they leave the military. Who are left and become “lifers” are people that believe so much in these values that they
commit their entire carriers to these principals.
Q1 What is the difference between a revolution and a military coup?
Q2 What is the consequences of a military coup of the government?
Q3 What would be the benefits to the American people for a military coup of the government?
Q4 What would be the reaction from the rest of the world especially our enemies in the event of a military coup of the government?
Q5 What economic impact would occur in the eventuality of a military coup?