reply to post by darcon
We are forced to...that is why. WE need computers to communicate but we cant base our human necessities off of wanting computers and keeping them.
That is the whole point about the material world....get that down before you start arguing because people are going to automatically say you are a
hypocrite because you are using a computer and watching tv. Its the OBSESSION with material things and the faith our society puts in them that is the
problem, not the fact that they exist. You got it darcon....keep reading and do not create divisions. Peace my man, im signing off.
Americans need to go on strike!, page 6
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reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 03:35 PM by Enthralled Fan
reply to post by stellawayten
Really, I was not trying to be insulting, just thinking of a few reasons why this could be a problem.
Also, if everyone quit their jobs, after a month, what would they do then? Do you think that their jobs would still be waiting for them after they abandoned them? I don't know if you have noticed, but millions of people are living paycheck to paycheck, so, if they took a month off, they would be in complete ruin.
It sounds as if you are doing well for yourself, or your family at least, being land barons, but this is just not the case for at least half the rest of the population.
Really, I was not trying to be insulting, just thinking of a few reasons why this could be a problem.
Also, if everyone quit their jobs, after a month, what would they do then? Do you think that their jobs would still be waiting for them after they abandoned them? I don't know if you have noticed, but millions of people are living paycheck to paycheck, so, if they took a month off, they would be in complete ruin.
It sounds as if you are doing well for yourself, or your family at least, being land barons, but this is just not the case for at least half the rest of the population.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 03:43 PM by stellawayten
reply to post by Enthralled Fan
That is why I want to see a difference. I want to see things changed. I hate sitting here doing nothing. There are quite a few people that feel the way I do and I wish we could get together and make a difference.
I want people to wake up and realize that it doesn't have to be this way. Not just people on this board but people that I'm very close to. Ugh... it's all very frustrating.
oh, btw, I don't mind a difference of opinion at all... however; I'm a little on the defensive because of previous posts by another member. I really need to walk away for a bit.
That is why I want to see a difference. I want to see things changed. I hate sitting here doing nothing. There are quite a few people that feel the way I do and I wish we could get together and make a difference.
I want people to wake up and realize that it doesn't have to be this way. Not just people on this board but people that I'm very close to. Ugh... it's all very frustrating.
oh, btw, I don't mind a difference of opinion at all... however; I'm a little on the defensive because of previous posts by another member. I really need to walk away for a bit.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 03:57 PM by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by stellawayten
Taking all your money out of the banks would be impractical, if not impossible. First, you have a problem with all of the money that is in IRA's, SEP's, 401K's, 403B's, etc. The government would immediately take out a 10% penalty, etc. Then there is the problem of security. I don't think people want to be walking around with stacks of cash, or certified cashiers checks.
There are 4 bigger problems:
1.) Such a massive action might spark the government to use the Ricco Act against everyone, calling it a conspiracy to destroy the banking system, and/or the government.
2.) If the Fed ran out of money, they'd just print more, making the dollars that you withdrew worth about 50% less than they were, the day before you started this action.
3.) Assuming that they didn't invoke the Ricco Act, they could very easily invoke the Patriot Act, saying that you are a threat to the United States economy, and are trying to destroy it.
4.) Since the corporations are thrilled with any excuse to offshore outsource both products and services, they would just use this action as an excuse to outsource everything that hasn't already been outsourced. And for those jobs that have to be performed here, there are those 20 million illegal aliens that would be happy to take over your jobs.
All in all, I don't think it's a very good idea. I do sympathize with your plight, however.
So what I am saying? Unfortunately, that the establishment has us all by the short hairs.
What do we do?
Some people have tried to do it, but there weren't enough. Both parties had candidates that REALLY would have made things much better- Dennis Kucinich on the Democrat side, and Ron Paul on the Republican side. But there weren't enough people that voted for them. But it was a start. Start thinking about 2012- it's not too early. Rather than trying to organize a strike, organize a support group for Dennis and Ron, there is plenty of time before 2012. I would, by the way, also skip the armbands. Some German fanatic tried that in the 1930's, and ended up in a bunker in Berlin, blowing his own brains out, after poisoning himself. (BTW, he also devalued his currency to the point of worthlessness, by printed too much.)
Unfortunately, Clinton, Obama, McCain and Huckabee are really all the same- their differences are surface differences, not substantial differences.
Taking all your money out of the banks would be impractical, if not impossible. First, you have a problem with all of the money that is in IRA's, SEP's, 401K's, 403B's, etc. The government would immediately take out a 10% penalty, etc. Then there is the problem of security. I don't think people want to be walking around with stacks of cash, or certified cashiers checks.
There are 4 bigger problems:
1.) Such a massive action might spark the government to use the Ricco Act against everyone, calling it a conspiracy to destroy the banking system, and/or the government.
2.) If the Fed ran out of money, they'd just print more, making the dollars that you withdrew worth about 50% less than they were, the day before you started this action.
3.) Assuming that they didn't invoke the Ricco Act, they could very easily invoke the Patriot Act, saying that you are a threat to the United States economy, and are trying to destroy it.
4.) Since the corporations are thrilled with any excuse to offshore outsource both products and services, they would just use this action as an excuse to outsource everything that hasn't already been outsourced. And for those jobs that have to be performed here, there are those 20 million illegal aliens that would be happy to take over your jobs.
All in all, I don't think it's a very good idea. I do sympathize with your plight, however.
So what I am saying? Unfortunately, that the establishment has us all by the short hairs.
What do we do?
Some people have tried to do it, but there weren't enough. Both parties had candidates that REALLY would have made things much better- Dennis Kucinich on the Democrat side, and Ron Paul on the Republican side. But there weren't enough people that voted for them. But it was a start. Start thinking about 2012- it's not too early. Rather than trying to organize a strike, organize a support group for Dennis and Ron, there is plenty of time before 2012. I would, by the way, also skip the armbands. Some German fanatic tried that in the 1930's, and ended up in a bunker in Berlin, blowing his own brains out, after poisoning himself. (BTW, he also devalued his currency to the point of worthlessness, by printed too much.)
Unfortunately, Clinton, Obama, McCain and Huckabee are really all the same- their differences are surface differences, not substantial differences.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 04:10 PM by darcon
reply to post by guyopitz
Finally someone with some sense, listen to this guy he knows what he is talking about. Been on this thread trying to defend they O.P., yet there seems to be a ton of people out there that support today's Society.
Finally someone with some sense, listen to this guy he knows what he is talking about. Been on this thread trying to defend they O.P., yet there seems to be a ton of people out there that support today's Society.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 04:15 PM by guyopitz
Everyone I know is working 2 or 3 jobs and lives at home with mama, even if they are like 35 years old. I see like 12 homeless guys on a daily basis
while WALKING to work because I cant afford a car/gas/insurance and even with my lower expenses even the cost of food is rising so fast that im
cutting corners.
I work very very hard, I get little sleep, little food and is my political opinion even worth a damn? Im a Ron Paul supporter and look how they gave him a mass media blackout or public ridicule. Im not bieng represented. Im sure as hell bieng taxed to death without representation. I say its time for project mayhem. *****SNIPPED CONTENT****** Extreme, sure. Effective, Very.
Maybe your concience will get the better of you when they start putting US citizens into forced labor concentration camps for going against our ridiculous fascist system. Its the protesters like us who will have our constitutional rights taken first. You think your safe but how long before they come for you too? History repeats itself and your just helping the Nazi's get away with everything through your ignorance.
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No discussion of illegal activity to be specific.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Crakeur]
I work very very hard, I get little sleep, little food and is my political opinion even worth a damn? Im a Ron Paul supporter and look how they gave him a mass media blackout or public ridicule. Im not bieng represented. Im sure as hell bieng taxed to death without representation. I say its time for project mayhem. *****SNIPPED CONTENT****** Extreme, sure. Effective, Very.
Maybe your concience will get the better of you when they start putting US citizens into forced labor concentration camps for going against our ridiculous fascist system. Its the protesters like us who will have our constitutional rights taken first. You think your safe but how long before they come for you too? History repeats itself and your just helping the Nazi's get away with everything through your ignorance.
Mod Note: Terms & Conditions Of Use – Please Review This Link.
No discussion of illegal activity to be specific.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Crakeur]
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 04:33 PM by horsegiver
reply to post by stellawayten
Hi Stellawayten,
Your idea sounds good basically, but I would think, very difficult to co-ordinate for maximum effect.
How about those interested in making a stand, taking part in a practice run, by foregoing their annual holidays, and planning to stay home instead, during which time, try out managing without as many products/facilities as possible?
Maybe have picnics in local parks, organise games for kids,[do it during normal school holiday period] walk as much as possible, explore your locality and discover how much fun you can have for free.
I know it's not a complete answer, but you have to start somewhere, and build on what works without risking losing your job, if you are lucky enough to have one.
We all need to simplify our lives,
Good luck to all,
Regards,
Horsegiver.
Hi Stellawayten,
Your idea sounds good basically, but I would think, very difficult to co-ordinate for maximum effect.
How about those interested in making a stand, taking part in a practice run, by foregoing their annual holidays, and planning to stay home instead, during which time, try out managing without as many products/facilities as possible?
Maybe have picnics in local parks, organise games for kids,[do it during normal school holiday period] walk as much as possible, explore your locality and discover how much fun you can have for free.
I know it's not a complete answer, but you have to start somewhere, and build on what works without risking losing your job, if you are lucky enough to have one.
We all need to simplify our lives,
Good luck to all,
Regards,
Horsegiver.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 04:34 PM by Enthralled Fan
reply to post by guyopitz
You are making threats there, that I hope are taken very seriously. Blowing things up is not going to solve anything.
Statements like that can earn you some jail time, so I suggest you be careful what you say.
You are making threats there, that I hope are taken very seriously. Blowing things up is not going to solve anything.
Statements like that can earn you some jail time, so I suggest you be careful what you say.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 04:44 PM by Reality Hurts
reply to post by ProfEmeritus
THAT was an excellent post. I was in the process of typing up a lengthly response to the basic premise of this thread, but you covered many of the same points I was going to make. One quick note though, its R.I.C.O., not ricco. It stands for Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations.
I'm glad that the OP wants to make a difference, but this ain't it. She wants to live like a lion and not as a lamb, but this idea would get too many people turned into tasty chops and then smothered in mint jelly.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Reality Hurts]
THAT was an excellent post. I was in the process of typing up a lengthly response to the basic premise of this thread, but you covered many of the same points I was going to make. One quick note though, its R.I.C.O., not ricco. It stands for Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations.
I'm glad that the OP wants to make a difference, but this ain't it. She wants to live like a lion and not as a lamb, but this idea would get too many people turned into tasty chops and then smothered in mint jelly.
[edit on 13-2-2008 by Reality Hurts]
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 05:08 PM by csulli456
reply to post by SaviorComplex
I won`t go on with endless ranting and raving explaining why I am afraid of positive change. I won`t bow to your materialistic level either nor will I seek to use the reverse psychology as you do in your attempt to hide your very own extreme laziness. I seek not to be a product of my environment as you would rather yourself but instead seek to produce a better environment in which all could live. Persons such as yourself would actually need to contribute in a positive way and would never be allowed any hand outs or easy jobs in which you knew some influential person to place you there.
It is obvious to see while reading through this thread that all of your attempts to twist and manipulate the words of others, who only want to bring about a positive change in which all are treated equally and people behold the power to govern, is in itself a prime example of how people have been fooled into positively contributing to their own demise and the future of their children.
I applaud the author of this thread, as they have opened up a discussion for those who want to contribute and seek a real way to bring about positive change, to which all of those who believe in what is right can benefit by finally finding a way to put an end to the silent tyranny that has enveloped America since the institution of the Federal Reserve (aka the international bankers, aka the Rothschilds, aka the root of all evil`s production company).
To have an open mind is for those who are serious about thinking. I see all of the OP`s ideas and understand completely how each idea takes us to another level of thinking, as we must throw away every aspect we know, of how society is presently run. The overall goal is for a truly free society in which there is no room for deception by those who get rich off the backs and labor of those who struggle to survive.
We need to start somewhere, and we need to keep the ideas flowing. Don`t allow yourself to be held back by those who are afraid of change, by those who will warp your words in an attempt to discredit you.
I have never met a more intelligent group of people in one place as I constantly see here on ATS. But there will always be those who hate, usually out of ignorance and sometimes out of their own selfish desires.
I won`t go on with endless ranting and raving explaining why I am afraid of positive change. I won`t bow to your materialistic level either nor will I seek to use the reverse psychology as you do in your attempt to hide your very own extreme laziness. I seek not to be a product of my environment as you would rather yourself but instead seek to produce a better environment in which all could live. Persons such as yourself would actually need to contribute in a positive way and would never be allowed any hand outs or easy jobs in which you knew some influential person to place you there.
It is obvious to see while reading through this thread that all of your attempts to twist and manipulate the words of others, who only want to bring about a positive change in which all are treated equally and people behold the power to govern, is in itself a prime example of how people have been fooled into positively contributing to their own demise and the future of their children.
I applaud the author of this thread, as they have opened up a discussion for those who want to contribute and seek a real way to bring about positive change, to which all of those who believe in what is right can benefit by finally finding a way to put an end to the silent tyranny that has enveloped America since the institution of the Federal Reserve (aka the international bankers, aka the Rothschilds, aka the root of all evil`s production company).
To have an open mind is for those who are serious about thinking. I see all of the OP`s ideas and understand completely how each idea takes us to another level of thinking, as we must throw away every aspect we know, of how society is presently run. The overall goal is for a truly free society in which there is no room for deception by those who get rich off the backs and labor of those who struggle to survive.
We need to start somewhere, and we need to keep the ideas flowing. Don`t allow yourself to be held back by those who are afraid of change, by those who will warp your words in an attempt to discredit you.
I have never met a more intelligent group of people in one place as I constantly see here on ATS. But there will always be those who hate, usually out of ignorance and sometimes out of their own selfish desires.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 05:35 PM by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by Reality Hurts
Thanks
You're right, of course. I had one too many "C"s. The government has been using the RICO act for all sorts of reasons, many of them political.
Anyway, I agree that the OP's way is not the approach that will work. I understand the frustration though, but we have to find legal, logical ways to beat them at their own game. My concern is that we (and I mean most of the people on ATS) are in a small minority. Most Americans complain, but then sit back on their couches, and watch TV all night. But then again, I don't think it's limited to the US. Maybe some of you from outside the US can comment on this.
Certainly, most Germans during the 1930's sat by while old Adolph led them down the path of destruction. I believe that's what the politcians count on. You know, with the Internet, and with proper protocols and protections, we could have a true democracy, where EVERYONE votes (once of course), at least on issues of importance. That would also eliminate "earmarks" or as we used to call them "pork". Since we are ultimately the people paying for such earmarks, we would hopefully be much more frugal in our spending.
Anyway, good sentiments, and best to you.
Thanks
You're right, of course. I had one too many "C"s. The government has been using the RICO act for all sorts of reasons, many of them political.
Anyway, I agree that the OP's way is not the approach that will work. I understand the frustration though, but we have to find legal, logical ways to beat them at their own game. My concern is that we (and I mean most of the people on ATS) are in a small minority. Most Americans complain, but then sit back on their couches, and watch TV all night. But then again, I don't think it's limited to the US. Maybe some of you from outside the US can comment on this.
Certainly, most Germans during the 1930's sat by while old Adolph led them down the path of destruction. I believe that's what the politcians count on. You know, with the Internet, and with proper protocols and protections, we could have a true democracy, where EVERYONE votes (once of course), at least on issues of importance. That would also eliminate "earmarks" or as we used to call them "pork". Since we are ultimately the people paying for such earmarks, we would hopefully be much more frugal in our spending.
Anyway, good sentiments, and best to you.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 05:42 PM by darcon
reply to post by csulli456
*CLAP* *CLAP* *CLAP* I applaud you my friend, finally the open minded people have show up, to help me defend the O.P.'s ideas, I even gave you a star my friend. We need more people on this thread like you. This society has to Change, or else we will be led to utter Destruction of this world.
*CLAP* *CLAP* *CLAP* I applaud you my friend, finally the open minded people have show up, to help me defend the O.P.'s ideas, I even gave you a star my friend. We need more people on this thread like you. This society has to Change, or else we will be led to utter Destruction of this world.
reply posted on 13-2-2008 @ 07:51 PM by csulli456
Originally posted by darcon
reply to post by csulli456
*CLAP* *CLAP* *CLAP* I applaud you my friend, finally the open minded people have show up, to help me defend the O.P.'s ideas, I even gave you a star my friend. We need more people on this thread like you. This society has to Change, or else we will be led to utter Destruction of this world.
Thanks for the applause and the star.
Also thanks for reminding me, I must give the OP a star for starting this thread.
I agree with you 100%, we need change, very desperately so.
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