The Problem With ATS

reply to post by chissler

There are negatives and unsubstantiated threads. But if the positives didn't outweigh the negatives, we wouldn't be as successful as we are.

You make strong and valid points, and I agree with the general premise of your post.

However, I can't help but ponder: did not the greatness of the U.S. once outweigh the negatives before slow yet constant negative energy was systemically allowed to settle in (and all with very good reasons given by those now derailing this great society) until now the whole thing is just in bad need of an enema. I love my country, and my planet, but right now is not the best time I can remember, if I'm honest about it.

ATS is awesome. I would like for it to remain that way. I think that ATS became awesome because of the quality of intellectual posters who made this a home on the Net, as well as we curiosity seekers who were able to show up and consequently converse with professionals who -- without such a forum -- may never have done so.

And since SO recently announced the million-visitors milestone, that tells me that more of what we both A want and B don't want will be showing up. Problem is, the quality contributors who keep this site above the rest are likely not going to put up with escalating trollism (for what?), while the trolls -- having found fresh prey -- are likely going nowhere without a good reason to.

There's a fine line involved with fixing it, I admit, but some kind of quality-control has got to be implemented, or else the example set by the declining-in-popularity Government may set in (as above, so below), and then what? Will there remain a million+ unique visits, if the fresh, quality material that made ATS what it is becomes uncommon-place, or worse, extinct?

Everyone has the right to the free expression of their position, I deeply believe. And there is a way to do it on a world-class, structured forum, and there are ways which simply do not reflect values already established and respected. I've never been to a Harvard U debate; yet, my first thought regarding one is that arguments are vehemently made without conjecture and unsubstantiated name-calling... conjecture and name-calling are simply not the purpose of a debate.

One problem I see is having a post removed and e-mailing moderator springer 2 seperate times asking for a clarification of WHY this post was removed and not even the common courtesy of an explanation!! Feb 5th was the last message I sent asking for clarification. Moderators SHOULD respond to this type of e-mail asking for SIMPLE CLARIFICATION!! No profanity, no threats! I'll assume he just didn't agree with my opinion even though I read 103 pages of the thread before offering my opinion!! I will assume though that the majority of moderators are good honest people will respond to this simple request when removing a post!! Peace!

there is no problem with ATS. welcome to your existance on
planet earth. your only mission on this planet is to improve your
spirit regardless of the adversity you will face..trudge on young man!!

Sorry if I sound a bit harsh.

But all these complaints.

If I wanted a site to talk to people with exactly the same views as me, then I'd join one.

ATS is about diversity.

Diversity of members, of subject matter, of personalities, of points of view and ways of thinking and perceptions.

If I'm not mistaken, this has been the policy from the word go - over 10 years ago.

Encouragement of not only fact, but also opinion, speculation and imagination.

If you didn't know what it was before you joined, then perhaps this is more the persons fault than the sites fault.

Speaking as one who has had the odd moan (lol) I can honestly say that the system here is as fair as you'll find.

Nice thread.OP! as a newer poster I have seen alot of this,around here.My first post was gonna be in the 9-11 forum but,after reading some of the threads over there,I decided not to even bother going over there.

I think too many people on this thread expect too much from ATS and the ATS community as a whole. We are not a Utopian world/society and therefore neither is ATS.

If you want someone to be empathetic towards you, agreeable and understanding then ATS is not the place because not all of our members are like this and they shouldn’t be if we want ATS to be a continued success.

People want to know the truth and debate conspiracies and the like and I understand when people get a little angry when they have come across a suspected “12 year old” claiming to be an area 51 employee or alien hybrid for the 1000th time. Or if people post claims that are obviously going to cause trouble like the existence or non existence of some divine entity or other topics that are considered a little too close to the heart.

If you have stated something or started a thread and someone is being egotistical or claiming that you are a hoax or stating that you are wasting peoples time etc but still complying with ATS conditions show a little backbone and ignore them or push the ignore button and debate or listen to the members that you find pleasing.

They are just words on a screen on your computer that may be from someone not even from your own city, country or continent. There are 1000’s of members on this site which almost guarantees that you will not get along with someone but once again this is life and the ATS environment already has enough factors to keep people relatively safe and enough options for you to go to if you think you have been wronged.

Yes. I understand. I've been lurking here for years. Only recently joined, and have made maybe three or four posts.

I am very active on other forums, other subjects but can't seem to find my niche here, all seems a bit cliquish, exclusive and frankly abusive if you don't fit in.

That being said, I come here everyday and read and enjoy many posts. I keep promising myself that I will add my two cents, and maybe this is the start of that.

Regards

D

Everyone here at ATS is expecting different things from ATS.

At first, I would get offended easily when someone either proved me wrong or said something I felt was 'personal'. However, I then asked what is MY expectation from ATS? Is it to be right? to have most points? to have all users here know of my knowledge? no.

I am here to hear every interpretation that each person has, on various topics.

As long as I learn something new, I am happy with ATS.

As to the OP who mentioned ATS is ego driven, I think perhaps it's humans, not ATS specifically, that is ego driven. Different egos have different agendas.

I try and send the ego out for a break, especially when I come here.

My suggestion is if you think that statement you are making will invite debunkers, add a question mark at the end. If you ask a question, you're not stating a fact. You're bringing up another point of view. To those who still want to 'debunk' it, let them. The ones who come here to learn might think about said question and start to develop their own theories and ideas.

Some of those theories/ideas can be very interesting.

Thank you.

Ego is an ignorant image of our own self reflection. We tend do forget we're all ONE! Once we understand this, our world will be different!

Originally posted by MuLongQun

I think too many people on this thread expect too much from ATS and the ATS community as a whole. We are not a Utopian world/society and therefore neither is ATS.

Kindness and respect are expecting too much? The debate is welcomed, the heated debate is welcomed, while that is also much more difficult to control. I'm just having trouble, I guess, with rude mud-exchanges for pages at a time, with little-to-no mention even of thread topic, no material presented . . .

. . you're right, I'm probably one of those expecting too much.

reply to post by OptionToChoose


I agree that kindness and respect should be given and received by all through out the world but my point is its not going to happen. Why expect something that is not probable in this day and age and point the blame on ATS (I’m not saying you do by the way) especially when we are discussing such sensitive topics like religion and politics?

We are humans and therefore emotional beings. We cannot elicit kindness and respect all the time. We are a huge community of multi- political, religious, cultural, idealistic opinionated people debating all kinds of things, it’s just not feasible and its not fair that humanistic traits should be blamed on the site owners and mod’s when just about everything has been enacted to provide a safe environment to discuss and debate without stunting the virtual ecosystem at the same time.

I truly understand what you are saying but you have to find a balance between total freedom of speech to having every single thing regulated to the point where there is no use to debating anything at all and I really think that ATS has got it or is damn close.

In the earlier days....
I used to linger on the boards and the startling amount of discussion and debate on the many subjects available was a holy grail of intelligent and enlightening theories.
No other interactive conspiracy website could offer anything close to ATS/BTS and my 'higher' education of the world around me evolved into a passion.
My addiction for knowledge, answers and the truth lead me to pathways I could not have achieved from any other resource.
To me, ATS/BTS/PTS, is a one stop shop in the most beneficial way one could possibly imagine.
A digital think tank of unimaginable resources for knowledge and debate on an international scale should secure a future for our expanding community.for decades to come.
I cannot speak for everyone, but ATS has given me a mental vision like no other could match.
For this I am grateful and richer in knowledge.
Long live ATS and our community!

Originally posted by MuLongQun
reply to post by OptionToChoose
...

I truly understand what you are saying but you have to find a balance between total freedom of speech to having every single thing regulated to the point where there is no use to debating anything at all and I really think that ATS has got it or is damn close.

Pertaining to the finding of balance between total freedom of speech to having every single thing regulated to the point where there is no use to debating anything at all, I couldn't agree with you more.

I count that a good summary of what I apparently have failed up to this point to communicate to some, regarding my opinion of this topic. It's not about policing the hell out of free expression; however, as I understand the matter, people are not allowed to come in here and just say any vile thing they wish, or else we don't need T&C guidelines. Do we need T&C guidelines if they are not to be adhered to?

And if we have T&C guidelines, they should be followed by each and every member. Not most members. All.

What's confusing about this? . . .

reply to post by OptionToChoose


I think the T&Cs could (and perhaps should) be simplified to two rules:

1. Stay on topic!
2. Substantiate anything you post!

reply to post by OptionToChoose


yes----the rules should be followed by each and every member-----although its hard to stay dead on topic all the time---i think some latitude should be allowed there but when some start calling other members idiots or fools etc.-----i just wish the moderators would start immediately with the 1000 point deductions------i don't stick around a thread once the name callers start up----just move on to where they aren't for awhile.

i need 100 ignores available not 10------i'd gladly exchange every point for them just to not see the rudeness.

I have just joined ATS, thanks for setting up this great forum. I am a 911 truther and have taken my share of lumps for my views.It is great to find a site were I can voice my views and not get brickbats upside my coconut. lookinf forward to mixing it up with other members.........Moxee

That is another issue that ATS staff have to think about and that is the large grey area in which if someone should be punished or not for being rude or offensive.
Some people take offence to very little things like being challenged or asking for some evidence. Some people think being called a hoax or a liar is offensive or rude. People challenging religious beliefs or political ideology can be considered rude.
I have seen many times as I’m sure a lot of our community has when members politely state that the OP should go and seek some “professional advise”. For some this would be seen as genuinely looking out for someone where as some would see it as being rude and closed minded.

The problem is where do you draw the line to the point where everybody is happy? I believe there isn’t one.

I think that people should understand that this site can not be tailored to the individual and has to take in the communty's interest as a whole.