Sharia law in UK is 'unavoidable'

Hi All,

Over the past few months there has been an ongoing discussion regarding Islam and one of the issues raised in my previous thread, was the integration of Sharia law into the UK.

Muhammad Thread

Personally i never thought this would happen however now we have the Archbishop of Canterbury stating "Sharia law in UK is 'unavoidable' ".

Sharia law in UK is 'unavoidable'

The Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams says the adoption of Islamic Sharia law in the UK is "unavoidable".
Dr Williams told BBC Radio 4's World at One that the UK has to "face up to the fact" that some of its citizens do not relate to the British legal system.

Dr Williams argues that adopting some aspects of Sharia law would help maintain social cohesion.

For example, Muslims could choose to have marital disputes or financial matters dealt with in a Sharia court.

He says Muslims should not have to choose between "the stark alternatives of cultural loyalty or state loyalty".

Is this a taste of things to come? Whats your personal opinions on the effect this could have on UK culture if implemented?

(Not sure if ive posted in the correct forum so feel free to move it)





[edit on 7/2/08 by Grenade]

Originally posted by Grenade Is this a taste of things to come?

It needn't be, Insha'Alla. It came up in Ontario, Canada, and was on the path towards being recognised when the women's groups...and a whole lot of Muslims who came here to escape it...raised a big fuss. That led to the idea being promptly dismissed. That is not to say that it isn't being practiced in some households and communities, but it doesn't have the force of law or the judiciary.

I would be prepared for a bit of heated debate here.
Every thread I have read on ATS which has mentioned the imposition of Sharia Law in Britain has resulted in passionate discussions where emotions have got very, very high which in turn has resulted in warns and bannings.

I have openly stated my opinions on this topic several times and after this post I will follow the thread but try to limit my participation.
Repeating myself is becoming quite tedious.

My only comment;
The Archbishop Of Canterbury should keep his mouth shut and concentrate on HIS duties in HIS religion.
C Of E attendances are dwindling.
Why?
Partly due to the nonsense this idiot spouts whenever he seems to get an opportunity.

The British people will never allow Sharia Law; their would be Civil War first!
We can not allow individual sections of British society to be governed by a different set of laws as the National Laws.
Once we do it for one we do it for all and then we have chaos.

It's British Law or outlaw!

[edit on 7-2-2008 by Freeborn]

Originally posted by Freeborn
We can not allow individual sections of British society to be governed by a different set of laws as the National Laws.
Once we do it for one we do it for all and then we have chaos.

It's British Law or outlaw!

I will comment that we have some alternate sentencing arrangements that sometimes come into play as regards the aboriginal community. It seems to work out...though someone is charged by the laws of the land, instead of being tossed into the clink because they can't pay the fine, they are dealt with by their peers and elders.

No hands chopped off, so far as I know. But I hear ya...

I hate to bring this to all our friends in the UK specially women remember this are men talking the Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan William has more to gain from women oppression than any other male citizen in the nation.

He has a personal agenda obviously and this will be a fulfillment for his own personal relgious believes.

My honest opinion is, fire his arse off

Personally - I am 1 of many many thousands who would die before
the UK became shira law - Thousands upon thousands
We may be silent now.........................

If they want their Muslim faith soooo much then go to a muslim country.

I am not racist - I have grown up in a mutli ethnic society.
I - like many others don't follow religion only morals.
I am a working father of 4 and over the last 2 years have come to completely detest the word muslim and all it stands for.
Never have i heard people cry over such stupid things like 'teddy bears' and cartoon's and adverts on boards.....

The wind of change is coming and the muslims are gonna get a shock along with the goverment if they thing BRITAIN's are gonna hand there country over to Muslim rule !!
USA - Watch out its coming your way !

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


I assume Canada is where you live by the name, but by the title you give the natives of your land I would think Australia. regardless the point you bring up is VERY different that the idea of Sharia law in the UK. Here in the USA Native Americans have self sovrinity over their lands and to a certain degree their own ways of dealing with things. This makes sense as they are an oppressed nation. They were here first and then we came along and took it from them. So it seem a bit more logical that they would have rights that did not fit perfectly into the box of US laws.

In the case of Sharia law in the UK I would have to say, as an outsider, that it makes little sense. If there is a population of Muslims living their it is by their choice. If they CHOSE to move to the UK regardless of whether or not they like it they chose to accept the "Social Contract" that goes along with living inside a nation.

Now I am not trying t sound rude but maybe the UK could take come lessons from France. I think the population of Muslims in France is well over 25%, I almost want to say it is close to 50%. Although there is a lot of tension created by issues surrounding this community I do believe France has not allowed the creation of alternate laws to appease this portion of it's population.

While many Muslim people leave their nations because they want freedom and opportunity for themselves and their children.

We most understand that is groups also that have a different agenda and that is to spread Islam all over the world.

No also to spread the believes of their icon but become a force big enough by becoming citizens of the targeted nations to influence politics and laws that will benefit and root their core believes.

This is not good for the nations as a whole because it will completely would wipe out the nations integrity, sovereignty and identity.

But remember that this is only possible if the countries rightful citizens allow the take over.

[edit on 7-2-2008 by marg6043]

Originally posted by Freeborn
The British people will never allow Sharia Law; their would be Civil War first!
We can not allow individual sections of British society to be governed by a different set of laws as the National Laws.
Once we do it for one we do it for all and then we have chaos.

It's British Law or outlaw!

well i hate to burst your bubble but european law supersedes british law in many cases nowadays and i didn't see any riots in the streets when this happened. sure some people weren't happy about it but the majority of brits remain ignorant to this fact and probably don't even care besides.

this does bring up an interesting point in regards to a future 'world' government though, in that as there is less and less differences between countries and more borders come down between them, who's laws will win out in the end?

in europe it's pretty straightforward as there are no 'muslim' countries included yet (and is probably a large reason why turkey keeps being turned down for inclusion when many poorer 'christian' eastern european countries were welcomed with open arms). the question needs to be looked at though - if you are going to force all these countries to starting joining together as one entity, where do religious rules stand when they conflict?

Originally posted by Global consciousness


I am not racist - I have grown up in a mutli ethnic society.

I am a working father of 4 and over the last 2 years have come to completely detest the word muslim and all it stands for.

This plain and simple sounds incredibly racist to me.

Never have i heard people cry over such stupid things like 'teddy bears' and cartoon's and adverts on boards.....

This sounds like you are so anti-Muslim you don't even take the time to consider how things are understood in another cultures world view. I did not agree with the reaction of Muslim's to these incidents but as I am compassionate and NOT racist it doe snot degrade their reactions to the level of stupidity.

I just have to say for a person making a claim right at the begining of your post you sure don't SOUND like the person you are claiming to be. I understand anger but I would suggest thinking of other ways to express it. I write this as a person who finds your rhetoric offensive. I have a good friend who is a Muslim from India and I con not stand the way people look at and treat him because of it. If you feel detest it is a personal issue, not anyone else's.

Originally posted by Animal

Originally posted by Global consciousness


I am not racist - I have grown up in a mutli ethnic society.

I am a working father of 4 and over the last 2 years have come to completely detest the word muslim and all it stands for.

This plain and simple sounds incredibly racist to me.

The Islamic religion, like Christianity, encompasses most races.
Hence, it was not a RACIST comment but an Anti-Muslim comment.

Racists dislike other races purely because they are another race.
GC dislikes Muslims because of the teachings, beliefs and actions of Muslims. (I am not saying I agree with him)

There is a massive difference.

Just dig up what the "taliban" did in afganistan before his majesty Bush II got even. Just look at the Paris riots of last summer in areas where french police don't dare patrol.

Someone dig up "robinhood" and clone him..........the UK will need him soon...........

Hold the horse, now Animal, anybody is entitle to their own opinions, I don't find offensive or racist what Global consciousness is saying at least not yet.

And as for Muslim friends my daughter has many, I never has seem such a group of confident young women as the ones my daughter is with, they have Strong family ties, they are highly educated and they are of well to do families.

You have to understand that sometimes is uneducated people out there that really think Islam is taking over and that all muslins are Arabs and they want to conquer the world.

Here in the US we most thank our moronic leaders for that one, after all we are fighting terrorism and we are occupying a land that happens to be in middle east that happen to be mostly Arabs and practice Islam.

So Is a seed that has been planted here and it will bring racist feelings and hate.

[edit on 7-2-2008 by marg6043]

Mus·lim (mzlm, mz-, ms-, ms-)
n.
1. also Mos·lem (mzlm, ms-) A believer in or adherent of Islam.
2. A member of the Nation of Islam; a Black Muslim.

link

Is·lam (s-läm, z-, släm, z-)
n.
1. A monotheistic religion characterized by the acceptance of the doctrine of submission to God and to Muhammad as the chief and last prophet of God.
2.
a. The people or nations that practice Islam; the Muslim world.
b. The civilization developed by the Muslim world.

link

It seems to me that what the poster was referring to was a group of people. Not one so easily identified by skin color or other physical characteristics but a group none the less. Still if I did use the wrong word because "Racist" does not apply, what ever the new word would have to be would essentially be representative of the same thing. And the point I made to that poster still stands.



[edit on 7-2-2008 by Animal]

reply to post by justyc


The European Laws that had an impact on British Society have been modified.
Most European laws are not too dis-similar to British Law so they are not too radical a change.

Sharia Law is completely alien to British Society and is something that a minority of immigrants to this country wish to impose upon the majority.
That will never happen.

Turkey has been repeatedly denied entry into EU due to it's human rights record and probably because the vast majority of Turkey is in Asia and not Europe.

reply to post by marg6043


If you do not see racism, or what ever the appropriate word for it is in this ituation, in

over the last 2 years have come to completely detest the word muslim and all it stands for. (The emphasis is mine)

I wonder what it would take to make you see it.

Originally posted by Animal
I assume Canada is where you live by the name, but by the title you give the natives of your land I would think Australia.

Quick aside to Animal...fact is, different folks like to be called by different things. Some like "First Nations", some like the somewhat anthro-speak "Aboriginal People", some say "Native", some just say "Indian". How it's said is what ultimately matters, eh?

Lots of countries have aboriginal populations...Japan included. Australia has simply chosen that name for their first people.

Originally posted by heliosprime
Just dig up what the "taliban" did in afganistan before his majesty Bush II got even.

Gee...is that a whole lot different from what our good buddies the Saudis are up to. In fact, weren't most of the 911 crew from Saudi Arabia?

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck


Out of curiosity then, are you in fact from Australia? I am aware with the different titles given to these groups but thanks for sharing. I have the pleasure of living amongst the Pueblo's Nations here in New Mexico and of sharing a school within UNM with a group of planners who are interested in Aboriginal Issues so I get a fair bit of exposure.

Animal like I said look what my nation the US has done to sell their war on terror valid to us the citizens, it has instilled a sense of terror to anything Muslim and related to Arabs and Islam.

Just to be able to sell a war.

So to tell you the truth I see the reality and deception been played here, I think you see it too, but I can not blame any person that has fallen for this as guilty.

Unless the person starts calling for the death of all Muslim and to tell you the truth it has been some of that in these threads before, so has not gone that far yet.