A Call for Evidence Disproving Anthropogenic Global Warming , page 1
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reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 09:31 AM by budski
reply to post by Animal



I've posted these links before in other threads, but to save time looking for them here they are;
Inconvenient Truths

What concensus?

What Warming?

Fallacies about GW

What Peer Review?

I'm far more concerned about ACTUAL pollution of our air, rivers, land and sea than I am about alleged AGW.

I've been a member of greenpeace for many years and support REAL environmental issues.

I will not now, or ever buy into al bores political ambitions.

Enjoy your reading


reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 09:53 AM by pyrytyes
Animal:
For your consideration...

I have been halfway following the debate on GW and not a believer in "human"-caused changes. Thank you very much, in advance for not flaming me.

Allow me to present the following graph of ice-core studies from Vostok,Antarctica:
en.wikipedia.org...:Vostok-ice-core-petit.png

As I have stated, I have not read each and every thread on ATS re: GW;
however, in what I have read, the "evidence" presented in favor of human caused GW are graphs and charts similar to this one. The graphs that I refer to have usually shown the most recent studies of ice-cores from various places, however, I have been dismayed at the limited time spans shown in most of these.(I won't revisit the threads to to pull out select graphs to substantiate this claim.)

The graph presented shows times dating to +/- 450,000 years ago. Please note the spikes in temp-CO2-dust. The rises in temperatures have occurred relatively quickly, in comparison to the cooling phases; also note the corresponding values of CO2 and dust.
This is pretty much all the "proof" I need to rule out human caused global warming. The earth is experiencing an interglacial period and entering a cooling phase- the most recent temperature spike having occurred some +/-25,000 years ago.
The cycle continues, regretably, "we" have no control over Mother Nature.



reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 09:56 AM by Animal
reply to post by budski



Thanks for posting.

I will review what you have provided and make comments at a later date. I would much rather remain silent until many have contributed before I make any comments for or against the information provided.


reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 09:58 AM by Animal
reply to post by pyrytyes



The link you provided is broken or incorrect. Just so you know. I will be happy to look at it when it has been changed.


reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 01:39 PM by Long Lance
first off, proving a negative is impossible, but there is conflicting data as well as common sense, which helps a lot, let me start with data:


www.thedailygreen.com...

the question is which to believe?

www.newscientist.com...

www.gsfc.nasa.gov...

www.timesonline.co.uk...

then let me ask you if you think that

*) there have been warmer periods on earth in the past and at least their peaks were much warmer than today's climate

*) there've been colder times, which are, in fact the norm, considering the immense duration of ice ages

*) climate changed in the past and the world did not end, or did it?

in other words, why would this time be any different, no matter the cause?

if all this jazz is nothing new, it begs the question why be upset in a way which apparently justifies anything, including the air tax? which brings me to the core issue: no debate, just coralling people into a scam, which won't do squat for climate, while actually harming the environment, as other aspects (think heavy metals and other toxins, see www.abovetopsecret.com... for an eye opener, which, incidentially was automatically blamed on GW at first) are falling by the wayside, while lining the pockets of people like Al Gore.... the political class only has our best interest at heart, right? that alone should ring a bell, shouldn't it?

www.dailytech.com...

i am quite curious, how effective these 'climate protection' CO2 tax regimes are, because growing fuel while merrily deforesting the Amazon basin (issues, which are, according to the official line, absolutely unconnected anyway ) seems neither logical nor very wise, does it?

PS: if it's a cold spell, it's 'climate change' if it's hot, same. have you ever contemplated what it would take to refute GW? a complete standstill, repeating weather patterns, day after day, year after year. the odds for that are astronomical, so 'GW' or 'CC' can probably considered a safe bet, but science needs to be falsifiable, ie. there needs to be a clearly laid-out way to disprove it. such conditions muct be agreed on, before performing an experiment and i'm certain that all these people now building their lives around shouting Wolf will fight with tenacity to keep their precious scarecrow along with its lush funds.

if i were you i'd memorize certain predictions, be they sea level rise or the disappearance of glaciers, if that does not happen within the cited timeframes.... remember that, so far only alarmist calls of sinking islands have made the news, which, is of course a problem of erosion, not sea level just think of the Hawaii chain, older volcanoes are more eroded and therefore smaller.


edit: i found two more interesting tidbits, casting severe doubt upon the integrity of mainstream sources

www.dailytech.com...

if someone else than NASA had discontinuities in their temperature graphs, they'd ave to retract everything, NASA, of course, 'amends'...


the best for last, as the say:

from: www.abovetopsecret.com...

icecap.us... (.pdf)

in 1990, the number of sensor stations around the world was severly reduced (see .pdf), at the same time, GW was just taking off, and you' expect an increase in funding and a similar increase in the overall number stations, yet the opposite happend. the remaining ones were apparently located closer to urban centers (heat island effect), resulting on a jump in perceived global temperature.

so, it might just be a myth, and why not? with proper planning and enough time, anything goes. it certainly looks extremely suspicous, to say the least and if i were evil, i'd ask how long it takes to indoctrinate a new generation of scientists and get them into position. i would of course add my guesstimate of roughly a decade, maybe slightly more. in that case, they'd be in their peak right now.

ok, now the PS& edits are longer than the original post, d'Uh


[edit on 5.2.2008 by Long Lance]


reply posted on 5-2-2008 @ 01:44 PM by gotrox
How about this?
www.junkscience.com...

This is just the last switch in theories before the current one.
It wasn't until the mid 90's that the current "global warming" theory was finally switched to "Global Climate Change" after a couple of nasty winters shot down the attempt to institue a global tax to cool the planet.
Now, if it is cold or hot in your particular area, it's "bad humans" that are the cause, and only a tax on everyone on the planet (paid to the U.N. BTW) will save us.
Remember "oil for food" in Iraq and child abuse by high officials in Darfur and Somalia? Enough rant on the U.N.

A small bit of research will show this recurring switch between scorched earth and ice ages all the way back to the 1890's in publications about every 25 to 30 years, backed each time by respected scientists with irrefutable evidence.

Search back to writings as far back as the middle ages and you will find references to climate change---but it was because God was mad for some reason or other.

IMHO, the only reason this current cycle of warming/cooling theory is getting so much traction is because someone found a way to make trillions of dollars with it, buying and selling "carbon credits".

As for your requested "proof".
How can anyone prove or disprove a theory that uses both sides of the argument as the basis for the theory?
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