"Let Them Eat Cake!"

reply to post by josephine

Americans are getting fatter because they like to sit around and blame others for their problems and act as they cant do something about it themselves.

I suggest you go back and reread the thread. I have already proven that it is cheaper to eat unhealthy foods. I have also shown that this "laziness" you speak of is really a lack energy induced by the poor quality of foods we have access to. This includes foods that you might think are good for you, such as produce, which is irradiated and therefore stripped of vital nutrients. Then of course you have to look at the variety of other modifications being made to food. This goes far beyond fast food.

So is all of this really the fault of the "lazy Americans" or of the people who are poisoning our food supply with components that make us sick and tired, literally?

Originally posted by annestacey

Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by cbianchi513

 

I personally hate when people victimize themselves and state that these things are being forced on us. They state that there's this huge conspiracy to starve us to deaths with overeating (not possible) but refuse to understand that nobody puts anything in your mouth for you. You pick up the food and eat it. You decide what to eat and how much. Excuses, excuses, excuses

First of all, it certainly is true that people's bodies can be starving even though they are eating plenty of food. Your body becomes starved of real nutrition and becomes obese from the chemicals that in the food.

Yes it's everyone's responsibility to select healthy foods but the food industry actually misleads the public about what's in their products. The label can say 'healthy' or 'natural' and the food is not healthy or natural at all. They hide msg in the food under other names like 'yeast extract', 'spices', etc. (there is a long list of names that are actually nothing more than hidden msg), which doesn't sound dangerous at all.

These chemicals actually 'cause' obesity and the food is providing no nutritional value at all. And any nutrition that MAY be there is destroyed in the microwave. There is SO much evidence now that proves food additives cause obesity so you can't assume that an obese person is just over-eating and being lazy.

Now you've got GMO food that isn't required to be labeled as such, and a new bill in the works that prevents consumers from knowing what's in the milk they drink. People don't know that when they buy packaged meats in the supermarket, that it contains sodium nitrate to make it look red and fresh when it's not fresh at all. Sodium nitrate causes pancreatic cancer.

People see the ads on tv for nutrasweet and splenda and push them with the claim that they have zero calories. But they don't tell you that the ingredients are biowarfare agents and cause neurological damage.

So people can read the labels and try to choose wisely and 'think' they're eating healthy when they're really not. When we have to start educating ourselves on the tricks of the trade to avoid being poisoned, that's when we become victims. Why is it that the FDA allows the food industry to do this? Because they profit from us being sick. It's all about money.

I will repeat my own story here. I suffered from anxiety and depression for 20 years and was on antidepressant medication for 7 years (that turned me into a zombie and almost ruined my career). Once I researched and found out that it was the hidden chemicals causing my depression, I changed my diet to all-organic, replaced all of my personal care products and household products to eco-friendly alternatives and was able to get off the meds. The only time my symptoms temporarily return is when I consume something that contains chemicals. The cause and effect really is that obvious.

Yes, and then if the person learns that the stuff is really bad for them, they've already been brainwashed to trust the government, trust the food industry, because if it was really that harmful that it would be illegal. Then the person trying to warn them is labeled a conspiracy nut.

When I was a kid, I'd see the fast food commercials that advertised their hamburgers as 100% pure beef and think it was healthy. Afterall, if it was bad for me, it wouldn't be pure now would it?

People have been dumbed down in public schools, taught not to question status quo, and to trust those in charge. They are brainwashed. How could they possibly be making informed choices about what they are consuming when their normal human thinking abilities were shut off/down long ago from the time of early childhood?

I eat healthy stuff like salads, yogurt, etc and I'm still fat. I kept gaining more and more weight quickly even though I was exercising. I was going to college and ate a lot of fast food, but didn't realize how bad it was for me until afterwards. Now I eat healthy, exercise, and stay fat anyway. I don't gain anymore, but cannot lose it and been trying for years now.

I've had a theory for a long time now that diabetes is actually caused by the harmful food and that the diabetes helps make you fat and that the fat is a symptom of diabetes instead of being the cause. They tell you the other way around to blame you to cover up what's going on. I was a skinny stick when I first started having problems with my blood sugar and gained weight later. Not much later, but within months afterwards. Since people are usually not tested for blood sugar problems until after symptoms and after they gain the weight, it's easy for the corporate owned medical industry to blame the weight for the disease instead of the disease for the weight.

reply to post by Jessicamsa


Star for you. I very much agree that diabetes is a disease cause by malnutrition, and not weight. Somewhere in here I posted the numbers, but I think it around 20% of people who suffer from diabetes are not overweight. This proves that diabetes is not caused by weight, or the number would have to be much closer to one-hundred percent.

I don't think it was much more than a century and a half ago that life of the average male in london was only twenty five years, the average now is over seventy. Half the little girls born in the UK today are expected to to become centagenarians, and there'a as much fast food available on this side of the atlantic and it's just as popular.
People!!, we live twice the natural human lifespan, why are ye complaining. Food, even McDonalds is better than it ever has been.

My information comes from the "society of actuaries in ireland" and the "irish lontitudinal study on ageing"

[edit on 24-4-2008 by feoil]

People have been dumbed down in public schools, taught not to question status quo, and to trust those in charge. They are brainwashed. How could they possibly be making informed choices about what they are consuming when their normal human thinking abilities were shut off/down long ago from the time of early childhood?

Totally agree. I mean, years ago in secondary school you had in a sense 'health' class and 'physcial education', but yes, you have it, and in most of the states in the United States, it is not required to have 'gym' class everyday. What is up with that. Standarized Testing is becoming such a pressure to the schools to preform, they just cut out gym so they can squeeze more 'information' into students. Studies have proven that gym class can help improve academic preformance. And what fun is it to a kid to get up and play dogeball, its a blast? I was througly disapointed in the education system for that.

We are also taught the 'history by the winners' lessons. I found that high school was such a waste of time, because I already knew more information on history and algebra and trig more than the teachers. It also angers me at the sheer ignoarnce of people.

Then there my biology teacher started talking about evolution.... you can guess what happened. . I literally started a war about freedom of speech act. I personally believe in that, but being the devils advocate that I am, I told her, what about the Isamic students in our class.... I got that part of the biology thrown out the window for future years.

But anyways... a little of topic. But yes, our school system has failed society totally at keeping us heathly. If local and state goverements that could acually function use what little inteligance that they have to throw together a strict diet-exerxcise daily routine, and introduce kids to heathly food and cooking. I bet you rates of kids that are overweigth would decress dramatically.

We ARE starving ourselves practialy to death. Imagine if you liked on stuff like Big Macs and unheahtly fast foods for a week? I know people who do that. Where would all your vitamins and minerals come from. Vitamin A-D are essential to body function.

I am lucky enough to grow up in a family that not nesisarly focuses on heahlty eating, but now I feel blessed that my family made me sit down every evening and have a family dinner. It taught me how to cook, and at how to grow a garden. It is also based upon family morals and values.

For instance, I had many friends, who only saw their parents in car rides! I at least had a family meal where you could acually talk to your parents.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, kids these days are NOT learning how to cook, just throw it in the microwave, or go buy it nice hot and ready at a McDonalds. That is a serious threat to our nations future. I will grow up with the classes under me and utterly helpless to help run the country and they will sit, get fatter, and have to spend it all on healthcare

Some Brainfood for you

reply to post by feoil

People!!, we live twice the natural human lifespan, why are ye complaining.

I'm not willing to go back to your 25-year average lifespan first of all. Second of all, the only reason it got that low in London was from the terrible conditions. Even in ancient times the average lifespan was higher than that.

Food, even McDonalds is better than it ever has been.

And that is completely false, as has been made quite clear already in this thread.

Not to totally refute your arguments, because I agree with them jitb, but it's not quite accurate that good food costs more than eating fake food.

In your OP, you make a comparison with a 'value meal' (what value, certainly not nutritional!) and a much larger quantity of food bought from a supermarket.

Your quantity of bologna (not good for you, get some turkey at 5.99/lb from the deli, get the more expensive stuff if you can because it's better) and cheese would net you a few meals, not just the one, and you'd be able to get some bread out of the deal too, whole wheat to drop some carbs.

So if I buy my turkey at 5.99/lb, and some cheese at 5.99/lb, a loaf of bread for 2 dollars, I can get 4 or 5 sandwiches out of it, no problem. That'd be roughtly 2.35 per sandwich and I could throw in a bottle of water and an apple or something.

It's not a matter of the good food being more expensive, though sometimes it can appear that way, it's a matter of convenience and speed. You actually have to prepare a lunch to take to work with you, plan your week before you go to the grocery store and make sure you get the right foods so you can make yourself a healthy meal.

For a lot of people, that's more effort than they're willing to put in, and I've been there, and I'm still there on a lot of days.

Sometimes it feels like it takes forever to go and prepare the right food, in reality it only takes a few minutes. I guess I feel like I'm going to miss something, somehow. I've gotten better though, I cut down on my trips to fast food places.

And seeing things like this thread, the food shortages, the theories people have put forth about what they are doing to our food, it really makes me even more careful about what I buy and even makes me want to get a garden going (stupid desert).

One thing I can't shake, though, is energy drinks. I'm certain I have grown addicted.

reply to post by Sovereign797


Thanks for posting. I'm glad you fond it interesting and were able to get something out of it.

Let me make a few counterpoints though...

So if I buy my turkey at 5.99/lb, and some cheese at 5.99/lb, a loaf of bread for 2 dollars, I can get 4 or 5 sandwiches out of it, no problem. That'd be roughtly 2.35 per sandwich and I could throw in a bottle of water and an apple or something.

The good deli meats here run eight to ten dollars a pound, and up. Good bread is about four to five bucks per loaf.

But let's get some mediocre stuff along your price line. You forgot to add in the condiment. A jar of mustard or mayo is going to run you another three bucks. Let's say another buck to cover cleanup costs and the sandwhich bags. You're up to $3.40 per sandwhich.

So for the cost of one sandwhich, I can get three items off the dollar menu.

Not to mention the fact that I am already too poor to have a plce to store food. I have no fridge. Also the fact that I am single, precludes the ability to save by buying in bulk or preparing meals too far ahead of time.

For a lot of people, that's more effort than they're willing to put in, and I've been there, and I'm still there on a lot of days.

That lack of effort is intentionally induced through psychological (advertising), chemical (in the foods), and economic (working too hard) means.

One thing I can't shake, though, is energy drinks. I'm certain I have grown addicted.

This is a key symptom of the three factors I mentioned above. Your need for energy is induced by your fears of not having enough time and money, the chemical depression suffered from a lack of proper nutrition, and the complex pyschological factors that stem from those two alone, even without the general social expectations of you or advertising.



All in all though, just do what you can. I honestly don't see a cure to this problem, but perhaps being aware can give us each a few extra years and some peace of mind.

(If this has already been brought up, I apologize. I may have missed the gist of some of the replies as this is a long thread.)

I take exception with the general idea that America is fatter than ever before. Speaking as a fat man (6'4", 320 lbs) I can tell you that when I go shopping it's no easier today to find shirts that fit me in a regular store than it was for my father (I come from a long line of fat men) to find shirts that fit him 30 years ago. I see XL and XXL shirts and the ocassional XXXL shirt and, honestly, they are not that large. One washing generally turns them into skin on a balogna. Just 8 years ago when I was in college, working out everyday, and only weighing in at a trim 230 I still had to go to special stores to find shirts that fit me comfortably.

I do see other fat people for sure, but I baffle at where the percentages we're fed (pun intended) come from because I don't believe I've ever observed an average of more than 1 or 2 out of 5 people being obese in a crowd of people except when I've been in a Big & Tall clothing store or standing in line at Krispy Kreme when the outside sign is lit. When 90% of the clothes they're selling at the department stores are "normal" sizes and upwards of 75% of the people you see on the street are "normal" sized people ("normal" here meaning NOT FAT) I have to question strongly any acertation that we have an obesity "epidemic" running rampant in our society. I believe it is a fabrication and skewing of statistics intended to provide an excuse for the insurance companies to change higher premiums on everyone now that they have pummeled the smoking industry and employers are beginning to include "no smoking" clauses in their insurance coverage packages.

I also believe that the BMI which is used to define this supposed obesity epidemic is bunk. It's a system that uses the same baseline it used 55 years ago when it was created. That baseline wasn't created off of anything scientific about people's weights. Rather it was created after a group of doctors pooled the height and weight data for a number of their patients and came up with a bell curve upon which the median weight for each height was listed as "ideal" and the percentages were used to define each marker along the curve. In 55 years Americans have become taller, we're more muscular thanks to suppliments, home & membership gyms, and better overall nutrition, and thanks to a more complete diet and fewer childhood diseases our bodies are denser than they were in the 50's. We also live in an population that is far older than the population was in the 50's and as people age they naturally become heavier, which taken as a whole has skewed the stats further.

Is obesity a problem? Yes, for people who are obese, it is. I'm not an idiot and I actually do try to watch what I eat, avoiding fast food and junk food. So please don't take this as an example of a fatass trying to make excuses or make it seem like he isn't "that fat." If anything I'm trying to say fat people like myself are the minority in this country... the exception rather than the rule. If you honestly question that, just go to the mall on any given weekend and watch how many more fit and trim teens and young adults you see running around versus the much lower number of fat people. I don't believe that we're just not seeing the fat folks because they're all sequestering themselves inside their homes, self concious and afraid to come outside.

reply to post by burdman30ott6


Interesting observation.

I too have trouble finding clothing. Really, there is only one store I can go to. I buy a $30 t-shirt that everyone else can pick up at Wal-Mart for five bucks or less. A pair of undershorts for $25, when you can pick up a pack of three at K-mart for seven bucks.

And I am not what might be considered morbidly obese. I'm a big guy, but I can still run, was physically active in my job, etc.

Here are the obesity statistics. Perhaps some people are not as aware of the problem due to their location. It is also important to point out that, seemingly ironically, obesity is a greater problem in poorer areas of the country. Mississippi, Alabama, and West Virginia are ripe with poverty, yet are the fattest people.



[edit on 4/27/0808 by jackinthebox]

Originally posted by josephine
Everybody in America knows that fast food is bad for you, and everybody knows excercise is very good for you. Americans do too much of the first, and not much of the latter. People in America are overweight because they have no will power.

Its actually cheap to eat healthy, but not as tasty as a big mac. Some healthy cheap foods - oatmeal, rice, beans, potatoes, bread, chicken. But to most Americans, these foods are too bland for them.

Americans are getting fatter because they like to sit around and blame others for their problems and act as they cant do something about it themselves.

I am not really a poster on this sight as of yet... I just like to read most of the time and I really enjoy this thread.

I am replying to you in particular because you said that chicken was inexpensive, however chicken is not cheap. It is far more expensive than beef.....

As I keep reading some people are missing the point. Jackbox said that we are starving to death via lack of nutrition and I have noticed that this has turned into a "people are fat because....". Just because someone is overweight does not mean that they are less healthy than a skinny person. Secondly, I have to agree with whomever said that fast food causes depression.. not just fast food but all this junk food in general .. we feed on all this sugar, gives us a nice high and then we go into a crashing hault... its inevitable that we are going to end up feeling blue.

It's kind of like diets, people always tell us what we can't eat, but they never say here is what you can eat.. and if there is a slight chance they do, the items they tell us are a)too expensive b) not really healthy (for example the diet tv dinners are loaded with sodium) or c) not really the item anymore (is it just me or do apples not look or taste like apples, and yes I agree with Jackbox, meat is now rubbery ick that I don't even want to waste my limited funds on). So, I guess that is why, imo, we eat fast food or poorly, it's cheaper and more convenient. I mean, why bother spending more money on the so called healthier items when they provide us no better means of nutrition than the latter?

I really have enjoyed this thread Jackinthebox.

[edit on 29-4-2008 by galatea]

reply to post by galatea


Glad you've enjoyed!

It seems that you seem to have divined the truth that I was getting at, despite the many people who have reverted back to the misconceptions that are deliberately perpetuated in our media and through our government. The whole idea is to keep blaming the fat people for being fat, becasue as long as everyone does that, they won't realize that all Americans are being deliberately starved to death. They will continue to think that the skinny person who has diabetes and dies of a heart-attack is just a fluke. That the reason no one seems to have as much energy as they used to is becasue they are getting older. On and on. All the excuses we are told, without ever admitting the truth. And even here, when I have put it right out front, some people still refuse to see it.



[edit on 4/29/0808 by jackinthebox]

to agree with whoever said that eating healthy food keeps you fuller longer...as a snack 1/2 hour ago, i had a packet of minees (kinda like oreos)
MINEES (35g per pack)
Total fat-7g (11% DI)
Sat. fat-3g (15%DI)
Soduim-90mg (4% DI)
and to top it all off, 0% vitamin a, vitamin c, calcium or iron.
170 calories and 60 calories from fat.
after that, i was just as hungry as i had been before, so i did what i should have done to start with, and ate a banana and had a glass of water.


whoever said that kids only eat proccessed food/junk food and drink soda at school, you are mostly correct.
i still go to school and have only seen someone eating fruit twice all year, and a salad sandwich (or something healthy like that) once.

as for me, i dont eat very much, and consume most of my food at home.
when i do (rarely) eat at school, it is usually a packet of chips/crisps or lollies shared with my friends. if i dont want to/feel like eating, i will have a lolly pop or a piece of bubble gum at lunch time.
i know i dont have the best eating habits....but i eat healthily at home!

just wondering on other peoples opinions, is my way of eating (healthy-ish, regular, meals at home and unhealthy, infrequent snacks at school) better or worse than the kids eating vast amounts of junk foods, all the time?

reply to post by sticksandstones


I'll tell you what I remember most about eating at school. If you were the kid with the latest and most unhealthy snack item, you were also the coolest. If you were the kid that brought in a piece of fruit, you were treated as a fruit, and outcast. The few kids who did bring fruit actually had their snack stolen and smashed into the ground while others taunted them, and laughed at them for not having cheezy-crackers and fruity-gummies.

This was the same in all grades, right up through high school. You were judged by what you ate, the way adults are judged by what they drive.

So, thanks to this thread, I have become a little more observant with foods, prices, etc.

One MAJOR thing I've noticed or maybe I question.. is GROUND BEEF........ ummmmm... the crap I had to buy the other day is NOT ground beef, at least not ground beef as I know it. I have made sure to buy the kind that is still in suran wrap, usually there is only one at the store the others look more like they are in tupperware. But alas, on my grocery shopping day it was not available.. so I had to get the tupperware ground beef.. and I cooked it tonight.. and it is HORRIBLE. ewww. YUCK.

sorry just had to come gripe about my obviously modified ground beef.

reply to post by galatea


Agreed. I'm not sure if I talked about it here in this thread or not, but I have noticed the same thing with ground beef. I saw those white plastic tubs of ground beef for the first time in Wal-Mart. I bought it, and never bought fresh meat at WalMart again after cooking and tasting it.

My local supermarket began selling it within the last year, but I still went for the traditional packaging on the styrofoam tray in plastic wrap. In the past few weeks I have noticed that there is very little of it placed on the shelf now. I expect it won't be available at all by the end of Summer.

The obvious difference in taste is quite alarming. Even if "they" were trying to pump more of these substitute food-like products at us, you would think they could at least try to make the transition less obvious. Just goes to show how terrible this stuff really is when they can't even cover it up anymore.

They were more successful with the produce. No one ever really noticed the change. Take the tomato for example. Most people think that what you get in the supermarket is what it is supposed to taste like, and that the fresh garden variety are some gourmet item. But in reality what you get in the garden is actually what a tomato is supposed to be. I can remember when a cheap tomato at the supermarket was just about that good.

There was a girlfriend of mine who told me she didn't like tomatos. I made her taste a fresh one from a friends garden and she loved it. She couldn't understand how the taste and texture were so different. The garden tomat was nothing special, just a regular old variety. Which only goes to show how terrible the stuff in the supermarket is these days. If it tastes that bad, it is that bad. You might as well be eating cardboard.

EDIT to add: The stiff in the plastic tubs is indeed mass produced, modified, etc., coming in from who knows where. The "good" stuff still came from a real mass-produced stock, but at least it was processed fresh in the store by a butcher. Of course, I can remember a time when a local rancher had his own butcher shops dotted around the county. Beef and pork mostly. Now that was the really good stuff. They have since turned that farm into a McMansion community.


[edit on 5/24/0808 by jackinthebox]

The beauty of being a kid is that they can eat some crap and if they are a normally active, healthy kid with plenty of energy to burn then any extra sugar and fat is used up instantly. An oreo cakester is a lot less bad for you when you have oatmeal for breakfast and a decent dinner that includes something that grows out of the ground besides a potato.

It is simply amazing how many veggies can be hidden in spaghetti sauce or chicken casserole with cheese sauce with the creative use of a blender!!!


My son was underweight at about age 2, and guess what his doctor recommended...Natural or homemade Ice cream for dessert a few times a week to help him fill out some. Homemade vanilla ice cream might be the best tasting stuff on the planet and has 4 ingredients..cream, milk, sugar and vanilla bean and well its better to eat all of those whole ingredients than to eat cheapo store brand ice cream with a bunch of stuff I cant pronounce or identify even if it is low fat or sugar free.

But I believe that is the key to this whole issue, its not about fat or sugar or carbs, its about the high levels of processing and chemical additives AND about portion control...our stomachs are the size of our fist, give or take a bit.

Everytime I hear a parent or a waitress tell the kids to make a happy plate I cringe. NO NO NOEncourage them to try new foods and make healthy choices, or make the choices for them..after all you are the parent! and I think its a good idea leave a few bites of everything! it adds up over time, Its important to learn to eat until you are full but not miserable, and eat because your body needs fuel not because your sad or you need something for your hands to do.

Just found this post over her in this thread...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by raven bombshell
reply to post by jackinthebox

 

When i lived in Germany I ate all kinds of lard-fried meats and cheeses and sweets daily. Their cheescakes weigh about 20 lbs, and they eat lard on thier toast. Their salads always had mayo.I ate sausage and snitzel (lard fried pork steak). I think I stayed around 118 lbs when I was there, and once I got back to the States, ate plenty of broiled or grilled chicken and fresh salads with fat-free dressing I started gaining. I was more active once I came back, too. There is definately something in our food here that helps people stay obese.

Originally posted by annestacey
Add in the fact that the food industries add chemicals to the food to make them 'taste' better which also cause obesity and many other illnesses that result in people being put on prescription drugs, which now benefits big pharma. This scam is much bigger than most people know.

I've also heard that they put chemicals in there food that make people become addicted to certain foods.