This is tragic. It's embarrassing but Canada and the US have failed miserably in assistance to Haiti... same with the UN or as I like to call them the "UN" as in NOT.

Geophagy in Haiti is cultural to certain extent having a fairly long history in the Port Au' ghettos... worse in the hills. Unfortunately mud pies and cookies have been around for a while. I'm not joking. CBC did a whole piece on it back in May-ish '07. Same with Nigeria 'cept there it's a clay. The biggies in geophagy are Dr. Ray Ferrell at LSU and a Dr. Lowry... sorry, can't remember his first name. I think has was a Brit'.

My sister used to eat dirt, earthworms and all. She wasn't hurtin' for lard. Gross. She grew out of it. Lowry's research is very interesting. Dirt taken orally has some bizzaro beneficial health properties. The Missus' is out, I think there may be some radio clips online from the feature. I'll ask if she can remember for me.

This is like so sad. For the price of a week's worth of human warring... well the mind boggles.

Vic

[edit on 29-1-2008 by V Kaminski]

Geophagy (or dirt eating) has been practiced from the time humans started putting things in their mouths. Although you can survive on the nutrients contained in soil and clay it is not a good way to go about things. Being forced to endure such degradation in this day and age is inexcusable. We really dropped the ball on that one and should make amends pronto. The fact that starvation exists at all in this modern world of ours is disgusting to say the least. Just a fraction of the money allocated for human destruction would feed the world many times over. Humans...bleh!

Originally posted by Bunch
Still I think that the U.S. should take care of the people in their own backyard. How many times the U.S. has invaded Haiti for one reason or another? 2 or 3 now, and everytime they leave is worst than before.

The U.S. should step up as world superpower and lead by example, not the Iraq example mind you.

So we should spend our citizen's tax money on people who can't support themselves due to infrastructure and directly contribute to their further suffering by creating artificially sustained overpopulation?

Originally posted by Mil Spec
Although you can survive on the nutrients contained in soil and clay it is not a good way to go about things. Being forced to endure such degradation in this day and age is inexcusable. We really dropped the ball on that one and should make amends pronto. The fact that starvation exists at all in this modern world of ours is disgusting to say the least.

Our modern world? This is nature - and contrary to the belief of some spoiled, guilty middle/upper class people who have never been forced to fight for their mere survival (and I fit that), it still must be done. Not everyone is as lucky as us - and that's life. Nothing we humans do can fix it, aside from furthering technology as we are. Certain forms of charity even make it worse in the long run.

Complain to God for making the world so harsh, not fellow humans for not doing enough. If you want to do a lot, get a degree in engineering and science and work.

[edit on 29-1-2008 by Johnmike]

Using the Irish potato famine as proof of some Malthusian population crash is incorrect, and supports the government corruption and ineptitude theory instead.

It's possible those poor starving Irish enjoyed seeing boats filled with food being shipped off to the English land owners. A situation that bordered on genocide.

The Haiti situation is a failure of local Government, and one it obviously cannot correct. Since the sole purpose of the UN is to help rectify situations beyond the ability of local governments to control, the UN is a failure as well.

But hey, it's easy to say let them eat dirt (while being well fed in Ohio, oh god the 3rd world situations there, well Cleveland aside) like some aristocratic English prick from the 18th century.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
I don't really follow the whole social darwinism concept of 'survival of the fittest.'

I'm not sure how this relates exactly, but since it's addressed toward me, I guess it's fitting to say that I don't follow that belief.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
A lot of Africa's problems root from the West's intervention. We destroyed ancient trade routes that connected southern Africa with Japan when we carved the continent up between us (being Europe).

The existing empires were either conquered and destroyed or assimilated into 'western' culture.

I am not blaming all of Africa's problem on European intervention, but we need to take credit where credit is due.

That "us" doesn't include me if you want to imply that, especially due to my lack of roots in that and firm belief in noninterventionism.

I have no idea what Africa has to do with this really.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
Should we sit back and watch the world self-destruct? Or do educate people on how to treat the land properly and to increase yields year after year.

Education is great, as is leading by example. I'm a firm supporter of that form of charity - a "teaching a man to fish" sort of thing.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
They have lost contact with their history and now feel like worthless pieces of meat. Can you blame them?

Absolutely irrelevant, but I guess you can't? I'm not expert.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
I wonder how different the world would be if Africans invaded Europe and made all white people slaves.

Huh?

1) Slavery was not an exclusively race-based concept and no, nothing near all or most or half or anything of black people was made slaves.

2) Slavery was not introduced by Europeans. Do you really think that a few dozen slave traders on a big ship rounded up hundreds and thousands of slaves?

If you do, then there's a serious problem. Slave traders were just that - traders. They bought them. From who? Other Africans. It doesn't make it any less wrong on anyone's part, but it's important that you get that part of history correct.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
What needs to be done? Education. Plain and simple. Propping up other countries with food and cash is not the answer as has been proven by history.

We seem to agree here.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
We also need to stop intervening in other cultures and disrupting the 'native' way of life.

And here.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
That means LEAVING every country we are occupying, whether industrially or militarily.

I'm not sure what you mean by "industrially." Free trade is beneficial to everyone, but it's just as dangerous as an undeveloped country's secluded socialism if the government is idiotic and corrupt.

Originally posted by biggie smalls
The world needs a chance to progress on its own without Western support. We've done enough and now its time to let everyone do their own thing.

That's what I say about the military and "sustenance charity." I'm just afraid of people closing borders to trade and technology.

the haitian situation is much larger than some banana republic king
skimming the money at the expense of his citizens. there is only one
reason cubans are allowed the "one foot" rule and haitians are forcefully
sent back to poverty. beginning in the 17th. century, a caste system was
created that kept plantation owners (french) at the top, mulattos in the middle and blacks at the bottom. the caste system has lasted to this
day in most of central, south america and the caribbean. there are
several here i bow to, and a few of which i feel disgust.

we can talk all this "galactic federation" crap til dooms day but until we
treat fellow humans like humans, we will never be allowed in.

before someone else chimes in that "it's their fault" and "they steal
the supplies before they reach the public", excuses are a dime a dozen.

you are directly affecting the direction of your soul's travel and you
are being watched......tsk. tsk. tsk.

BIG UPS BIGGIE SMALLS!!!!!

[edit on 29-1-2008 by last time here]

[edit on 29-1-2008 by last time here]

Originally posted by kameuh
Using the Irish potato famine as proof of some Malthusian population crash is incorrect, and supports the government corruption and ineptitude theory instead.

It's possible those poor starving Irish enjoyed seeing boats filled with food being shipped off to the English land owners. A situation that bordered on genocide.

The Haiti situation is a failure of local Government, and one it obviously cannot correct. Since the sole purpose of the UN is to help rectify situations beyond the ability of local governments to control, the UN is a failure as well.

But hey, it's easy to say let them eat dirt (while being well fed in Ohio, oh god the 3rd world situations there, well Cleveland aside) like some aristocratic English prick from the 18th century.

Absolutely.. though it was also the Irish who did this as well (many land owners in the Western country where of Irish decent, not English, and they shipped their supplies else where) .. It was for the most part the firm belief in the Free Market.. that the market would stabalize its self.. once food kitchens where established and the Tory's where kicked out of office by the Whigs, the kitchens where stopped, even though the Whigs where the ones supporting the Irish.

But aside from the political aspect of it.. the Irish Potato Famine showed the world a few key things that we did not learn from history.

1. The potato, unlike popular belief, is NOT Irish by any means, it was American shipped to Ireland to plant.. in fact the Blight hat killed off the crops where from Peru I believe, bought from American ports in New York used as Seed Potatoes (instead of using their own saved from previous harvest) .. that brought in the fungus from South America that killed the crops. Basically.. the Potato being an alien food source replaced the Irish diet. The plant thrives in Ireland, but had no place there to begin with. And what came with the potato?

2. Bringing in outside food sources increases population where the population was for the most part stagnet or slowly rising. The potato could nourish 100x better then wheats, porks, beefs and sea food... easy to grow in Ireland, it was the food of the poor man.. so a family who could have 6 children and have 3 or 4 die off could now with the potato have 12 kids with maybe 2 or 3 dieing off... because the potato supported the increased population.

3. To support the increased population that came with the new food, it would have to become a staple crop as well as a cash crop.. when a Blight hit the fields that was all they grew.. while grain supplies where shipped over seas due to free market price rising for the goods.. (the same blight hit America as well, in fact first, but America was never Dependant on the crop) ..

So what does this show us?

Take a plant out of its eco system and put it into another...

The plant supports far more life per square mile then old harvest did.. giving rise to increased population.

When populations exceed what the land could bare, and one crop fails, the result is 1.5 million starving in a matter of years, millions more fleeing the country. As I said, the population never recovered. Not in 200 years. Of course there are a number of reasons why, mostly political, Ireland went from the densest populated country in the early 1800's to its normal state.

So I think their situation is a perfect example of what to and what not to do. We can ship food all over the world, but we simply keep people alive, a poor existance at that.. imo, its best to let them die off, and return to what nature intends.

This is a perfect example of where Cannibalism should come into effect.

I mean really, if you are to the point where you have to eat cookies made of dirt, or mud from the ground, you are going to die.

So what is it then, you dieing, or that .. disabled or older, slower person over there? Go kill him and cook him up. Share the meat with your family.

I really think Haitians should be eating each other.. it would solve population control as well.