Guns, what good are they....?, page 8

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 05:34 AM

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reply to post by TheWalkingFox

What about over hunting…..I’m sure that accurse, I mean it’s not like you can keep check on the deer population……that’s where farms come in, they have a system that provides a regular supply…..no fear of over kill, everything’s maintained……

verylowfrequency

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 06:25 AM

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Originally posted by andre18

1)You've made some good points.....but have yet to really address why the public can benefit from machineguns and shotguns etc, compared to a standard handgun..

2)I mean jeez….you’ve got kids and adults walking around in the middle east with AKA’s in the streets like it’s a bloody fashion……

3)Honestly do you think Americans have the right to carry guns in public areas..? Or is there a law stating you may only possess them in homes….

1)We have limited our weapons to semi-automatic & small clips too limit mass carnage reverse-rambo type events by psychopaths. You'd have to be grandfathered in to have a fully automatic weapon license or be ex-military squeaky clean & mentally fit enough to work for the FBI.

Either that or extremely wealthy - and extremely wealthy folks for the most part don't commit weapons related crimes , because they have too much to lose & they don't have the mental hang-ups that the mass carnage shooters with the little man mentality's have.

2)Middle East is a war zone - thus you have war weapons. If you lived there and foreign guys we're kicking in your door telling you how it is and raping your girls what would you do? Get it?

3)Some public areas we can & some we can't it's a constant battle that changes all the time. I don't have a problem with law abiding citizens or cops carrying weapons in some public areas, because they help limit the crime rate. We don't allow them in most crowded venues like sports stadiums or other high mental stress areas like court rooms where there is armed security present for everyones benefit. It's far from perfect, but it keeps us free for the moment.

Our government has begun to realize that they are beginning to cross the line with some of those who are on the edge already, thus guns are not allowed in government buildings in order to protect themselves.

Our guns in America are sort of our last stand. As long as we have them we keep the system in check. Without them we could not keep greed in check and eventually it will spiral out of control.

So, we put up with the unfortunate carnage of a few for the greater good of the many.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by verylowfrequency]

ibgrimme

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 06:30 AM

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!. Protection against those who, unfortunately in this world, would kill you and your family for a nickel.

2. Protection against tyranny by those who feel you would be better off with less rights.

God bless the NRA

entropy

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 06:48 AM

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andre18

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 06:53 AM

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We have limited our weapons to semi-automatic

How does that make any difference......you can still go on a killing spree with a handgun or with semi-automatics......My point with all this...is why Americans feel the need to own shotgun, or semi-automatics, if the main reason for the possessing them is to defend yourselves from people breaking into you home, or the government becoming to over powering...

It makes no sense what so ever.....that someone would need, not want but need a semi-automatic gun, when they can use a less lethal weapon like a hand gun.....

Some public areas we can & some we can't it's a constant battle that changes all the time. I don't have a problem with law abiding citizens or cops carrying weapons in some public areas, because they help limit the crime rate. We don't allow them in most crowded venues like sports stadiums where there is armed security present. It's far from perfect, but it keeps us free for the moment.

So you could walk into a cafe knowing there's a chance someone there might have a gun and that doesn't worry you what so ever...? Some guy gets angry for what ever reason....a fight starts......and then one of them pulls out a gun and shots are fired.....

a83.ac-images.myspacecdn.com...

WTF.....what can't a handgun do those other guns can....

[edit on 31-1-2008 by andre18]

orangetom1999

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 06:54 AM

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Andre 18,

Andre..you keep getting it backwards. I can see how you have difficulty with us Yanks and the way/manner in which many of us think,

ok so basically you’re talking about how in America you have the privilege to own private property…..right….? I’m not sure I get this…….I mean, everyone has private property….anyone can just buy a house where legally no one else is allowed to enter because you own it…..something like that……..you own it …it’s yours etc…

Here in America it is a "right" to own private property..not a privelege. There is a huge gulf at law between rights and priveleges. Americans understand this. It appears that non Americans do not.
Oh....you do understand that our guns are also private property ..yes???

I’m having a hard time understanding what this means…..call me ignorant if you want… and in that case you might as well educate me on this kind of stuff because when you say something like “When someone takes my property’s from my possession and control they force me to take risks twice or more to re earn the property’s” I draw a blank………

No problem here ...let me explain. I was in a nuclear reactor last night for 12 hours. I will be going back into the same reactor tonight. This means I take certain risks for my moneys. Do you understand this concept..risk...danger? I earn my moneys by taking certain risks. IF someone takes my propertys..money is property...to replace the same I must risk over again ..twice to earn what I risked the first time. IF I am able to defend my propertys/moneys I may not have to risk twice...or more..understand.
I speak not only of myself taking risks for my moneys/propertys earned and owned by my risks...but also others..farmers, Cab drivers, firemen, nurses..et al. All take some kind of risks for thier moneys. They did not get if free. The reason most people turn to crime is that it is easier and less risky than what I do for a living...that is until they meet up with the likes of us.

This does not make good nonsense.” not really, are you talking about when someone breaks in and enters your home, your proverty….?

No I am talking about disarming everyone but those who have no intention of obeying the law. To do so ..disarm us makes us less valuable and our risks taken for earning our propertys less. To disarm us makes us less than the criminal element...in criminal element I also include government and government people. They just criminalized by what appears to be law. This doesnt make good nonsense when you think it through. It is quite obvious to me that the consabularly is not here to protect us and our propertys. We are not high on their priority list.

In doing so you overlook the serious risks/dangers that ordinary people take in earning their property’s/moneys earned.” So….do you mean people need guns because of the dangers they take in what they do for jobs for what they do when they work……defending their home helps them make money….is that it….?

No you missed it again..see above response to the your previous inquiry. Once again you seem to have difficulty with the concept of people taking risks to earn their moneys and the propertys they purchase with their moneys. Moneys are property...just as is propertys purchased with said moneys. Remember the concept of risk. Very important.

the ability to protect said property.” yeah I guess we have the same thing here, America is no different as you believe it to be……say farmers need to protect their property, their sheep from dingo’s, wild dogs’ etc…. they have fences and probably guns as well here in Australia…firstly that’s in remote areas not in large city environments…..secondly, I’d be willing to put down this part of the argument on gun ownership, if only people in such remote areas needed them so badly, I suppose I can see the need for people to need guns for such a purpose…….but when you’re talking about guns in cities…..that’s two completely different seniors……

I dont think again you understand the concept of risk...you do understand dont you that there is often much more and a different kind of "wildlife" in the citys?? You do understand the concept of two legged very feral wildlife existing in the cities yes??

Let me illustrate for you another point Andre18. In my back pocket currently there is a set of lockpicks. These are purchased though I also know how to make several kinds on a bench grinder. Also among these lockpicks is a set of shims for opening certain kinds of locks.

I dont use them to enter other peoples homes or cars and help myself to their goods or propertys. I dont do this for the above reasons mentioned ..risk. I know that other peoples like me take risks for thier moneys/propertys.

Another point you have made...about the military. The military budget here in this country is not the big ticket item in the Governments expenditures. Social programs and give aways are the big ticket item in the budget. It is the same in your country. Obviously the same in England.
Strange to me how few people know this but assume.

I know what you mean about the military being useless and worthless. I agree..we should never have sent the military to the tsunami areas in the Pacific a couple of years back. We should have sent no one or nothing. This is not a job for our military which should be shut down. I am sure private doctors and private institutions would gladly give up their profit and take up the tsunami survivors!!!

Orangetom

MMPI2

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:01 AM
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I just wanted to interject a few points here, even though its probably already been said several times much more eloquently:

A person who's in the mood to kill a bunch of people are probably not gonna want to use a firearm. They're gonna use another method. Witness 9/11, Jim Jones, 5 gallons of gas.

With regards to the last two, Jim Jones was able to effectively kill about a thousand people with 50 bucks worth of kool aid and rat poison. Similarly, one of the biggest single causes of mass death in NYC was some idiot who killed about 80 people in a nightclub by burning the joint down around them with a book of matches and 2 or 3 dollars worth of unleaded.

We seem to focus on the evil of firearms, primarily because the media points us in that direction. I never really hear them talk about Joe Citizen that defends his home, family and property with his revolver.

With that being said, I'll paraphrase...."ONLY FROM MY COLD, DEAD HANDS!"

thisguyrighthere

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:03 AM
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I can't believe this stupid thread has made it to 8 pages. Christ already. Everyone keeps repeating the same damn things over and over just to get some 14 year old in Australia to stop repeating his same line over and over.

What a waste of space.

imysbbad

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:11 AM
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You have a right to protect yourself and in this day and time, you better have a gun. If criminals knew you were against guns, they would not be worried about breaking into your home. Criminals fear victims holding a gun, not holding a phone...... I own guns because a bunch of old , dead people said I should!

andre18

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:11 AM
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I know what you mean about the military being useless and worthless. I agree..we should never have sent the military to the tsunami areas in the Pacific a couple of years back. We should have sent no one or nothing. This is not a job for our military which should be shut down. I am sure private doctors and private institutions would gladly give up their profit and take up the tsunami survivors!!!

Ok...so I basically understand what you're saying......but when it comes to things like the tsunami disaster.....you don't send people with guns to such places.....you send food aid, doctors, builders, etc anyone but people who specializes in the art of killing.......who know how to kill someone like it's second nature.....Just tell me how such people can help such a disaster...

verylowfrequency

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:26 AM
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Originally posted by andre18

WTF.....what can't a handgun do those other guns can....

Shorter range - limited shots - less overall firepower - less possible carnage in most situations. Advantage is easy to carry & conceal.

We have them & you don't - thus your choices are more limited when it comes to control & destiny.

It's like this mate. I promise to leave your world alone & not bring any guns over or shoot you if you'll only promise to leave my world alone.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by verylowfrequency]

lunchboxjunkie

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:30 AM
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SHUT THE F&*k UP ALREADY!!! HOLY HELL

imysbbad

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:31 AM
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Let us not forget to mention that guns also save lives!

C0le

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:32 AM
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Originally posted by andre18
in America you have the privilege to own private property…..right….?

Wrong.

In America we have the RIGHT to own private property, Government doesn't ALLOW us to own it, they protect our RIGHT to own it,

Rights and privilege's are not the same, in America we are Free our Governments job isn't to dictate to us what we can and cannot Do, Own, Say, or Believe, there purpose is to protect rights, not give them to us.

Government doesn't have that authority.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by C0le]

andre18

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:34 AM
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reply to post by verylowfrequency

The list was muggers, burglars and the government….you can simply use a handgun against a person who’s about to mug you and someone’s who’s trying to break into your house….when it comes to the government……lol, that’s like saying….in case aliens from out of space attack us……

"thisguyrighthere"

I'm 18 hence Andre(18)......so don't think I'm some child

[edit on 31-1-2008 by andre18]

C0le

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:46 AM
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Originally posted by andre18
You're telling me you can't kill a deer with a hand gun.....the only reason shotguns and such are used is because they are more effective, but that's hardly means you still can't easily kill a bear or a shark or any other animal with a handgun.....lol

Tell ya what man, you get yourself here to the states and we will go hunting with handguns, lets see how well you do in thick brush at 100yards even with a magnum caliber handgun...

First you'll be lucky to hit that deer through the thick brush, second you'll be luck to hit it without wounding it and putting it in extreme misery, assuming that PISTOL round is even able able to penetrate at that distance...

thisguyrighthere

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:46 AM
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Originally posted by andre18
I'm 18 hence Andre(18)......so don't think I'm some child
[edit on 31-1-2008 by andre18]

Could've fooled me.

Not that being 18 makes you any less of a child than being 14.

People should hold off on opinions at least until they've had a few kids and a mortgage.

No dating till 16! No opinions till 45!

[edit on 31-1-2008 by thisguyrighthere]

andre18

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:48 AM
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reply to post by C0le

Good point.....I didn't think of that....but....

Let’s say the world one day is in a state of world peace, what will be the point of guns…? The need for guns to defend yourself means there will always be someone you need to defend yourself against, this mentality that you will always need to protect yourself means you will always think there is some against you…..this is an illusion and complete BS paranoia that makes you think that there is always someone out there to get you, all this creates fear and distrust.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by andre18]

C0le

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 07:56 AM
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Originally posted by andre18
reply to post by photobug

Scenario: 1 Person breaks into a house with no gun (A), the person living there has no gun. (B)

Most of the time a burglar will only rob an empty house, if someone suddenly turns the light on and appears to be there, they’ll usually escape quickly…or, stab the person…..in this case…..a stun gun could have been used instead of having nothing to defend themselves……also a stun gun won’t kill the person…..a handgun, shotgun etc will..

Scenario: 2, Person breaks into a house with a gun, the person living there has no gun.

In this case person B defending themselves with a stun gun would have been more beneficial as well compared to not having anything.

Scenario: 3 Person breaks into a house with a gun, the person living there has a gun.

In this case both persons would shoot at each other, killing either person…..If person B had a stun gun, it would be the same result only person A would be stunned instead of dead…..

Scenario: 4 Person breaks into a house with no gun, the person living there has a gun.

In this case person B would kill person A, but if person B had a stun gun, person A would still be alive and would just be paralyzed for a few minutes……

And so…..a stun gun…..simply solves the defending you home scenario….no need for handguns machine guns shotguns etc.

[edit on 31-1-2008 by andre18]

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C0le

posted on Jan, 31 2008 @ 08:04 AM
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Originally posted by andre18
reply to post by C0le

Good point.....I didn't think of that....but....

Let’s say the world one day is in a state of world peace, what will be the point of guns…?

Peace never lasts, should it come with things as always people will become complacent, evil people exist regardless of how nice the world is and those evil people will come to power by taking advantage of your complacency, and when that happens you will be left defenseless from it.

peace only lasts as long as its forced to.

The need for guns to defend yourself means there will always be someone you need to defend yourself against, this mentality that you will always need to protect yourself means you will always think there is some against you…..this is an illusion and complete BS paranoia that makes you think that there is always someone out there to get you, all this creates fear and distrust.

Incorrect you assume because we are armed that means we live in a constant state of fear, this couldn't be further the truth, I carry a gun every day, I'm afraid of nothing, I don't walk a round 24/7 looking over my shoulder, I take comfort in the fact that should something happen I'm prepared for it, many people carry a cell phone in case of emergency, does that mean they walk around 24/7 thinking an emergency is going to happen? no...

You assume because we are armed its some big deal to us that takes up our whole lives and consumes our minds 24/7, well the truth is we think very little of it until people like you decide to make a thread about it.

Those of us who do carry don't walk around like cowboys with our hands constantly over our gun with an itchy trigger finger assuming everyones our enemy...

We aren't cops..

[edit on 31-1-2008 by C0le]