9-11 lets lay it on the table....please provide evidence

Google Video Link

I haven't paroozed this entire thread so if this video has already been implicated i apologize. IMHO i think this video proves that video trickery was in fact employed on 9/11.

I have given up. When I see this thread I just realize more and more that the fight is lost.

Every detail about 911 and the powers behind it have been discussed here on ATS, and other sites.

What's the point of this discussion? If you still believe the official story at this point, there is no way you will ever believe the opposite. The same goes for the "truthers". I am one and I'm proud of it.

It's the same discussion all over again, every single time, with the same people, and it's getting "us" nowhere.

I have come to my senses and I have realised that this site is ruled by disinfo and that its original motto has become a joke.

If you speak your mind you get censored, meanwhile the disinfo posts are tolerated.

Running around in circles.

I don't mean to sound condescending. I thought for a while I could change something by informing people, by any means, after I found out about what is really running the world behind the scenes.

Turns out the biggest enemies to the truth, are our own fathers and mothers, brothers and sisters, friends and collegues.

That's were the real war is fought, in the minds of the masses. And the war is lost.

"We", have ourselves to thank for it.

"We" deserve it.

A lot of "us" are in for a rude awakening.


I've given up, the wheels are set in motion. I am waiting. I am prepared.

Godspeed to you all, except for the snakes! Karma will come back around to haunt you!

the reality of what happened on 911 is now irrelevant. it was a coup d'etat by the next morning.

911 is not real. the war on terror is not real. america is not real. only you are.

There are a lot of "inside" 9-11 arguments, and evidence that backs it up. One only has to hear about Sibel Edmonds:

www.justacitizen.com...

to realize that the US Government "Let It Happen On Purpose."

This is reality, everyone.

As SAD, and as troubling as that is.

reply to post by Taxi-Driver


I have to tell you this is pretty good, in fact I have tried over and over in the past to see that plane with negative results, but this is pretty good. It has given some insight on the Pentagon strike ....I just wish I knew how to get this vid on my thumb drive, to tote it around.....any suggestions.....if someone or you knows how U2U me please!

[edit on 27-1-2008 by birchtree]

reply to post by OrionStars


So what is the harm is stating what your background is again?

Originally posted by ULTIMA1
Maybe like an abreviation. Have to try to come up with a good acronym.

BOGS

(Believers of the Official Government Story)

I never bought the "hologram" thing. That is just silly to me.

I think what bothered me the most was the testimony from the former Director of the FTC saying in his testimony (which was apparently ignored) during the 9/11 Commission interviews.

When he tells them he was standing there with the Vice President and someone was keeping him informed. They came in the room and told him when it was 50 miles out, 40, 30, 20. And finally said, "10 miles out sir, do the orders still stand" The FTC Director says that Cheyney turned around and said (paraphrasing) "Did you hear anything to the contrary?"

That certainly helped convince me at the very least that they knew it was going to happen.

Look, I see that there are people that are frustrated by this post I have started. I know that we have gone around in circles on all the other threads, and even this one, when talking about 9-11.

I am a turther, and I have not been on ATS for very long. I originally saw this site as a way to pass along information to like minded individuals. Being that I was out for truth regarding 9-11 I was reading the posts hourly, trying to find something that I had not seen yet.

I am going to be honest. I was shocked that a community of supposidly intelligent individuals would have so many people that supported the official story. To me it was obvious that at the very least the government knew it was coming but chose to ignore it. THe more I looked into the story the more sinister it became.

I see people on here stating all sorts of information, yet they do not back anything up. The only EVIDENCE we have is the media videos of that day. The research has gone in so many directions that you have to pick and choose what is valuable and what is not. EVERYONE does it for thier arguments.

I guess my goal was to try and get people to tell me why they believe the official story.

Please dont talk about occam's razor anymore. Lets define it:
"Occams Razor - When faced with several explanations of a phenomenon One should always choose the simplest, the one that requires the fewest leaps of logic."

We are dealing with reality here...something that actually happened. There is a truth to the story. This truth is not a phenomenon but an actuality. Hidden or not, the only way to find this truth is through the evidence, not to assume the simplicity of the official story is true.

Is the offical story even the simplest explanation? Ask yourself that before you move on.

[edit on 28-1-2008 by Jeff Riff]

reply to post by Jeff Riff


I think you miss a great point about 9-11. There isnt a simple explanation for it!

Even what is put forth by the official story is not simple, thats why many CT'S try by themselves to make grasp of it all. You know how many times I have heard the arguement that goes like, " well this people in caves couldnt put together something like this", when in all reality this "cavemen" whoop soviet butt out of Afghanistan. To deny the fact that even muslim extremist exist even though they have been creating chaos for the past 50 years on this planet.

We were attack, 9-11 wasnt the first time, we were attack in WTC before, we were attack in Kenya, Tanzania, Lybia, Yemen, some CT'S go as far as saying that the Oklahoma City bombings muslims extremist were involved, so this is not new, is not like many CT'S want to imply that terrorism was invented and created in 9-11.

Going back to 9-11, there is nothing simple about the official story, it is complicated and hard to understand, to the degree that makes people talk about hollograms and stuff like that. Add to that the different angles of science, aviation, tactics and strategy that goes about explaining an event like this, and you can easily figure out why there is some people that refuse to put the story to rest, Not to mention the different political agendas and the ones that have a personal gain out of it.

Originally posted by enigmania
I have given up. When I see this thread I just realize more and more that the fight is lost.

Every detail about 911 and the powers behind it have been discussed here on ATS, and other sites.

What's the point of this discussion? If you still believe the official story at this point, there is no way you will ever believe the opposite. The same goes for the "truthers". I am one and I'm proud of it.

It's the same discussion all over again, every single time, with the same people, and it's getting "us" nowhere.

I have come to my senses and I have realised that this site is ruled by disinfo and that its original motto has become a joke.

If you speak your mind you get censored, meanwhile the disinfo posts are tolerated.

well, seems so.
definetely this is just another 911 disinfo-thread.


USE THE SEARCH ENGINE

[edit on 28-1-2008 by anti72]

reply to post by Bunch



Well I think that is what I was implying by saying that you cannot apply Occams Razor to the 9-11 debate. You cannot simply appeal towards simplicity. I am not asking for anything cut and dry, I am asking for what it is that is compelling to each individual that supports their reasoning.

reply to post by anti72



I can use the search, but then I am going to be reading pages and pages of people arguing. Why even have the site, when we can read peoples opinions all over the internet? You can find anything using a search engine. Go be unproductive elsewhere...your comments are not appreciated.

Ok here goes-- I have given some imput in two previous posts on this thread-- The first, I harkened back to the origins of these conspiracies-- the "alternative explainations" and "crys of outrage" did not come from the people that would be the most competent to see through the most widely accepted recounting of events-- Structral and civil engineers, police detectives (non-federal) or firefighters-- rather it was by people who make a living from promoting CT's like Alex Jones, an anti-semetic computer programmer in Eric Huffschmidt ( controlled demolition), an anti-semetic beat writer for the American Free Press (a david duke publication) Chris Boylynn ( Flt 93 didn't crash in Penn.) and a radical French author Therry Meyssan ( Pentagon no-plane theory)

What makes a radio DJ and crew, a computer programmer, a biased beat writer, and a radical foreign author sooo qualified? THEY planted the seeds of conspiracy-- it has grown somewhat, but those are the origins of these theories. I do NOT trust them. It is like getting a Walgreens clerk to give you open heart surgery.

Call it Ad-Hom, but I will stick with the experts. Like Bazant, Zou, Greening, NIST, FBI investigators, FDNY, NYPD, Port Authority, Boston PD, Newark PD, et al. Hell even AlQueda themselves admitt they did it. It takes a LOT of "special conditioning" to deny those claims.

For some reason peole like to make-believe that there was no investigation-- There were butt-loads of investigations. Some still ongoing.

I hate to admitt this but-- This all started for me after watching Freedom to Fasicm -- I went to work the next day all, "check it out yo, we don't have to pay taxes anymo!!" -- GAWD I feel stupid now-- luckily I said "some sorces say:" before I completely committed to that fallacy.

It is easy to get "gotcha-ed" with this material.. Ya know like the WTC 7 "gotcha" moment where you realize -"ZOMFG The bombs had to be planted BEFORE the planes!!" It goes on and on, and it is a pretty cleverly designed propaganda campaign. It has one flaw though-- if you do research outside of the biased propaganda sites, you quickly begin to see it for the propped-up fraud it is.

Originally posted by Valhall
If you're going to start official names for groups of people in this debate I would appreciate it if people like me finally get a name as well, because I'm sick of being classified in with the Truthers ... and I'm sick of being grouped with those who accept the official story... by Truthers who think anyone who won't accept their religion must be a "sheeple"

...I respectfully request to be called an OOB from now on...an Objective OBserver.

I feel complete now - I have a label.

Excellent post, Val - star for you.

Many of us would sign up to this. Aaaah... a label, at last. An identity. A recognized position.

Thanks & regards.

reply to post by Jeff Riff


But where does it start though? We cant even agree to some basic facts of what happen that day. There is people that refuse to believe that hijackers were involved, that planes hit the towers, the pentagon, PA. There is people that refuse to accept that people on those planes died. So were shall we start?

Thats the most unbelievable thing in this entire debate that there is no common ground even for the most basic facts about what happen that day, but then again Im in no position to call anything a fact, because what I see as a fact someone else would perceive it as something else. Is just the same cycle of agreeing to disagree.

reply to post by Bunch


I agree! that was very well put and I appreciate it. It is like we are to the very basic point of knowledge on the subject. None of us know anything about the truth regarding 9-11.....we are all arguing opinion.

Am I off?

Originally posted by TheOracle
well if the italian president, who worked with the CIA, says that he knows that it was government conspiracy, then I believe him.

That's the direct equivalent of saying:

'Well, if the US President, who is nominally in charge of the CIA, says he knows it wasn't a government conspiracy, then I believe him.'

There is no difference between these two statements, surely? Just a matter of faith and dogma, as to which religion you choose to follow.

reply to post by Jeff Riff


Not at all, with all this bickering back and forth this is what I fail to see. If we were to build a case, at least a very basic one of what do we think happen that day, I dont think we get pass the first line without someone disagreeing on what happen, and this thread is a very prime example of that.

I know this was not the purpose of this thread, but at least if we all can learn something about it is that we dont have to be on each others face to be right, we can just talk,ask,read and absorb and maybe at the end can come out having learned something useful.

I mean common, how many hours do we spend a day, a week, a month on this subject? Might as well get something good out of it.


[edit on 28-1-2008 by Bunch]

I have referred to them as being the OSS. (Official Story Supporters)
Doc