Interesting Place to Find a Masonic Obelisk

Originally posted by twitchy

Well since you dont' want to offer anything in the way of disproving the masonic signifigance of the obelisk,

When I recieve the powers of proving a negative, trust me, you will be the first to know.

why don't you expand on the Egyptian Signifigance of the Obelisk for us, and we'll see what the eye in the sky says.

I am not well versed enough in Egyptology to offer an opinion on its significance, this question is best directed to someone who does have that background.

I guess the biggest question I have is, "what difference does it make?"

I've said my piece as to the obelisk not being a "Masonic emblem" although, it is discussed in Masonic writings, so it's obviously been important to some Masonic writers for whatever reason.

Beyond that, would it be BAD if it were a Masonic emblem? If so, why? Is it because some consider it a phallic symbol? Hope not, because my Bishop (when I was going through RCIA) explained that the Paschal Candle used in the Roman, Anglican, Orthodox and some Protestant Churches is a phallic symbol. Before Easter when the Candle is plunged into the baptismal font, it represents . . . well, you can figure that out.

Many traditions are based on Pagan and other ancient things.

Anybody wear a wedding ring? I know of some fundie-churches that do not condone wedding rings because of their pagan origins.

Anyway, just asking. It's curious that this thread has gone to 5 pages when the OP only stated that he "believed" the memorial to be Masonic.

I say it's not simply because the plaque does not say something to the effect of "Erected by the M.W. Grand Lodge of the State of . . . " nor does it have Square & Compasses emblem on it. And you KNOW how much we love to stamp that on our work.

reply to post by twitchy


Did it ever occur to you that the local lodge might simply have been invited to do so?

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
I am not well versed enough in Egyptology to offer an opinion on its significance, this question is best directed to someone who does have that background.

Ok, since you've said the Obelisk is Egyptian, I think we can by, your admission of ignorance, summarily discount your opinion on the symbology behind then obelisk, right?

reply to post by Masonic Student

Yeah, that's why I said they were 'asked to do so' in my previous post.

Originally posted by twitchy
Ok, since you've said the Obelisk is Egyptian, I think we can by, your admission of ignorance, summarily discount your opinion on the symbology behind then obelisk, right?

What symbology did I profess to atribute to the obelisk in question? I think you might be confusing yourself, you are the one who gave the obelisk Masonic properties. I dsiputed this statement on my knowledge of Masonic symbolism. I only stated that it was not Masonic but Egyptian. I do not need a degree in archeology or Egyptology to make this statement, just as I do not need them to assert that the Sphinx is also Egyptian.

Well, it's abundantly clear by a preponderance of the evidence that the Trinity monument is not Masonic.

It is further noted that twitchy has no idea how to debate, and has not at any point offered any type of proof that the Trinity monument is anything other than one of many historical monuments located throughout the U.S.A.

Again, the Masons a ATS bring reason and logic to the thread ... and the antiMasons bring nothing. Seems to be SOP at ATS.

Your pal,
Meat.

Originally posted by mmmeat
Well, it's abundantly clear by a preponderance of the evidence

LOL yeah you guys have certainly convinced me. Score another one up for the Masons guys.
You mentioned some evidence?

Originally posted by twitchy

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
the Trinity Memorial obelisk is not Masonic...

Proove it. It should be relatively easy for a man of your enlightened status and masonic knowledge. I'd like to see something in the way of undeniable rock solid proof of your asserion aside from posting a link from Tombstone Enthusiasts. You keep saying that the Trinity Memorial is not masonic. Well, let's see what you have to substantiate that.

Once again, the burden of proof is upon the accuser to prove his claim, not the accused to disprove it,You don't come with claims outrageous or not and tell people that it is their job to disprove it, you do facts and research and attenot to convince people.

There is a Masonic Obelisk at the Trinity Test Site. There I said it again. Does that anger you?

reply to post by twitchy


Astounding...

Do you honestly think you provide educated responses? Seriously? .. If there was an actual Masonic symbol, saying, what ever, I would hand you gusy some credit..

But as I said before, it is a black and white issue.

Is an Obelisk a Masonic symbol? No, it is not. Is it used at all in Masonry? No, it is not. Is it used in Masonic degrees? No, it is not, though in ONE VARIATION it was shown ONE reference to an Obelisk.

And once and for all....

Where the placers of said Obelisk Masons? Most likely No. Did they make reference to Masonry? No. Is the site in question of any Masonic importance? No.

Im closing the book on this one.. the desperate ignorance is honestly .. pathetic.

But, here is a little thought as to "why an obelisk" ...

In the desert, it would provide longer lasting life span then any other shape. A square for instance, would suffer more elemental damages then a obelisk.

Obelisk have the ability to seemingly last a very, very long time.

It is in the middle of a desert, and an obelisk is easily seen and discerned.

An obelisk is, to be quite frank... typical in these types of monuments, with a plaque at that.

Trinity Site

where

the world's first

nuclear device

was exploded on

July 16, 1945

erected 1965

white sands missile range

J Frederik Thorlin

Major General U.S. Army

Commanding

[edit] The Lower Plaque Reads (Lines are as they appear on the Plaque)

Trinity Site

has been designated a

National Historical Landmark

This Site Possesses National Significance

In Commemorating The History of the

United States of America

1975

National Park Service

United States Department of the Interior

Show me, .. friend.. , a Masonic reference in that. It shows however, your ignorance, your hate, your absolute stupidity blinded by narrow minded hate mongering and self superiority.

You are the worst kind of Human.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Show me, .. friend.. , a Masonic reference in that. It shows however, your ignorance, your hate, your absolute stupidity blinded by narrow minded hate mongering and self superiority.
You are the worst kind of Human.

So to translate that into english the rest of us can understand, you don't have any proof that it isn't masonic. I don't like you either.

Edit: No wonder they used to hobble Stone Masons at the Cathederals, probably got tired of that brotherly love and usuary.

[edit on 24-1-2008 by twitchy]

Originally posted by twitchy
There is a Masonic Obelisk at the Trinity Test Site. There I said it again. Does that anger you?

You going to stick your tongue out next? Maybe give us the raspberries? I guess you need more time to unearth evidence to support your 'Masonic obelisk' theory but I would not hold my breath if I were you.

Speaking of becoming angered, does it it anger you that you just can not seem to find anything to back up your claim? And you wanted to debate....

[edit on 24-1-2008 by AugustusMasonicus]

reply to post by Rockpuck

CECIL D. ANDRUS was secretary of the Interior that year, he was a DeMolay...
en.wikipedia.org...
How does that proove your obelisk isn't masonic?

Edit: literally in the DeMolay Hall of Fame



[edit on 24-1-2008 by twitchy]

[edit on 24-1-2008 by twitchy]

reply to post by twitchy


Lyndon Johnson was president that year. So by your logic I guess everything he did somehow had Masonic influences.

Originally posted by masonica_esoterica
You don't come with claims outrageous or not and tell people that it is their job to disprove it, you do facts and research and attenot to convince people.

Once again, considering an obelisk to be masonic is not outrageous.

Methinks the Masons protest too much (as usual).

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

LOL uh no I said

CECIL D. ANDRUS was secretary of the Interior that year, he was a DeMolay

This really is starting to get petty, even for you guys. Let's just get real good and country simple here to make sure you understand what I'm saying... I say it's Masonic. You say Potato. I say show me a potato, you say there's no potato to show. I still say it's masonic, unless you got a tater in your pocket. How's that?
CECIL D. ANDRUS was a DeMolay. The Obelisk is Masonic.
That's what's so great about free speech, I could say you guys are actually Aliens made of Burnt Toast Particles if I wanted to.
Today, I'm saying that there is a Masonic Obelisk standing at the Trinity Test Site. If you don't believe me, that's fine, if you have something to the contrary, that's even finer.

As to me being the worst kind of person, I think Jesus mentioned the Workers of Inequity right up there on the list as well, I'd think about that the next time you guys have your little town meetings, er I mean lodge meetings.

Originally posted by twitchy
LOL uh no I said

CECIL D. ANDRUS was secretary of the Interior that year, he was a DeMolay

Yes, and his boss was a Mason. Hence my post.


[edit on 24-1-2008 by AugustusMasonicus]

Guys, he is trolling. My advice is to stop giving him attention - that's what he's after. It's a waste of time. It's over, he's done.

It's already been demonstrated that he is not capable of understanding the process of reasoning, deductive or otherwise.

He's just looking to pick a fight now.

[edit on 1/24/08 by The Axeman]

Cover of the 'Scottish Rite Journal'

Issue calling for funds to restore the Washington Monument. Wahsington was a Freemason. The magazine is modern.

I wonder what this book is about?





As to the Washington Monument, you say that Obelisks aren't associated with Freemasonry at all, that's really odd because the Washington Monument, which is in fact an obelisk seems to be. If you want to try to argue that the Washington monument isn't masonic, good luck because I know alot of little trivia facts about it, like it had 36,000 nonmasonic blocks of Granite, or that it's supposedly non-Masonic Capstone weighs 3,300 pounds, or the few special masonic memorial stones that were placed at 330 feet level. It cost 1,300,000 bucks. It is aligned with your 'four corners'. What is the House or Temple of Understanding? It's part of the Non-Masonic Layout in the District of Columbia isn't it?

Wow this is interesting...

NY Times
January 20, 1880, Wednesday
The World has received what it represents to be a telegram from Lieut. GORRINGE, announcing that he has discovered "Masonic emblems" underneath the obelisk at Alexandria.

How about t his one?

Encyclopedia of Freemasonry By Albert Gallatin Mackey mentions Obelisks as a symbol of freemasonry... but I'm sure he's just out to get you guys too.

Shall I go on, or can you quit moaning and howling about proof that Obelisks are masonic? I have more if you really need it. Sounds like you might. Here's one...
Yod=G=Phallus=Obelisk=you guys are full of it.