World Markets Plunge - DJIA Futures Down Nearly 500 Points

reply to post by marg6043


Trading range on the S&P is 1320 to 1385. Outside that range we could see a low of 1260 and a high of 1425. I believe we stay in those ranged all year. There are option trades you can put where you bet we stay inside a certain point spread of you can bet that we either go above or below a point area. There are so many ways to profit from the stock market. Get educated and make some money people.

Originally posted by traderonwallst

... There are so many ways to profit from the stock market. Get educated and make some money people.

If it's your forte' to essentially be married to options trading
and have enough money to cover those 'shorts'....

that's not a matter of the rest of us being un-enlightened, under-educated or even naive on profiting from market volitility.

It's just a fact that a lot of us do not want to immerse our waking life in that all consuming lifestyle, the options & futures traders require a passion and desire for that type of life, also a hefty bankroll,... i think 'burn-out'
is as high as that as 'Air-Traffic-Controllers'...


but thanks for the thought

reply to post by St Udio


My husband and I do not have lots of time left before retirement, we have to protect what we have for now.

Thanks Udio, the risky business is for the investor with the mula to spend or either a young investor that have plenty of years to recuperate.

[edit on 10-2-2008 by marg6043]

reply to post by marg6043



your quite right....

in that i read what your saying is that 'One size does not fit all'

but in a nicer way than i put it,

(just acknowledging i sometimes do monitor the thread traffic
and do check up on the new posts after making a statement...)

good night

IMF is selling gold to use proceeds to be the tag team partner for the Plunge Protection Team

the manipulators i believe are trying to do anything now to prop up the equity markets , this i imagine, will attempt to reduce the shrinkage of people's nest eggs, which as an effect will try to maintain people's consumer spending, and the economy longer.

we shall see what the gold price does from this.

www.jsmineset.com...

beta.stockhouse.com...

In case some-one read Sinclair's history of IMF Gold sales at the link that cpdaman provided...and is scratching their head over the Chung Phat - Dr No reference....

"Dr. No and Professor Chung Phat are not fictional characters but real life Islamic/Asian money managers to whom Harry Schultz I have given cover names.' - J. Sinclair (jsmineset Jan 1, 2004)

Threats of IMF Gold sales surface a couple times a year. A strategic jaw-jacking campaign designed to dim enthusiasm for the senseless relic usually backed-up by a vicious Comex short-fest. Often the market would react to the head-fake with a short-term momentum-break...we'll see if the longs have learned anything

here is an interesting article titled "uncle sam crying uncle"

by fekete, again he goes heavily into talking about bond speculation, posturing that bond speculators double the price of bonds when they anticipate the fed will be halving rates

anyway here is the link, www.safehaven.com...

he says bond speculation is basically risk free, i assume bond speculation refers to gov't bond speculation , and that this lack of risk is the case when you are dealing with a fiat currency. i am trying to learn more about the bond market , but Fekete goes on to say that bond bull markets are no stranger to depressions, and infers that as the "shadow banking system" i.e all the deregulation that caused massive growth in 3 letter securitized, heavily leveraged features is imploding, at the same time the fed cuts rates, that the "new money" will not flow into lending or stocks, or even many commodity's, but it will flow into bonds thru bond speculators.

does anyone believe or understand what he is saying?

he leads one to believe that during times of severe economic distress the banks are using their bond portfolios via some bond speculation to repcatitalize themselves, while acting like rate cuts are to boost the "economy". and that the bond market is making the economic distress worse. and that this is missed or not talked about by economists.

[edit on 11-2-2008 by cpdaman]

europe was up large today (3.5%) while america put in a decent day of gains (very solid actually)

as the real economy falls , wall street is fighting the good fight

That's why the Street is the worst indicator IMO. I only watch it as an aside. There is a reason that the Market has CRASHED before, because they will take DENIAL to its logical end. I mean, it's reached the realm of ridiculousness. One day it's Buffet to the rescue (an offer to insure the solid stuff one more time) and the next day it's .3% uptick in consumerism minus .2% from fuel, leaving .1% actual increase. This game can only go on so long.

the game could continue if the gov't and fed combine for a bailout. this would increase prices (or prevent a free fall in assets like housing and stocks) at the expense of IMO bonds and higher increases in the costs of living across the board. in this situation GOLD would soar!

for people in the real world and in the real economy the budget cuts (as well as the higher cost for state gov'ts to get loans) will lead to cuts across the board in funding for , employment construction ....you name it big problem

The euro is no better than the dollar for OPEC country's (they are both fiat's)

The ironic things is that w/o a gov't bailout (which i can't put a % on) then prices for assets will deflate and fiat dollar will be worth more, the reason i think this % is less, is that gov't and bankers are in bed and the bankers are hurting badly, most bankers seem to need the bailout.

Originally posted by cpdaman
the game could continue if the gov't and fed combine for a bailout. this would increase prices (or prevent a free fall in assets like housing and stocks) at the expense of IMO bonds and higher increases in the costs of living across the board. in this situation GOLD would soar!

for people in the real world and in the real economy the budget cuts (as well as the higher cost for state gov'ts to get loans) will lead to cuts across the board in funding for , employment construction ....you name it big problem

The euro is no better than the dollar for OPEC country's (they are both fiat's)

The ironic things is that w/o a gov't bailout (which i can't put a % on) then prices for assets will deflate and fiat dollar will be worth more, the reason i think this % is less, is that gov't and bankers are in bed and the bankers are hurting badly, most bankers seem to need the bailout.

well it appears that with the election's approaching the efforts have been stepped up by Gov't agency's and corporations (fannie mae and freddie mac) to help stop the fall in housing prices by allowing these two organizations to invest and provide a "floor of support" in the mortgage industry, this will also help banks to slow continuing writedowns.

If housing prices can be stopped from falling with these "bailouts" then consumer spending should not go into free fall. i don't know enough about the info to know if this just help's the banks from losing all their collateral via further writedowns or wether it will stop the fall in housing values soon.

IMO as long as the dollar remains the world reserve currency and OPEC continues to re-invest in U.S treasury's and maintain their dollar pegs than the inflation from this bailout will be exported out of the united states for the most part. This is the same mechanism that supports the U.S consumer driven world economy. Bank capital is still low so their lending will still be drasticaly slowed and consumer's will find it tuff to get loans, however the degree to which this will effect the real economy is yet to be seen.

Silver is really soaring. Should the yield on the 10 year bond rise we may see the fed reverse intrest rate policy after the elections, after the banks get re-capitalized. Until then i think the dow may make another run to 14,000. oh and the dollar may have resumed it's tanking after a 3 month break. quotes.ino.com...

The wild card is credit derivatives i.e Credit default swaps , commercial real estate and then business earnings, perhaps all we are seeing now is the federal gov't insuring their boys in wall street are "insured" by .gov before the # hits the fan for main street, or perhaps the real economic downturn will be softened by this bailout. I dunno and OPEC will have a say as well they must continue to invest in treasury debt or intrest rates will rise and the bond market may be in trouble.

Eric janzen has a good post on I-tulip forums talking about the future scenario's.



[edit on 27-2-2008 by cpdaman]

reply to post by cpdaman


Yes even with the oil barrel at 100 dollars our economy is been held from getting the worst of the inflation from hitting until after elections.

Funny as I heard today Bernanke been question by one particular congressman about what is going to happen with peoples money as inflation is hitting the food and standards of living including retirement, he could not denied that the worst of inflation have not hit yet, but it will by the end of the year.

What is going to happen at the end of the year? elections, after that nothing will stop the runaway economical train that is going to hit us in the domestic level.

Even Hillary is ad Obama now are using he free trade gone wrong to blame the economic woes.

But now banks are increasing interest rates on loans and making still more attractive the variable rates that were the ones that created the bubble.

So as you can see the practices are still in place and is not monitoring or legislation to control it.

That was another issue been discussed today.

To tell you the truth nothing has change much beside more money pumped to keep the illusion of economical stability going.

[edit on 27-2-2008 by marg6043]

Not quite 500, and not quite down...but the stock market was up over 400 points today.

Thus proving...........nothing. As the stock market is only a marginal indicator of the economy as a whole.

The question is, 'What took the Market higher?'. Uh, Monetizing Debt, AKA Inflation. Get ready for even higher priced food and fuel and everything else. Paycheck to paycheck folk will be the first to get wiped out.

When the oil producers can no longer tolerate the inflation they will remove the dollar as the Reserve currency which will destroy it completely. At which point all those Dollars will be coming home causing even worse inflation.