[HOAX]Michael Horns Billy Meier photos[HOAX] from C2C tonight

RuhigSein, Jeff knows what any sentient being with a modicum of common sense knows--Billy Meier is full of poop and that poop's name is Michael Horn.

Why must we believe in this all-loving alien hoax? And why must the believers of the all-loving alien hoax be all-nasty?

Ah. I remember now. Check the history on belief. It's never about right/wrong, good/bad, love/hate...it's about defending one's position because at the end of the day to say "My belief is TRUTH" is a complete lie. And when your belief is in something demonstrably untrue... well... that just makes it all the harder to believe in, doesn't it? So you kinda have to be defensive and nasty or else admit to yourself that you've been conned all these many years.

That makes you inept. You don't want to be inept. Jeff must be wrong or lying. Pay no attention to that string adorned to the top of the craft in that photo or the similarities between the ufo and a damned garbage can lid Meier happened to have lying around the house.

God, what isn't lying around his house, if you catch my drift? Wink. Nudge. Emoticon.

reply to post by Tiloke
I remember a thread called "Billy Meier ray gun pictures"(or something close to that),where J.R. went into great detail as to why the Meier photos were bunk.Its a very long thread,well worth the read if you are on the fence about the Meier case.I know since I've read that thread ,there is no doubt in my mind that the pics Meier has are definite fakes.

Thanks J.R. for helping me open my eyes to a fraud.



Edit:Thread can be found here

[edit on 16-5-2008 by crowpruitt]

reply to post by RuhigSein


As I said, it will all be posted to IIG's website when Derek correlates his and everyone else's data together. Until then, you can refer to threads here. I'm out of the habit of typing everything 60 times, as I just don't care that much about the Meier case anymore. It's over.

Why you should believe he a fruad?Lets put this one to bed shall we?

reply to post by jritzmann


Well, I didn't ask to know what you know about your opinion on that its a hoax. I asked what you know in detail about the case. The contact notes...etc... The CASE. A few pictures don't speak for the entire story.

Click here for more information.

reply to post by mlmijyd


That's not enough proof. Instead of thinking straight on that line, try to think on other alternatives to why that isn't proof.

Originally posted by RuhigSein
reply to post by mlmijyd

 

That's not enough proof. Instead of thinking straight on that line, try to think on other alternatives to why that isn't proof.

Define "proof." You mean that no one but the hoaxer can say that it's a hoax and since Meier ain't talkin' it might as well not be a hoax? It's still at least a 50/50 shot?

Listen, if you are willing to argue for a man who is clearly lying in some instances because you think in others he isn't, be my guest. But stop with the militant attitude already. It's silly on top of gullible which according to the math = stupid.

And you know, sorry to double post, but when did it become Jeff's job to provide proof that it's a hoax? It's actually Meier's job to provide proof he isn't hoaxing. And he hasn't. Instead, he's built a pseudo religion around it.

reply to post by Jeremy_Vaeni


I already explained before, and I know explaining again isn't going to convince anyone. It's up to one to believe or not. Meier or Horn already explained themselves. Some people refuse to accept it. That's why its only a belief. It isn't absolute truth, because there are other alternatives. Some of you are too stubborn and are only thinking on one thin line.

reply to post by Jeremy_Vaeni


So when did Jeff prove it was a hoax?
And from what I understand the People around Meier created the Organization, or cult. And what Horn does is complete stupidity.
I don't get why the guy takes it has his job to go spreading something like if its absolute fact. Even in Meier's contact notes, the supposed Pleiadians say, "We wish not to be worshipped and turned into a Religion".

RuhigSein,

What would be PROOF to you that this is a hoax, or not? I'm just curious.

JRitzman and others have delved into this for many years. It's tiresome to do research but if you truly want to know you'll do it. Who knows, maybe you'll find something 'different' than others who have already made up their minds have found by doing your own research.

As far as the Plejaran's suggestion that they do not wish to be worshiped this is all fine and good but it is not what is occurring. I also have a book of contact notes but I've yet to get my sis to send it to me!

This FIGU group is basically a "Personality Cult". That is a group of people who have chosen to 'idolize' and/or 'worship' another person. (this does not mean that the person being idolized and/or worshiped has asked to be so) That other person would be Billy Meier. You are correct with this group, FIGU. They were founded by other men but these men have 'attached' themselves to Billy as their Prophet. Billy is guilty of 'Apathy' in this situation. He allows these people to do as they please basically and he also reaps the REWARDS that they offer him as their 'Master' and 'Prophet'. Billy himself has used the term 'Master' to describe himself so he's 'given' in to the 'gifts' of the group. That would be a place to stay for the entirety of his life, rent and/or mortgage free, with people to do all the housework and yard chores and etc. He lives free and clear now. He does nothing to support himself. It's all taken care of by the required 'payments' for dues and etc. of Passive Group and Core Group members. Just see the 'Passive Group Membership Form'. As I've posted elsewhere, if you make about 2,000.00 per month it will cost you about $460 dollars a year to be an official member of the FIGU group. You still have to purchase all of the information and you also have to speak or at least understand German because that is the language that the majority of the information is still written in.

This is the BIGGER picture. This is a cult any way you look at it, whether or NOT it was ever Billy Meier's intent.

I personally believe that Billy has had 'something' occur with him. Perhaps a
'single' encounter at a young age. But other than that it seems to be a pretty clear mess of 'crap' otherwise. Perhaps he's being fooled by the Government of Swissland somehow? Could be but it still 'stinks'!

All of the above is simply IMHO ~ in my humble opinion...

[edit on 18-5-2008 by Teri Uhouse]

reply to post by Teri Uhouse


I'm glad you see it that way, finally a good explanation, other than "This is all bullsh*t cuz I say so!!!"

I lose credibility in Meier in those sorts of choices, but in the case, if you read all of it is still interesting. I won't immidately say its all "Proven Hoax", because there's just not enough evidence to prove that cause. Thats why its only left as a belief, to believe or disbelieve. Like any other Cult/Organization/Religion.
But I don't think turning a cause into a Cult is immidately saying the person is a fraud. It could be the cause of wrong choices, or another cause that we don't know. For those people who turned the man into this Prophet and Leader of this Group, thats a shame on them, and a shame on Meier for allowing it.

Originally posted by RuhigSein
reply to post by jritzmann

 

Well, I didn't ask to know what you know about your opinion on that its a hoax. I asked what you know in detail about the case. The contact notes...etc... The CASE. A few pictures don't speak for the entire story.

And I'll say again, you can refer to the multiple threads here where I detailed that information. If you refuse to search and read the threads, I don't know what to tell you-other then you must not care very much about knowing. So stop asking. There answers are there.

I don't concern myself with contact notes, because for me it never got that far. If the initial photos are garbage, I need not go any further, because the integrity of the case is already in the toilet. However, some have gone into the contact notes and found serious issues with them too. Look up "Ike42" on google for a comprehensive examination of Meier's writings.

I have (in addition to photo analysis) looked into many of the "experts" testimony such as Malin, Post, Nathan, etc, and found their quotes were taken severely out of context. Malin told me this flatly.

I recently met Jim Dilettoso who told David Biedny, Jeremy Vaeni and myself that the "Wedding Cake" photos so desperately defended my Horn, were "clearly models".

This coming from the guy who did the original photo analysis on the Meier case...and who's report is on Horn's website. Yeah, he also said his report was misrepresented.

There's literally no end to the B.S. in this "case". Go look it all up if you're truly interested.

Originally posted by jritzmann

Originally posted by RuhigSein
reply to post by jritzmann

 

Well, I didn't ask to know what you know about your opinion on that its a hoax. I asked what you know in detail about the case. The contact notes...etc... The CASE. A few pictures don't speak for the entire story.

And I'll say again, you can refer to the multiple threads here where I detailed that information. If you refuse to search and read the threads, I don't know what to tell you-other then you must not care very much about knowing. So stop asking. There answers are there.

I don't concern myself with contact notes, because for me it never got that far. If the initial photos are garbage, I need not go any further, because the integrity of the case is already in the toilet. However, some have gone into the contact notes and found serious issues with them too. Look up "Ike42" on google for a comprehensive examination of Meier's writings.

I have (in addition to photo analysis) looked into many of the "experts" testimony such as Malin, Post, Nathan, etc, and found their quotes were taken severely out of context. Malin told me this flatly.

I recently met Jim Dilettoso who told David Biedny, Jeremy Vaeni and myself that the "Wedding Cake" photos so desperately defended my Horn, were "clearly models".

This coming from the guy who did the original photo analysis on the Meier case...and who's report is on Horn's website. Yeah, he also said his report was misrepresented.

There's literally no end to the B.S. in this "case". Go look it all up if you're truly interested.

I'll say it like this. Instead of being so stubborn and constantly, no matter what, depicking on one side of a argument, why don't you try to be more open about it? There's already "Text" explanations to defend Meier from the "Text" explanations trying to prove he's a hoax.

According to Meier, yes those pictures are Models. They only used model pictures to compare to the real pictures, and you can see the difference. The only "Model" beamships Meier had on his Farm were those of the Wedding Cakes, which we see. The other beamships were not recorded to be models. There are also other explanations coming from Meier himself, not Horn(Horn is desperate, info coming from him aren't always credible).

Oh and, if you made up your mind to "know" this case is full of **SNIP**, than why are you still arguing and fighting, and trying to prove a point? What are you wasting anymore efforts and time for? I recall you saying in a earlier post that, "This case is BS and a waste of time, this is my last comment, im done with this stuff". But then you still go on.


MOD EDIT: Circumvention of censors

[edit on 19-5-2008 by Crakeur]

Now THERE'S a classic case of trolling.

Jeff, my brother, time to hit the IGNORE button.

:-)

dB

reply to post by RuhigSein


I hate to say it, but he does have a point, Jeff. If this case was truly a waste of time for you, your last post would have been 300+ posts ago, and thats being generous. And lets not go with the classic "I have to constantly defend myself.." routine. I personally don't mind which stance you take, but if you're going to claim something with your words, you should try to back it up ... just ..like ... uh...Meier.

Oh and biedny. I've seen you flame many posters for simply disagreeing with you. Both here and on other forums (Mysterious Universe). Disagreeing does not make one a 'troll'. Ruhig has been very respectful so far. This is a childish way of handling yourself, and doesn't bode well for your side of the argument.

I apologize if that sounds harsh, but often I feel like a parent who has to come into these Meier threads and break up the fight. ..and its always the same small handful of antagonizers.

Woah Woah Woah.
For 2 pages now this guy has been hounding JRitzmann and demanding to be spoon-fed Jeffs opinion even though ATS has made it absurdly simple to see what he thinks by simply clicking on "thread posts" in his profile.

Now, when he answers the continuous hounding,(with almost a word for word reprint of what I suggested), the response from the guy who demanded an answer is " If you really thought it was crap you wouldn't have answered".


I agree with David, time to hit that button. I have never had to use my ignore button before, I hope he feels honored to be the first.

RS, if you are going to try and argue with Jeff about the Meier case, at least know what your talking ab.out before you come here. Meier never said those wedding cake ships were models. He said they were pictures of real live spaceships that traveled across space to talk to him and him alone.
The only time he ever mentions models is when he says that he TRIED to make a model and duplicate his "real" pictures, but couldn't so he burned the negatives.



EDITED TO FIX ITALICS

[edit on 19-5-2008 by Tiloke]

reply to post by Tiloke


Wow... I never asked for the Guy's Opinion, I made that COMPLETELY clear. I asked what he KNEW about Meier's case. About the Stories he tells, what he's been through, the Contact notes...etc... And the only info he was giving me was his Opinion, which is, "This case is BS!!!" He though did say on his latest comment, that he didn't read, or read much of any notes other than look at the Pictures to determine if the case is a Hoax or not, and he still gives me his opinion that "This case is BS".
I have read other threads and all of this thread, and its been the same things.
I'm sorry but some of you leave me speechless, and makes me lose respect for your own crediblity.

Someone who is Trolling is "Random" and bringing up nonsense, with pricky/biased/ignorant remarks and jokes to amuse themselves.
And Tiloke(If you do somehow read this) I don't know what case you're reading, but Billy Meier and a couple of others in one of his Notes, did make it clear that he had Models to compare to the real pictures.

Originally posted by davidbiedny
Now THERE'S a classic case of trolling.

Jeff, my brother, time to hit the IGNORE button.

:-)

dB

Good idea David...apparently my words of "go search it out RIGHT HERE ON THIS BOARD" don't seem to get through. Tiloke's right, I've no time for spoon feeding a case I've written about for 2 years. It's there, and I'll say it one more time:

Go Look it Up Right Here On ATS. There are countless photos showing focal issues, supportive structures, lack of distance hazing, found parts on the models identified, model trees...there's documentation of who Derek B. and I have spoken to personally (all of which say they're misrepresented), now go read it. If you have questions relating to that, I'm more the happy to answer them.

Now, if you care so much about what I know that you'll start an argument over it, go read it. Otherwise, you're doing nothing but trying to start an issue, and I have no time for that nonsense.

Tiloke- I think the word we're looking for here is "thick".



[edit on 20-5-2008 by jritzmann]