Hi All, I have a few posts on another thread of this nature, "Another misquote regarding the Billy Meier case" on the conspiracy section.

I, like another poster here who posted a couple pages ago (I'm sorry I can't recall your logon and it took a while to read the entire thread so....) was very close to becoming a member of the FIGU Cult (YES, it is!) about 8 years ago or so. I was a member of the FIGU forum and even sent away for their statutes and etc. I've read volumes of information from online as well, "And yet they Fly", "The Talmud Jmmanuel" and I even have a book of contact notes somewhere. I was into this for at least an entire year. But something suddenly turned me OFF completely.

I was still straddling the fence, on SOME of it, until recently when I experienced Michael Horn in his TOP NOTCH form on the "Department 47" message board. Anyone who entrusts their entire American information dissemination to any individual of this nature is not of a TRUTHFUL nor SPIRITUAL nature. This is the ENTIRETY of the FIGU group claims. TRUTH AND SPIRITUALITY their way is the way it is, NO EXCEPTIONS ~ PERIOD.

But they are NEITHER Truthful nor Spiritual in any way when they employ such as Michael Horn to disseminate their information! Michael Horn continually uses peoples words out of context and even has the shear un-wise ability to use 'negative' comments in his favor by 'TWISTING' them with ludicrous explanations as to why they mean the exact opposite of what they express! There are no less than 4 emails posted on the other thread from persons whom Horn has claimed 'prove' authenticity of items who never did any such thing! Horn has put words and meanings into their mouths and any one of any level of intelligence can readily see this as FACT just by reading the emails from these individuals. Mr. Horn has used these people against their wishes and there is NOTHING Truthful or Spiritual about that!

It is also a matter of fact that if Mr. Horn cannot get a group on the UFO end of the case then he switches over to the message or Spiritual aspect and than the 'Prophecies'... and than back again as it suits his need to 'sell'. If this case is, indeed, IRON CLAD as suggested than he should have no need to do this. Each and every facet should stand on it's own.

Billy is the ONLY ONE having ANY ET contacts, according to him. Yet just about every single so called supporter, John Lear, Wendelle Stevens etc. do research on OTHER ET's as well???? WHY? According to Billy anybody who sees any merit in ANY ET contacts besides his own is 'unintelligent'? So he is admittadly supported by a bunch of half wits since NONE of these guys, except Michael Horn himself, buy into the Billy is the only one scenario. This group DOES NOT walk it's talk. PERIOD. They can't do it unless they get their supporters to SUPPORT them.... completely......

Are they a cult or religion? Well, I can join the A.R.E. of Edgar Cayce fame for about $50 per year in dues. This gains me access to ALL of Edgar Cayce's work. Or I can join MUFON for about the same amount, I believe? This gains me access to information from them. If I wish to join the Billy Meier FIGU group it will cost me just about $470.00 per year until my 'retirement' age of 65!! I'd have to pay yearly dues, get a MANDATORY subscription to their quarterly newsletter (almost $100 U.S. and it's in GERMAN!) and I'd have to either go to Switzerland to work at the center for 3 days or PAY $200, and I'd also owe them 7% of one months salary! This is PER YEAR!! This gains me access to NOTHING more than a FIGU membership ID card. I must still PURCHASE the rest of the Spirit information??

They DO MAKE MONEY, friends. This amount here is for anyone 18 to 64 years of age....(who make about $2000 per month salary) it is more with a bigger income.... just 30 members brings them over $14,000.00 a year! These guys (supporters) say they don't get paid? Somehow I DOUBT it.



[edit on 4-5-2008 by Teri Uhouse]

since this is actually on the photos in particular... the NEW hand prints?

First and foremost it would have to be determined whether or not the metal of the car was actually "etched" with this so called print or if it is just the 'clear coat' and 'paint' that have been dissolved. By looking at the photo it appears to just be that the clear coat and paint have been dissolved? I am not sure, nor can I ever be as I will more than likely NEVER see the actual vehicle but that is what it looks like in the photo. The light blue paint and clear coat have been taken down to the lite gray metal.

'Sulfuric Acid', an acid used in 'film developing', and therefore readily available, is harmless (for a short period of time) to the skin of say, your hand. If you were to dip your hand in it, or even if you were just 'stopping the development process' of your film by dipping your photo in the acid thereby getting some of it on your fingers, and than you touch a car or something else made of metal it will dissolve the paint and / or affect the metal on the car.

These people seem to 'undo' themselves quite a bit, IMO. If you look at the photos of this alleged hand print one of them has billy's hand on the car next to the 'marks'. If you'll notice, Billy's hand has almost complete contact with the car. The position of his hand is a normal position of any hand... this would leave a print with a palm, phalanges and finger tips. Now look at the markings said to be an alleged seven fingered hand print. There is NO PALM nor phalanges, at all? There is just a barely visible hint at what would be the lower portion of a normal human thumb where it connects to the palm, or either the other side portion where the pinky finger connects. You can also see a smallish 'wrist' area. I am afraid that anyone could have come in and made the so called 'finger tip' prints since there is no real indication that they are even connected to phalanges. Am I a photo expert? NOPE. I don't need to be to look at this photo and use deductive reasoning to point out a very possible explanation. Is it correct? I don't know. But it is My Opinion.

[edit on 4-5-2008 by Teri Uhouse]

Kinda Ironic how when I say something like, "I'm glad I can ignore stubborn people", I get a website notice from a moderator.
But than people who are on the side of debunking the Meier case go to limits of calling people idiots and gullible fools, aren't getting notices at all.
This site seems biased. Someone even mentioned that, a couple of pages before hand.
All the site moderators, admins, and owners are all, "This is a proven hoax, because we say so".
Some people really can't realize Ignorance and Arrogance within their own minds.
Logic comes from what people comprehend, from what they assume, from what they're told, what they experianced, and what they think they know. Because you assume something from your own mindwork, doesn't make it absolute truth.
For the most part, the Meier Case can only be Believed or Disbelieved. If you believe it or not, thats up to you as a Human Being.
There's not enough Evidence to prove that Billy Meier is a hoax. There's not enough evidence to Prove he isn't. It's like trying to be prove God is real or not. Either you believe or you don't.
My Personal Opinion on this case is that some things that are being shown and said are Credible, and do make sense to my Comprehension. While other things are just left in a thought, and can't be accepted. But only a closed-minded person would accept that as Absolute fake.

Originally posted by RuhigSein
Kinda Ironic how when I say something like, "I'm glad I can ignore stubborn people", I get a website notice from a moderator.
But than people who are on the side of debunking the Meier case go to limits of calling people idiots and gullible fools, aren't getting notices at all.
This site seems biased. Someone even mentioned that, a couple of pages before hand.
All the site moderators, admins, and owners are all, "This is a proven hoax, because we say so".
Some people really can't realize Ignorance and Arrogance within their own minds.
Logic comes from what people comprehend, from what they assume, from what they're told, what they experianced, and what they think they know. Because you assume something from your own mindwork, doesn't make it absolute truth.
For the most part, the Meier Case can only be Believed or Disbelieved. If you believe it or not, thats up to you as a Human Being.
There's not enough Evidence to prove that Billy Meier is a hoax. There's not enough evidence to Prove he isn't. It's like trying to be prove God is real or not. Either you believe or you don't.
My Personal Opinion on this case is that some things that are being shown and said are Credible, and do make sense to my Comprehension. While other things are just left in a thought, and can't be accepted. But only a closed-minded person would accept that as Absolute fake.

Hmm. Above sounds like a Meierite trying to pass off as openminded. Doesn't exactly work. Nice try though.

TerraX, Nope. You're wrong. Try again.

I actually e-mailed Michael Horn once with a question about the supposed Ufo sounds that he had and had studied by a well known professor out of San Jose,CA. the name escapes me now. I pointed out to him that it sounded like a familiar sound and thought that it could easily be recreated. Man the next thing I know I got the most vicious E-mail back that I have ever gotten everything from swearing to calling me an idiot, almost as if who was I to question him.

In my opinion the Myers Ufo contact stuff and pictures are all fake.Anything that
Michael Horn produces should be looked at with Scepticism.

Originally posted by CaptGizmo
I actually e-mailed Michael Horn once with a question about the supposed Ufo sounds that he had and had studied by a well known professor out of San Jose,CA. the name escapes me now. I pointed out to him that it sounded like a familiar sound and thought that it could easily be recreated. Man the next thing I know I got the most vicious E-mail back that I have ever gotten everything from swearing to calling me an idiot, almost as if who was I to question him.

In my opinion the Myers Ufo contact stuff and pictures are all fake.Anything that
Michael Horn produces should be looked at with Scepticism.

I think today it could be easily re-created. Perhaps, the real question is could it be recreated with the technology that existed when the sounds were originally recorded? Various Meier documentaries (which include skeptics) say it couldn't have. Then again, I swear I heard sounds similiar to that Meier UFO sounds on an episode of Star Trek once, so who knows.

P.S. Would you care to U2U me Mr. Horn's Response to your email?

Originally posted by RuhigSein
TerraX, Nope. You're wrong. Try again.

Nah. I'll let your words Speak for themselves.

Originally posted by TerraX

Originally posted by RuhigSein
TerraX, Nope. You're wrong. Try again.

Nah. I'll let your words Speak for themselves.

Nope. You lose.
GG
no RE

Originally posted by RuhigSein
Nope. You lose.
GG
no RE

Whatever.

Originally posted by VisionQuest
I think today it could be easily re-created. Perhaps, the real question is could it be recreated with the technology that existed when the sounds were originally recorded? Various Meier documentaries (which include skeptics) say it couldn't have. Then again, I swear I heard sounds similiar to that Meier UFO sounds on an episode of Star Trek once, so who knows.

The sound has been identified as a tape delay effect in feedback.

Here's my documentation of communicating with one of the original sound engineers mentioned in the Meier report, and an independent submittal of the sound by myself to SAE Sound Engineering Institute and what their chief engineer and curriculum designer had to say:

I wrote Nils Rognerud who is listed as one of the sound engineers who listened to the Meier beamship sounds, and his responses to me sounded very much like someone who essentially wanted the evidence to be real representation of aliens craft sounds.

"I want to believe that Bully Meier is telling the truth". Was his statement.

I mentioned to him about the aspect that I believed the sounds were generated through and old tape delay guitar effect box, an amp and mic. One can hear listening to the tape on Michael Horn's site, that there is hardly any sound at all at the start of the mp3 file. A "Knock" is heard that sounds metallic. It echoes, and from that echo sound, the warbling feedback ensues. Feedback coupled with a delay effect needs some base sound to "set it off" essentially, and begin the loop of feedback layering over itself, over and over.

The knock does this by beginning the feedback and the delay gives it the layered sound by playing itself over "in echo" while the feedback is continuing. I asked Nils what he said to that. His answer was surprising:

"I have never tried the feedback technique you mention, so I can not confirm or deny the possibilities with this sound technique."

So I have to say a sound engineer not knowing very much about what delayed feedback sounds like rather puzzles me.

I contacted SAE Institute, a sound engineering institute located all over the world, but I called the Nashville area and spoke with Justin Spence, who is the sound engineer and course coordinator for SAE. I sent him the mp3 file on Michael's site and asked him his opinion on the sound's creation, and the fact that this was recorded in the 1970's. He asked what I thought it was, and I mentioned to him that I believed it was a tape delay echo in feedback.

"I completely agree with you", he said, and further stated there was reverb used as well, a fairly standard amp component. Justin commented he thought there could possibly be another effect in there, but wasn't sure as the sound was of such poor quality. He said the "knock" was very obviously a tap on reverb springs to set off the feedback loop. He commented that he could create such a sound in 10 minutes with his equipment, but that the original wouldn't require anything sophisticated. It could be generated by the old equipment with slightly more difficulty due to many variables like distance of the input device to speaker, and setting of echo on the delay effect, amp, etc.

In essence, all needed items to make the sound were completely available to Meier to do this, and quite easily. It seems the sound engineers who've "analyzed" the sounds must have been prior believers in UFO contact cases or the Meier case, because the answer was very obvious to the sound engineer I spoke with.

Wait a second. Jeff, are you implying that the Billy Meier case may not be real? Have you seen the photos and the footage?

WAKE UP!