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Is There A Conspiracy Of Atheists To Overthrow Christianity?

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posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 06:05 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy
reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


... You are incapable of comprehending it because of your rebellion....



Is that how you percieve everyone who doesn't believe in your own particular interpretation of Christ's teachings, as rebels??

Heading down a very dangerous road there methinks.

Next step rounding up all the rebels and forceful re-education maybe or just straight to the Gulags and Concentration Camps.

[edit on 8/4/08 by Freeborn]




posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 06:18 PM
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I’m amazed that this thread has turned from atheism to homosexuality. Well, no I’m not. Perhaps atheist may be perceived to be more tolerant of sexual deviations than Christians. By deviations, I mean anything that deviates from sex between married couples. See, that is what a lot of people tend to forget when they start chirping about homosexuality and the Bible. It is clear that the only sexual relations allowed by God are those between married couples. Divorce is considered adultery. Sex before marriage can only be justified after the couple is married. Any sex outside of marriage is considered sin according to the Bible.

I am no longer married to my first husband. I have not had sex with anyone but my current husband since we were married. But according to the Bible, I am living in sin since I am no longer with my first husband. Will that prevent me from entering Heaven? No! I believe that God forgives me, as well as He will forgive others who sin against His original plan.

According to the Bible, homosexuality is no worse than divorce. They are both sins.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 06:54 PM
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reply to post by darkelf
 


...i wouldn't turn to the bible for advice on sex.

according to the bible a man who is caught raping an unmarried/unengaged virgin he must pay her father and then the woman is forced to marry him


so...yeah, i'm not going to follow biblical advice on a lot of accounts, especially relationship advice.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 06:57 PM
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reply to post by darkelf
 



Agreed. I have tried to make that point. Sin is sin. orangetom has good advice. The big picture is it's all whoredom.

The topic got on homosexuality because Con made a point that the conspiracy is to so ridicule believers who take a stand against sin. So that the believer takes more heat than the sinner. That aspect of the conspiracy was flawlessly demonstrated for us by our atheist friends.

darkelf, I believe the Bible does allow for divorce in the case of being married to a non believer who abandons the marriage.

"But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so. A believing man or woman is not bound in such circumstances; God has called us to live in peace. How do you know, wife, whether you will save your husband? Or, how do you know, husband, whether you will save your wife?" (1 corin 7:15-16)



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:05 PM
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reply to post by Freeborn
 


It's not that. The Bible teaches that no one can comprehend the scriptures with out the aid of the Holy Spirit. Without accepting Jesus as Lord of your life you do not have the holy spirit. So the true meaning of the words on the page can not be known.

I know this to be a fact from personal experience. I was once an agnostic. I treated the Bible about the way Madd does. I used to ridicule it. God changed me. It is a completely different book now.

You have to be there.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:13 PM
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Originally posted by Bigwhammy
reply to post by Freeborn
 

I know this to be a fact from personal experience. I was once an agnostic. I treated the Bible about the way Madd does. I used to ridicule it. God changed me. It is a completely different book now.

You have to be there.


For the Christian, no explanation is necessary. For the rest, no explanation is enough. Sometimes, you just have to brush the dust from your feet.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:16 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by darkelf
 


...i wouldn't turn to the bible for advice on sex.



That is not the Bibles advice on sex. You just cherry pick extreme examples out of context (without even quoting a passage) to mislead and misdirect.

The only acceptable sex in the Bible is between a married man and wife period. Everything else is whoredom.

If people did use the Bible for advice on sex and followed its standard, we would live in a much better world. That would be a world with no STDs. No kids who do not who there father or mother is. No rape. No perversion.

But sadly people go after what feels good to them instead. The Godless way, hence the mess we are in.



[edit on 4/8/2008 by Bigwhammy]



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:23 PM
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Maybe simple, but, never uncomplicated.

To those that read and seemingly understand every last bit of the Holy Bible. You are forgetting the most wonderful part of humans performing "sinful" acts and leading "sinful" lives.
You can spout all you want about how I may be sinning in my life and you can't give me grief about it. You can't. You can tell me how I may of sinned, but, you can't pass judgement on me.
That's God's job. According to the christian faith, Jesus died on the cross to forgive me of my sins.
I can hump a buffalo and Jesus would tip his hat and nod "forgiven". And, if Jesus would forgive the most horrible person for the most horrible act, which, by dying on the cross, he does, why should I worry about gays, lesbians and all of whatever else personally offends YOU? You are nothing, by your own theology of course, compared to Jesus and he say's "Pass, Brother".

Next!

Cuhail



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:36 PM
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Originally posted by Cuhail

I can hump a buffalo and Jesus would tip his hat and nod "forgiven". And, if Jesus would forgive the most horrible person for the most horrible act, which, by dying on the cross, he does, why should I worry about gays, lesbians and all of whatever else personally offends YOU? You are nothing, by your own theology of course, compared to Jesus and he say's "Pass, Brother".

Next!

Cuhail


Um, not exactly. First one has to understand that “humping a buffalo” is wrong. Second, they must feel sorrow at having committed the act. Third, they must ask for forgiveness. This is why I don’t go about trying to convert people to Christianity.

First God must show them what they’ve done wrong. If the person agrees and performs 2 and 3 from the above paragraph, they are forgiven. If they disagree, they are allowed to continue in their relationship with said buffalo. The only problem they may encounter is in the end when God does judge.

Jesus doesn’t toss forgiveness about like a Frisbee. You have to ask for it.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:42 PM
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reply to post by Cuhail
 



Jesus and he say's "Pass, Brother".



But there is a charge that goes along with the "pass brother". That is repentance.

Jesus told the woman "Neither do I condemn you; go and sin no more"

A true realization of what you are forgiven of and the horror you are rescued from , creates a grateful attitude. Gratitude that leads to repentance and holiness. It is a process. It has been rather painful for me.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:46 PM
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Originally posted by Maya432
Is There A Conspiracy Of Atheists To Overthrow Christianity?

God I hope so. (no Pun intended)

Religion is a prison. a prison for your soul.
A reason to WAR
A way to separate us/divide us.
Pit us againts each other.
A reason to kill
to control with fear
I`m sorry if I`m stomping on your believes.
its not your fault ...I was fooled too.
and so were/are billions of others.


[edit on 15-1-2008 by Maya432]



I doubt I need to read any further than the OP and the first response to it.

Christianity is a faith not a "religion"

Christianity is not responsible for a single murder nor a single act of hate.

Are there any Christians? No. At best some of us can claim that we are "practicing" Christians.

There is plenty of room to attack any and all religions but some do a better job than others.

Sorry you and a "billion" other people have been fooled by throwing out the baby with the bath water.


I wonder how many people hate us "American's" or blame us for every evil thing our religion does. (our religion is our Federal Government)
How do you like being a part of this religion?
Do you feel a bit defensive when someone hates you because you are an American? What exactly is an American and what did you do that caused them to hate you enough to kill you on sight? Oh, thats right, your evil religion. Your Pope is George Bush.

If nothing else....understand that Christianity is 1) not a religion but a faith and most importantly 2) many, many, many, people that claim they are a Christian wouldn't even know how to recognize one let alone know what it means to be one.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 07:56 PM
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Originally posted by Res Ipsa

Originally posted by Maya432

If nothing else....understand that Christianity is 1) not a religion but a faith and most importantly 2) many, many, many, people that claim they are a Christian wouldn't even know how to recognize one let alone know what it means to be one.


And of course your interpretation of Jesus's word is the only true defanition of the Christian faith.

Seems to have a familiar tone to it.

[edit on 8/4/08 by Freeborn]



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 08:02 PM
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Therefore, it comes down to me forgiving me for my sins? Ahhhh. Jesus says "Yeah, you pass, but, look what you've done. Are you truly sorry for humping the buffalo?" And, as long as I see the wrongness of the sin, AND, feel bad for it, I can pass?

I'll take purgatory (or whatever). I have no need for anyone to pass judgement on me. God either. I'll deal with him when he meets me at the crossroads. Until then, it's up to ME to decide what's right and wrong. Not a book 2000+ years old, written and arranged by men who lived in different times dealing with different people under different circumstances.

I'm not so gullable, myself. I have faith in ME to make the right decisions when it counts. I do so everyday. God just watches, I suppose, writing down all my "sins" as I go along here on Earth. That's okay, he can write it all down for me to review.
Life is a series of decisions. He knows that, I would assume. Or he wouldn't of given us freewill. He also gave us the ability to see the difference between good and evil. What decision we make concerning that difference is the answer.
I almost envy atheists. They have the freedom to make decisions without God looking over their shoulder.
I'm more the agnostic/Deist type. I think EVERYBODY'S wrong and won't really find out until death.
I'm happy to wait.

Meh, I think too much.


Cuhail



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by Bigwhammy
 


And of course you assume you have hte magic holy spirit decoder ring. And no doubt everyone of other denominations who read hte bible different than you are satan-worshiping miscreants who've got it all wrong?

Mmmm, sorry, no. Isn't this the same sort of mentality that led to the protestant movement, with the priesthood claiming they and they alone were divinely imbued enough to comprehend scripture?

Why not just come out and say it? You're unable to bear the thought that someone who disagrees with you might have a valid point. So you shoot down the notion that anyone could possibly disagree with you and have a point by claiming you, and you alone are capable of properly understanding scripture.

Intellectual cowardice at its finest.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 



But it is not a intellectual debate. You guys want to drag it into that arena because that is all you know. That is your limitation not mine. The Bible is a spiritual book. I can't have a spiritual conversation with an atheist who by definition doesn't even believe in a spirit. That's why you can not comprehend it. It is just a waste of time.



posted on Apr, 8 2008 @ 11:24 PM
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Um, not exactly. First one has to understand that “humping a buffalo” is wrong. Second, they must feel sorrow at having committed the act. Third, they must ask for forgiveness. This is why I don’t go about trying to convert people to Christianity.

First God must show them what they’ve done wrong. If the person agrees and performs 2 and 3 from the above paragraph, they are forgiven. If they disagree, they are allowed to continue in their relationship with said buffalo. The only problem they may encounter is in the end when God does judge.

Jesus doesn’t toss forgiveness about like a Frisbee. You have to ask for it.


Exactly! Not to mention there are consequences to every decision. Using the buffalo analogy, if one continues to hump the buffalo, one must also be prepared for the consequences of the buffalo becoming fed up with it, turning around and stomping the humper. Life is like that, ya know.

If one continues in one's wrong-headed decisions, 'especially' after one has concluded the act is wrong, one must also be willing to live with the consequences of said incorrect decision. Some call it kharma. I call it "what goes around comes around". That part of it is really just a fact of existence.



posted on Apr, 9 2008 @ 12:04 AM
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Originally posted by idle_rocker

If one continues in one's wrong-headed decisions, 'especially' after one has concluded the act is wrong, one must also be willing to live with the consequences of said incorrect decision. Some call it kharma. I call it "what goes around comes around". That part of it is really just a fact of existence.


THAT was the most fantastic thing I've EVER heard you say! That is exactly how I lead my life. Beautifully said.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now, for the record, I've never humped the buffalo. It was, indeed, an analogy and the U2U's from members interested in livestock HAS to end!

You know who you are!











I'm kidding, there were no U2Us. Had y'all going there for a second, though, huh?


Cuhail



posted on Apr, 9 2008 @ 12:45 AM
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reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 


Walking Fox,

You made this statement here


Orange Tom's description of non-believers as "wildlife") who need to be exterminated or subsumed for the good of the "real" human beings, starting with the Jews who will be slaughtered en masse by a sword-tongued, fire-eyed, golden-footed Jesus who will then cast their bodies and souls into a flaming pit of filth to wail and gnash their teeth for eternity, then yes, I suppose that the thought that other religions plan the same for you is pretty reasonable.

I find it sad that otherwise rational human beings swallow this swill, and do so willingly, and then eagerly press it onto their children. Of course, I suppose it's better than what many Christians end up pressing into their children, but that's a topic for another time.


While I made the statement about the world being as "Wildlife", I made no such statement as extermination or being subsumed. I do not know where you get this type of tangent or drama but it is not attributable to me. I did say ...to seperate from the world...not to do as the world around us does. Yet you are wont to describe the behavior of the world to me...or others. Howbeit that this is so??

This type of Jerry Springer drama is a huge leap Walking Fox. From where did you get this?? I too find this type of conduct very sad.

You also made this statement here.


Why not just come out and say it? You're unable to bear the thought that someone who disagrees with you might have a valid point. So you shoot down the notion that anyone could possibly disagree with you and have a point by claiming you, and you alone are capable of properly understanding scripture.

Intellectual cowardice at its finest.


I have not seen BigWhammy make the statement that he and he alone is capable of understanding/comprehending the Bible. From whence did you get this exaggeration or is this a misdirection?? He did imply that unbelievers or those not in the same Spirit cannot understand it. He did not say that he alone understands/comprehends it. Howbeit that your type of intellectual dishonesty is not misdirection or even the fingerprint you try to imprint on others??

This is twice I have seen you do this or carry out this type of fingerprint. How do you justify this while labeling those with which you disagree..intellectual cowards??

Freeborn,
You too are attempting the same tack as did Walking Fox. It looks like good drama but it is not. It is exaggeration and misdirection. One can get this on the television and radio on political discussion. Exaggeration and misdirection.


Dark Elf,
IT has been awhile. Hope all is well at your location. Good to see your posts again.


For the Christian, no explanation is necessary. For the rest, no explanation is enough. Sometimes, you just have to brush the dust from your feet.


Well said Dark Elf..well said and with an economy of words.


Orangetom


[edit on 9-4-2008 by orangetom1999]



posted on Apr, 9 2008 @ 01:15 AM
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Originally posted by BigwhammyThe Bible is a spiritual book. I can't have a spiritual conversation with an atheist who by definition doesn't even believe in a spirit. That's why you can not comprehend it. It is just a waste of time.

This has been said time and time before but people can indeed be spiritual without believing in god/s. The concept of spirituality does not require god.

[edit on 9-4-2008 by riley]



posted on Apr, 9 2008 @ 10:29 AM
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Yes it has Riley. It has been said time and time again. THe connection to which Big Whammy refers is with the Spirit of the Bible. It is not with the spirit of this world or men or gods...but God.
However...unlike Walking Fox and Freeborn ...and to your credit you do not attempt to misdirect here. You are correct ..there are lots of spirits out here...lots of spirituality.
Riley. I will add to your statement by saying or declaring that having spirituality without believing in a god implys that human values and human spirituality is the ultimate reality in the universe. Among some this would be to what is refered as demigod status.
Unless my read of history is incorrect...demigod status is the basis of most feudalism...divine right of kings etc etc. It is also the basis of Romanism.
This can be a fine line.

Thanks for your post,
Orangetom



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