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Is There A Conspiracy Of Atheists To Overthrow Christianity?

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posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 06:28 PM
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Originally posted by Gigatronix
I starred his post because it was on topic, had minimal editorial/ spin and presented the information very clearly.


Hey! None of my business! You can star anyone you want.



yeah I made the "wiki must be in on the conspiracy joke" mostly because I knew somebody would not accept it, and made apreemptive joke. It was just a joke, my apologies if this offended anyone.


You never, ever have to worry about offending me, Gigster. I understood it was a tongue in cheek comment. Not offended- only surprised. That alone wasn't enough to give me a double take. It was the next comment about the CIA link that seemed skewed once one compared both of your comments. No worries either way. Just pointing out something that seemed odd.

[edit on 3/29/2008 by AshleyD]




posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 06:32 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 
My bad, I assumed wrong, my mistake. So tell me what exactly it is that they're working on that you don't like, and if that matter qualifies as a conspiracy in your opinion. Don't mean to soudns like I'm demanding something from you Ash, I am genuinely interested in what particular things on those websites bother you, and how you qualify conspiracies.



posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 06:36 PM
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post removed for serious violation of ATS Terms & Conditions



posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 06:45 PM
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reply to post by Gigatronix
 


No worries. And here is a brief answer of just a few of the things the organizations do that make it look like they are no longer fighting only for their rights but to meddle in the business of others:

1) The legislation they are working on to retract churches tax exempt status.

2) The books they are constantly writing- but not about atheism. Much of their material is only criticism of religions and churches.

3). Their attempt at historical revision HERE.

4). Their goal of pushing separation of church and state too far by doing things like protesting religious gatherings because they were on public property.

That's just off the top off my . and from what I remember seeing it when I posted the links some months back on this thread. Never really spent too much time on the sites.



posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by AshleyD
 





[edit on 29-3-2008 by jmdewey60]

I believe this is exactly the kind of posting that the mods have warned against.
There is nothing to be gained from these kinds of accusations.

[edit on 29-3-2008 by sizzle]



posted on Mar, 29 2008 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
I'm not sure what 2 websites and 20,000 supposed people that are members of an un-named group are supposed to prove.


Then seriously, stop wasting your and our time.

sizzle was right, you just keep changing the goal post to avoid actual debate... 'oh us crazy atheists are out to get you!'

'there are groups that are...'

'oh sureeee show me proof lol lol lol'

'ok... here are some examples.'

'oh pff those are just links lol lol lol'

Yawn. Ignoring.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:24 AM
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Originally posted by NewWorldOver

Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
I'm not sure what 2 websites and 20,000 supposed people that are members of an un-named group are supposed to prove.


Then seriously, stop wasting your and our time.

sizzle was right, you just keep changing the goal post to avoid actual debate... 'oh us crazy atheists are out to get you!'

'there are groups that are...'

'oh sureeee show me proof lol lol lol'

'ok... here are some examples.'

'oh pff those are just links lol lol lol'

Yawn. Ignoring.


Yeah it was that same thing in the 666 thread where he kept insisting someone show him where this 666 mark of the beast was in the Bible, while never once substantiating his claims regarding the significance of the 666 in his own life. I got my own ideas about that, however I didn't bother asking. Eventually, when no one would offer the scripture for the 666. (we all figured why bother ) He couldn't resist, so he offers the passage himself (as if he just found it in there for the first time) then he did exactly what we assumed he would do and discredited it as having no significance because the bible was written by men hence not worthy of his consideration.

One wonders if he feels the same way about all texts written by man which would include any post you make that would impeach his as wrong or in error. Hence the failsafe.

You'll see the subtle suggestions as the perceptive Ashley has already attempted second guessing his next post but even that won't work on this person. He wants to be treated special asking that you just simply answer questions already asked and answered that wou'd never fly in a court of law. One of the most common phrases you hear in Court is the phrase "asked and answered your honor ".

This conspiracy he is slowly defining as having to be "Crazy Atheists" in a conspiracy he assumes must take a "magic number" of people who must have a desire to "kill" all Christians slowly and methodically changing the conditions of just what a conspiracy is making it more and more impossible to substantiate.

Each time you answer without correcting the nuances added, this denialist, sets a precedent that assumes you have agreed to.

You will see him bring it up again showing you must have agreed to said conditions else why didn't you mention it before. You see a lot of that kind of thing on an L-sat, but I'd have to say Atheist's have made it a fine art. I call it their Teflon Double Speak, their patent signature style of debate.

Then as you get frustrated, they are quick to hit the alert key as soon as you use too many Caps in a sentence, or they will instantly take up the nasty behaviour of Christians in an attempt to give you a "kinder gentler" Christian reputation to live up to.

Trust me,, the minus points I have I lost without one single regret. They just hate it that I call them on it. Now since some of the other Christians have also figured this out, rather the go back to the meek gracious and confused loser of the debate their feelings went from frustration to anger which is always a secondary emotion.

Sometimes expressed as carefully as one can without tossing out as many expletives as they could think of. Now talking to atheists has become an act of walking on eggshells. Until I can go through a discussion without being accused of child abuse about as big a personal insult as you can assault someone with for raising my kids as a Christian,, I will assume that eggshell walk is as one sided as it is orchestrated.

Which is another conspiracy altogether.

Regarding the argumentative styling's of exitbul_boy, I tried to tell you guys the best thing you can do for that one is hit

the ignore button.

- Con















[edit on 30-3-2008 by Conspiriology]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:48 AM
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Please.


Stay on Topic.


Everyone.



Cuhail



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 01:14 AM
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Religion is just a creation by humans, no more.

Most people that are brought up with religious parents are usually the strongest believers in god. The teachings which occur during one's childhood are the most influential towards the rest of his or her life.

Religion was created a long time ago to keep people together, to give them faith, and a reason to live. To conjure up images of bliss after life and other fantasies of the mind. The workings of Heaven evidently shows many aspects which were created by nothing other than the human mind itself. From our prospective, in general, higher is superior and lower is inferior. Humans have always been fascinated by the skies. What better place for this "Heaven" to be then right there, up high in the clouds?

Religious leaders are nothing more than just humans. They are human beings, biologically the same as us. Their brains are made of the same stuff and functions the same way as anyone else. Just because they go to a building called a church every week and read from a book does not make them superior than anyone else, nor does it cast about them any sort of holy aura that gives them any sort of connection to a divine being.

In fact when I was a Christian a long time back, the pastor invited me over to his house for dinner. This guy was supposedly a very holy man and considered by many to be able to talk directly to God. During dinner, I saw that he had a hunting rifle on his wall. I said "What's that for?" and he replied "Oh, just for sport. Hunting game, you know." I don't think he's very "holy" for killing animals for entertainment.

And no, that event has nothing at all to do with my later decision to become an Atheist. It was simple logic and realization of the hidden brutality of religion that awakened my senses.

I've seen religion tear apart countries. I've seen religion kill people. I've seen very religious (therefore brainwashed) individuals whom have killed people after they go to church every Sunday and give commitment to "God" to be a person of purity (which I'm sure does not include being a murderer).

And lots of Christianity I just think is total BS. Jesus, some guy that walks over water? That is just plain human fantasy.

And you know, Christians used quite some violent methods to "convert" non-Christians over to Christianity. Murdering and torturing, for example.

What's worse, they actually believe that they're doing god a favor.

Well I'll tell you something, any god that thinks non-Christians should burn in some place (also made up) called Hell is a heartless god and very resemblant of a human tyrant. Christianity has been around for how long? Compared to how many other religions that have come long before it?

And Christianity claims that Earth and humans have been around for how long? I forget...is it 6,000 years? That's quite a short time, considering solid scientific proof in countless cases shows that Earth has been around for much, much longer, and humans evolved from earlier forms of life, they weren't just put down onto the planet by some enormous, mighty hand.

In fact it's not an Atheist conspiracy against Christians...I believe it's more of an effort to try and get some brainwashed folk to open their eyes to the real world. That there are no fairytale angels flying about us and that we aren't ruled by some invisible entity that somehow kills people that don't believe in him.

We are humans, and are not chained to this non-existent being. And stop thinking it, I'm not going be struck down by god with his almighty lightning. Lightning is caused by an atmospheric discharge involving electricity, not a guy sitting on a cloud who shoots lasers out of his eyes.

Be free. Not a slave.

Edit: Just wanted to say, don't take anything personally. I know it sounded harsh, but it came from my heart and I'm not part of some secret conspiracy group. I'm just a dad who has a normal life, normal family, and works for a computer programming company. Peace out.

~Greg

[edit on 30-3-2008 by morgul]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 01:50 AM
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Originally posted by morgul
Religion is just a creation by humans, no more.

Most people that are brought up with religious parents are usually the strongest believers in god. The teachings which occur during one's childhood are the most influential towards the rest of his or her life.

Religion was created a long time ago to keep people together, to give them faith, and a reason to live. To conjure up images of bliss after life and other fantasies of the mind. The workings of Heaven evidently shows many aspects which were created by nothing other than the human mind itself. From our prospective, in general, higher is superior and lower is inferior. Humans have always been fascinated by the skies. What better place for this "Heaven" to be then right there, up high in the clouds?

Religious leaders are nothing more than just humans. They are human beings, biologically the same as us. Their brains are made of the same stuff and functions the same way as anyone else. Just because they go to a building called a church every week and read from a book does not make them superior than anyone else, nor does it cast about them any sort of holy aura that gives them any sort of connection to a divine being.





In fact when I was a Christian a long time back, the pastor invited me over to his house for dinner. This guy was supposedly a very holy man and considered by many to be able to talk directly to God. During dinner, I saw that he had a hunting rifle on his wall. I said "What's that for?" and he replied "Oh, just for sport. Hunting game, you know." I don't think he's very "holy" for killing animals for entertainment.


It never ceases to amaze me how much people who do not believe in the concept of God much less a real one, would have such intimate knowledge of how one should behave. While at the same time suggesting the one we are talking about was invented by men. Men just like you and I that surely would have invented one that didn't punish those who had rejected his only Son's bloody excruciating sacrifice to avoid that hell of our own choosing. Who on earth would create such a thing.



And no, that event has nothing at all to do with my later decision to become an Atheist. It was simple logic and realization of the hidden brutality of religion that awakened my senses.


They didn't awaken your senses, they offered an excuse to renounce a God you found was too mean and cramped your lifestyle. If you want to get into the "who was more violent" debate, Atheist's lose that one by millions and millions.



I've seen religion tear apart countries. I've seen religion kill people. I've seen very religious (therefore brainwashed) individuals whom have killed people after they go to church every Sunday and give commitment to "God" to be a person of purity (which I'm sure does not include being a murderer).


Therefore, then you would be in favor of a conspiracy to overthrow Region would you not? I mean I am just trying to get you to take responsibility of your statements unless of course this is all lip service? Why go on rambling if you aren't going to do anything about it right?



And lots of Christianity I just think is total BS. Jesus, some guy that walks over water? That is just plain human fantasy.


Consequently, is evolutions idea that frogs turn into princes and that life came from nothingness.



And you know, Christians used quite some violent methods to "convert" non-Christians over to Christianity. Murdering and torturing, for example.

What's worse, they actually believe that they're doing god a favor.


Yes I know which is why today we just water board them into the faith.



Well I'll tell you something, any god that thinks non-Christians should burn in some place (also made up) called Hell is a heartless god and very resemblant of a human tyrant.


Well,, he does say we are made in his image and that means many personality traits too. Non Christians is sort of a mis-nomer,, It should be called Heaven Rejectionists or those drowning rejecting the life preserver merely because it was tossed to them by someone they don't like.




Christianity has been around for how long? Compared to how many other religions that have come long before it?


Your point?



And Christianity claims that Earth and humans have been around for how long? I forget...Is it 6,000 years? That's quite a short time, considering solid scientific proof in countless cases shows that Earth has been around for much, much longer, and humans evolved from earlier forms of life, they weren't just put down onto the planet by some enormous, mighty hand.


Wrong on both counts and unless you want to believe in the many many hoax's of Darwinist's that have been easily proven as fraud and basically Bunk.



In fact it's not an Atheist conspiracy against Christians...I believe it's more of an effort to try and get some brainwashed folk to open their eyes to the real world. That there are no fairytale angels flying about us and that we aren't ruled by some invisible entity that somehow kills people that don't believe in him.


You call it an effort because it sounds nicer then conspiracy but we get the drift nevertheless. As for the rest of that quote? Who said anything about a God that kills anyone or one that is ruling us? Did you not say all that stuff without a lightening bolt hitting you? Sounds to me like that God is allowing you to choose your own destiny until the day you die and an eternity after.



We are humans, and are not chained to this non-existent being. And stop thinking it, I'm not going be struck down by god with his almighty lightning. Lightning is caused by an atmospheric discharge involving electricity, not a guy sitting on a cloud who shoots lasers out of his eyes.


We are humans? Ok. I never felt chained. I know what lightening is but who said figuring out how lightening works, disproves the one who invented it?



Be free. Not a slave.


Ok



Edit: Just wanted to say, don't take anything personally. I know it sounded harsh, but it came from my heart and I'm not part of some secret conspiracy group. I'm just a dad who has a normal life, normal family, and works for a computer programming company. Peace out.


No offense taken, and from one software developer to another,,

Take care and

God Bless

- Con






[edit on 30-3-2008 by Conspiriology]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 07:09 AM
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reply to post by Conspiriology
 




Regarding the argumentative styling's of exitbul_boy, I tried to tell you guys the best thing you can do for that one is hit

the ignore button.


Of course this is your solution.
If you can't win an argument with someone, ignore them or....take you ball and go home

And Ashley....you say you gave me what I asked for and I still wasn't happy. NO. You didn't give me what I asked for. I asked for the NAME of one organization of Atheists that have enough numbers to be a concern to anyone. You didn't provide that. You again, provided two websites and a mention of a supposed group of 20,000 Americans that have no name and there was no mention of even where they are or who they are......so if we were to act like Cosmotologist, we could say that in a court of law, that wouldn't stand up at all....blah blah blah "I think there is a question on the Lsat about that...."


Here is some fascinating information on some fascinating Christians:

www.cnn.com...
Here is one church with 30 million members run by a sexual deviant. You see, these are real numbers. 30 million members is a number to be concerned about.

Here is one the scariest Christians on the planet:



That was the other thing you mentioned Ashley. You say it is so horrible that some "Atheists" want churches to start paying taxes. It's churches of the like run by Benny Hinn that cause many people, not just Atheists, to have these churches pay taxes. This church of Benny Hinn's and all of the ones like his are businesses run by con-artists and these con-artists are laughng all the way to the bank with ridiculous amounts of money. Isn't it awful that some people have stepped up and want these scum-bags to pay taxes. Anyone who wants a church to pay taxes MUST be an Atheist, right?

Here's an interesting story:
www.commondreams.org...

It's about a law suit against the Pentagon, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, and a US Army major regarding forcing Christianity on a soldier that is Atheist. Isn't this against the Constitution? Do you all know what the Constitution is? Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Religion and all that.

Now, the US Government and the US Army, what kind of combined numbers are we talking here? Now that is some scary power! But let's all FEAR those Atheists. There are so many of them and they are so organized that no one can provide any information with names of groups and numbers of members but let's put the FEAR OF GOD into everyone and go after them scary Atheists. I mean we all have to have someone to hate right? It's politically incorrect for you Christians to hate Jews, right? So now let's go after the people with no religion and no God. They MUST be evil and they must be STOPPED. They have websites!! They have 20,000 Americans somewhere. We're not sure where but they are out there.

I don't want my kids to be in school with some scary Atheists but it is okay for my kids to go to churches run by sexual deviants and con-artists. This makes sense to you all?




[edit on 30-3-2008 by Excitable_Boy]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
Of course this is your solution.
If you can't win an argument with someone, ignore them or....take you ball and go home


And that's all it is to you. An argument.

You're not interested in debate, you want to argue. So you spew a bunch of lol smileys and make childish provocations. Keep it up, I'm sure the mods will do their job



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 10:05 AM
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reply to post by NewWorldOver
 




And that's all it is to you. An argument.

You're not interested in debate, you want to argue


An argument is a debate. Do you understand the definition of the word "argument?"

Here, I'll help (from dictionary.com):



Argument:

1. an oral disagreement; verbal opposition; contention; altercation: a violent argument.
2. a discussion involving differing points of view; debate: They were deeply involved in an argument about inflation.
3. a process of reasoning; series of reasons: I couldn't follow his argument.
4. a statement, reason, or fact for or against a point: This is a strong argument in favor of her theory.
5. an address or composition intended to convince or persuade; persuasive discourse.



You call it a debate. I'll call it an argument. It's the same thing.

[edit on 30-3-2008 by Excitable_Boy]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 10:10 AM
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Let us return to the topic, and leave off with the semantics.

And personal opinions about each other.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 10:21 AM
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Here's a pretty scary Christian cabal right here:



The Catholic Church and George Bush. Pretty scary. The Catholic Church has always been more of a political organization than a religious one.

Here are some scary numbers regarding the amount of Christians in the world:

Catholic - 1.1 Billion (that's a number I would worry about. You're worried about Atheists?)
Protestant - 800 Million
Eastern Orthodox - 260 Million
Oriental Orthodox - 79 Million
Nontrinitarian - 13 million
Nestorianism - 1 million

source: en.wikipedia.org...

That's over 2 Billion people. Add to that: How many Jews? How many Muslims? How many Buddhists? How many Pagans? Etc....

Now...how many Atheists are there? You are all worried about Atheists?


Will you all only be happy when EVERYONE is a Christian (and an acceptable form of Christian)?

[edit on 30-3-2008 by Excitable_Boy]



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 10:25 AM
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A conspiracy of atheists to over-throw Christianity?

God, I hope so. The reason for my hope is that many Christians are so misled by their ministers and such.... its not really their fault because this is exactly what happens when you let other do your thinking and believing for you. Christ, even Christ said this!!!!!

It does appear that over-throwing is the only solution to dealing with a problem and even over-throwing is only a temporary solution so history has proven over and over and over and over and over over and over again.

Christ is not coming back. If Christ had anything to say right now at this moment I believe it would be something like this:

God- I did what you asked and I even took it a bit further to prove the point. They don't get it. You phucked up- don't take it out on them because it won't do any good and nor will it make any difference. Now, please fill the holes in my hands, feet and my side- because I am leaking all over the place and it's becoming very embarrassing for me!

Leave those people alone because you did screw that one up all by yourself- its not your fault either because all you do is create- and it is not always wonderful btw.

My point is they will do themselves in and yes it will be sad and we will cry.... wait a minute....what is that... that is soooooooo cool.

God says- Jesus, I want to stay on topic for a minute.

Jesus says- why.....that is soooo cool.... what is that over there? Its incredible I have I have never seen anything like it....

God says.... Well the other day I had this idea and.....

Meanwhile back on Earth:

Jesus said this and Jesus meant that... Oh, no he didn't- and just for saying that you are going to hell when He gets back here He will tell you himself...Oh no he won't he is gonna tell you a thing or two and you are gonna really find out what he meant only you are not gonna know it until you smell your butt roasting on a spit in Hell!!!

Well Mohammed said this....

Both Christian (actually you can insert any relion here!) in unison... Can you believe this idiot... oh, we have to save him... he just doesn't know- it our duty to get past our bickering and work in Christ...You know, Helen you are right!

Poof!



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:03 PM
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Happy to see no one was offended by my previous post.(by the lack of any relys)
I will try to state my opinion in a less offensive way.
Seems to me the real conspiricy against Christianity comes in the way of a false sense of security in the hearts of most believers.
Athiests, actualy presenting themselves as athiests, to me, pose no threat, unless you live in China.
The real threat to Christianity, in my opinion, is the feeling of apathy.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:16 PM
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Originally posted by dk3000
A conspiracy of atheists to over-throw Christianity?

God, I hope so. The reason for my hope is that many Christians are so misled by their ministers and such....Poof!



Are you an atheist?
If so, you are proving the op's point.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:24 PM
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Originally posted by Excitable_Boy
And Ashley....you say you gave me what I asked for and I still wasn't happy. NO. You didn't give me what I asked for. I asked for the NAME of one organization of Atheists that have enough numbers to be a concern to anyone. You didn't provide that. You again, provided two websites and a mention of a supposed group of 20,000 Americans that have no name and there was no mention of even where they are or who they are.


I did give you 'a name' and went the extra mile to link you to their websites. But let's not worry about the links this time since you are only looking for 'a name.' In that case, here it is, sans linky. And since you are emphasizing 'one' and I do not want to mess up by going above an beyond once again, here is only 'one:'

American Atheists.



posted on Mar, 30 2008 @ 12:26 PM
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Originally posted by Clearskies

Originally posted by dk3000
A conspiracy of atheists to over-throw Christianity?

God, I hope so. The reason for my hope is that many Christians are so misled by their ministers and such....Poof!



Are you an atheist?
If so, you are proving the op's point.

Not really. Someone saying "I hope so" doesn't prove atheists are conspiring.. might prove he/she doesn't like christianity though.

[edit on 30-3-2008 by riley]



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