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Is There A Conspiracy Of Atheists To Overthrow Christianity?

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posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 10:30 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


Sadly the comic is pretty close to truth. We have no shortage of religious people (not just Christians) who claim that calling htem on their bigotry is in itself being bigoted towards them.

So I think the question is... What makes you think the comic you posted "bashes Christians"?




posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 10:30 PM
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Originally posted by NewWorldOver

Originally posted by riley
Many atheists are ex theists.


This is the second time I have heard this assertion. Again, I have to disagree.

If a person goes from being 'theist' to 'atheist' then they have failed at theism. Is this not correct?

In reality, they were never 'theists'. They might have subscribed to an organized religion and an external form of worship (which yields no enlightenment). This is understandable, even 'religious' people are in this rut.

There is no reason to assume that a person never believed just because they became atheists. If that were the case babies wouldn't be born 'non-believers' [atheists].


But true 'theism' is an intense study of consciousness, and our connection to one another to a single source.

..and I noticed you completely ignored the rest of my post and nitpicked what was convenient. Indeed I do believe we are all connected.. I just do not believe in a superior sentient being.
Lets review my post again:

In fact I am very spiritual. I think atheists have said this a few times now but it keeps getting ignored. I do not believe in god/s.. this does not mean I am not spiritual. Unless you think buddhists are not spiritual..?
I believe every living thing on the planet is decended from a single cell. Technically that makes the birds.. even the plants my family so yes I feel a profound connection to all life which I hold a deep respect for. I just don't feel a need to worship it.


See where I say I feel connected to everything? ^


Every major religion intends for the 'follower' to be personal with God, and not fall for the material world.

Incorrect. The concept of god does not save people from materialism.. if that were the case churches wouldn't have collection plates.
You also ignored the part where I said buddhism [a form of atheism] is spiritual.

AGAIN:

Spirituality does not equal belief in god. Atheists can be spiritual.

Please re-read that as you keep being told this over and over again yet keep ignoring it.

Now.. madness, meletonin and myself [and probably others] have already answered all your arguments adequately. Unfortuantly every time we do so.. you turn around and rephrase those same tired arguments forcing us to repeat ourselves. The answers are not going to change to suit your ignorant misconceptions of athiests so please open your mind a bit accept and respect our answers otherwise this discussion will never evolve.

[edit on 6-2-2008 by riley]



posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by skyshow
What motivated you to post that? I guess then, in light of a long history of passive aggressive posts on here (as someone else even pointed out last week about your posts) I am wondering what that has to do with anything...in other words why did you post that, and given that basic void of little meaning interpretation I have to ask, what did it do for you to post that?


This might shock you personally but there are people in this world with the ability to laugh at the stereotypes assigned to them or laugh at themselves in general. Not everyone says, "I'm so offended!" over every little thing. A lot of people view all Christians like the above cartoon depicts. This thread is to show the bias against Christians but sometimes we don't see how we're just as guilty. You have claimed several times how offended you get at certain things but apparently don't realize the condescending tone you often use. You have stated you think I do the same thing. You're probably even right. Everyone does it even if they want to think they're innocent.

[edit on 2/5/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 10:53 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


Are you saying then that my initial interpretation of the cartoon is correct? Because I assumed that is what it was about -- but no way were you going to let a wrench get in your spokes and so you quickly spun it into something you can't possible defend--(and in order for it have any redeeming humor value potential whatsoever based on how you interpret it to be the two people must be equal in some way, and I am saying they are not...as both did not choose who they are), and even demonstrated the difference in humor regarding a person who chooses a religion or political party verses the one being poked fun of through no choice of their own (the homosexual), I then posted a story further to back up the point about how a certain percentage of Rams were homosexual and being studied by researchers....are you saying people who are Christian are born that way? Because I thought you had to accept Jesus as your personal savior and be baptized...

I'm saying it's ok to make satire regarding belief systems or political ideologies, but it crosses the line and falls into the "bigot" category and ceases to be funny when it is based on someone's disability, race, or sexual orientation.

You instead think it's ok to lighten up as it were, and enjoy a good laugh here or there, but I don't think I'm being uptight if I don't laugh at a gay joke, or a racial joke, or joke about someone being blind or what have you.

Really, most people understand this. I find it odd and unusual that it needs to be explained in response to your post that clearly indicates a lack of common understanding...but if you want others to think your socially inept and in general a big ol' arse, keep telling these types of jokes whenever you're out amongst people in the real world...

Early nineteenth century poet Thomas Moore wrote "But Faith, fanatic faith, once wedded fast to some dear falsehood, hugs it to the last".

[edit on 5-2-2008 by skyshow]

[edit on 5-2-2008 by skyshow]



posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 11:16 PM
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reply to post by skyshow
 


Here's an idea. Instead of me explaining it a third time, ask THIS GUY. When it doubt, it's always best to get as close to the source as possible. Please voice your concerns to this young man as he is obviously very confused and cannot see past his bigotry against homosexuals and Christians. Apparently that is what you believe if that is your interpretation. Perhaps he will have better luck explaining it to you. Oh, let him know he is generalizing Christians, too, while you are on your crusade. Thanks in advance for your support in this sensitive issue. I still don't remotely see how any sane person could honestly think that cartoon is depicting the homosexual as the bad guy. Sometimes you make me wonder.

Moving along...


Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
Sadly the comic is pretty close to truth. We have no shortage of religious people (not just Christians) who claim that calling htem on their bigotry is in itself being bigoted towards them.


Maybe you can explain this to Skyshow who seems to be having some difficulty understanding what it depicts.


So I think the question is... What makes you think the comic you posted "bashes Christians"?


I don't. It might be generalizing but not "bashing." Didn't see your above comment when I explained this already. You probably submitted at the same time I did. It points out exactly how you explained it above. We don't like others for doing what we do ourselves. See: HERE

[edit on 2/5/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 11:25 PM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


What I don't understand is why you posted it in the first place?



posted on Feb, 5 2008 @ 11:37 PM
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reply to post by skyshow
 


Because I felt like it? To be a good sport? To show Christians can laugh at ourselves? To show we can laugh at the stereotypes of Bible thumpers?

Look at the source, Skyshow. Does that look like a homosexuality bashing blog? No. Does that look like an Atheism bashing blog? No. Does that look like a Christian bashing blog? Bingo. He was ranting and laughing at us and I (*gasp*) found it funny, too. Homosexuality is not the target even if that is what is going on in your own little reality. No one else has seen it that way but you. Should I be offended by that blogger's generalization? It's my right to be but I'm not offended remotely. Honestly, I wonder how you function in every day life with such thin skin.

How can anyone have a logical and friendly discussion with someone whose views are obviously so distorted and biased? It's like playing Solitaire with ten missing cards. A full deck does not exist in either case. It would be a pointless effort in either case.

I've seen people try to show you kindness while disagreeing with you or even agree with you completely but you still turn it all around and act completely snotty with them when it becomes obvious they are a Christian. Not much else I can do for you. I've seen you do it over and over again. No one can successfully debate the Mad Hatter which is how you are coming across.

[edit on 2/6/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 12:29 AM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


I know how I view it, and because you posted it here in this thread and in the context of the continued discussion (we here in this thread had no prior knowledge of the context that it was posted in that person's post) it's not unreasonable for one to question the motivation behind why you posted it.

You want us to believe you did it to show that you are a "good sport" and are seeing things from the "other side's" perspective? And then go back to quoting bible passages and saying we are wrong?

What is the significance of that? The triangle and the cross symbol: what do those things represent to you? You just out of the blue decided to post this here in this thread for no reason other than you thought it was funny from the other sides perspective??? huh? You expect me to believe this?

Now that is the funny thing with this. That cartoon is utterly ridiculous and totally stupid and does not in any way suggest atheists are conspiring against Christians, or if it does it assumes that all homosexuals are athiests.



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 12:37 AM
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reply to post by skyshow
 


You know, I have to wonder if you have a bet going or something here, because you seem to be taking an internet message board just a bit TOO seriously. Step back, take a breath.

I don't think Ashley was trying to send any "secret messages" or whatever.



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by skyshow
I know how I view it, and because you posted it here in this thread and in the context of the continued discussion (we here in this thread had no prior knowledge of the context that it was posted in that person's post)...


Because it is so obvious no context was really needed, or so I thought. Didn't realize there were spin doctors floating around in the wings.


You want us to believe you did it to show that you are a "good sport" and are seeing things from the "other side's" perspective? And then go back to quoting bible passages and saying we are wrong?


I don't really care what you believe but when did I quote the Bible? Not that it isn't my right but you have said this so many times it's getting uncomfortable. Are you hallucinating, Skyshow? Where did I quote Bible passages after posting that? Get off it already. On another thread you said the only thing I ever post is Bible verses. Come on, already.

And how can we know my intentions? Probably reading the accompanying text I posted originally:


"Anyways, if you look around, you'll see some pretty bad jokes made at the expense of Christians. It all comes around and goes around to everyone.

I'll leave you one more to laugh at that takes a swing at us Bible thumpers:"


Look at THIS member's post in between our conversation. It was a horribly ignorant thing to say but I ignored it. Why aren't you jumping on his butt? Go for it, Skyshow. Show us your intolerance for all bigotry great and small. I guarantee you if I said something like that you'd be in a tizzy. So let him know what you think about bigotry and then get back to me.

[edit on 2/6/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 01:16 AM
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Originally posted by ModernDystopia

You assault my logic with fariy tales. I assault your fantasy world with fact and reason and I do so in a scathing matter.


Would this be the same logic that says so many illogical dichotomy's when asking questions like "Can God create a rock he can not lift!"

Or the same tactics used to attack Christianity, they use to defend Atheism, such as this Brilliant piece of garble. " If Atheism is a Religion then NOT collecting stamps is a HOBBY!" Wow! yeah I see this so called logic being used all the time. Well,, give it your best shot but I warn ya I am not your typical nicey nice Christian ESPECIALLY when confronted by a Spam Hairless disciple. Ill tell you the only logic that you have is the logic you understand and you understand that statement about stamp collecting and are part of a "clique" of militants who are actually impressed with clever word meanings who choose to describe themselves as using logic and reason yet feel "assaulted" by my belief as if I used the same "in your face" repugnant civil behavior your leader Samantha Careless subscribes in kind.


Bible and the Koran both contain mountains of life-destroying gibberish


It's a wonder how we have survived this long without his staggering intellect, his wisdom fathoms deep with such drop dead common sense!



But we can no longer afford the luxury of such political correctness. We must finally recognize the price we are paying to maintain the iconography of our ignorance."


This is academic, it's basic Dale Carnegie common courtesy is all this requires, but you go ahead, this is JUST the kind of garbage they hate Religion for and THINK it's because we believe in something we KNOW doesn't exist. Or?? do we really believe in something that doesn't exist?



God—is one of the principal forces driving us toward the abyss."


I thought you guys didn't believe in God?



Why? Because you deserve no better. This goes for the so called "moderates" as well.


Yeah I can see the one upmanship and OH MY GOD the PURE LOGIC and REASON!

I think EVERYONE deserves a "measure" of respect

heheh I wouldn't tell anyone who says crap like that, they deserve no better. I would be more then happy to GIVE them EXACTLY what they deserve and it's been my experience,, they would not treat me with anything less then a measure of respect ever again.

Oh and by the way,, if stamp collecting were a religion then abrasively imposing your opinions for not collecting stamps would be your hobby.

Welcome to the abyss atheist.

- Con

[edit on 6-2-2008 by Conspiriology]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 01:39 AM
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reply to post by AshleyD

To quote John Stewart of the Daily Show, just after he caught Dick Cheney is a bald face lie..."It's my duty to inform you that your pants are on fire."



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 01:44 AM
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Originally posted by skyshow
To quote John Stewart of the Daily Show, just after he caught Dick Cheney is a bald face lie..."It's my duty to inform you that your pants are on fire."


That's nice. Now run along and inform this jolly fellow of the dangers of bigotry. It will be a great way to prove you are not singling anyone out and being an Anti Christian bigot. I'm rooting for you!



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 01:56 AM
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Originally posted by skyshow

I'm sorry, but I don't find that funny at all. Today we have people all over teh world killing one another in the name of religion and here is this hideous piece of filth...you aught to be ashamed of yourself!


I thought it was hilarious and I DON'T apologise for it either moreover what you think of that is none of my business. The fact is,, it hasn't been good enough for you to make a comment, you intend to give AshleyD that good ole Christian Reputation to live up to and shame her into oblivian.

Some people don't have a self concept one molecule away from being an eggshell and can laugh at how serious we take ourselves.

You hear off color jokes some that are a hundred years old but the stereotype is still true and they don't call them jokes for nothing. People laugh at them. It was self depricating humor and seeing the humor in it is something you would have to have a sense of humor to understand.

Perhaps washing your eyes out with soap will remove the filth.

- Con



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 02:15 AM
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Originally posted by Conspiriology
I thought it was hilarious and I DON'T apologise for it either moreover what you think of that is none of my business. The fact is,, it hasn't been good enough for you to make a comment, you intend to give AshleyD that good ole Christian Reputation to live up to and shame her into oblivian.


That is something that has always intrigued me. First of all, I agree. There is no reason to apologize for it which is why I have not done so as there was nothing to apologize for. If it was a cartoon about killing homosexuals or persecuting them then I should be ashamed. Even banned. But it was so obviously Christian self depreciating humor that it's actually embarrassing for anyone who gets offended or misunderstands something so simple.

But back to the intriguing part. For some reason, we've been programmed to bend over backwards for and kiss the butts of anyone who is "offended." The sentiments don't even have to be founded anymore. People are accused of making someone "offended" and it is supposed to bring immediate shame and horror. If the feelings of offense are founded, then by all means that person should apologize. But to be offended by something so innocent and downright misunderstood on one's part is embarrassing for their sake.

[edit on 2/6/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 02:38 AM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


and I simply asked you to explain to me your interpretation of it for which you replied with the link to where you got it and said I should be attacking him, but that context was not also posted with the cartoon so how should we know what the context was other than this thread material??? It may have just been an honest mistake and if so, admit to it!

I also then giving you the benefit of the doubt, asked you to tell us what those symbols meant to you, and you haven't yet done that. I also asked why you posted it in the first place, and you said because you felt like it.

What do you expect? You yourself then posted a picture of a subjective ink blot suggesting you know the concept of "subjective", and then proceed to tear me apart for my own subjective interpretation of the cartoon and suggesting it wasn't appropriate. You then need to show how it is, and by finally providing the context which is from another web site, do that, but had I have had that information from the very beginning, perhaps I wouldn't have thought you were firing another cheep shot across the bow, as it were.




being an Anti Christian bigot.


Is this perhaps, what you were getting at? If so just come out with it and say it, because then we can debate the root of that, but when you put out a cartoon and I respond to it with my take on trying to determine what it was you were trying to say with it, and then say I was way off base on that and then proceed to get all upset, don't expect me to think you were just being a "good sport".

Hmmm. Nobody is asking you to kiss anyone's butt AshleyD, just to explain what it is you meant by it. If it were in the context I thought it was, I wouldn't say it was very funny and I already said why. You now say it was not, and I still do not find it funny, but I am trying to understand what you meant by it and what it did for you to post such a thing? Am I in a position where I should perhaps be apologizing? I'm a bit miffed by your reaction, and am wondering if I struck a nerve somewhere?



[edit on 6-2-2008 by skyshow]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 02:48 AM
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Could we please get this thread back on topic? I for one, believe that, the cartoon has been explained to the max. Now let's get past it, and get back on topic, please!

Edit: Folks, this is not an arena to openly display hate for one another. That was not the intent for opening this thread, although some of you thought that it was. Sometimes I have difficulty expressing myself properly. This thread was in response to another member's thread about Christians trying to overthrow Atheists. I just wanted opinions. I hopefully wanted civil ones. We are all adults here. Can't we discuss view points without the flaming arrows?

[edit on 6-2-2008 by sizzle]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 02:49 AM
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reply to post by skyshow
 


Are you ever going to respond to THIS GUY? He said some pretty harsh stuff about religious believers. Unlike a cartoon, his words need no interpretation. But I need to get some sleep so I'll explain it as best as I can one final time tomorrow in the hopes you will see what it means. Check out the above linked to comment for now. No one has to worry about what that comment means.

Update. Sizzle Says:


Could we please get this thread back on topic? I for one, believe that, the cartoon has been explained to the max. Now let's get past it, and get back on topic, please!


Oops. Never mind. You're on your own, Skyshow. You'll have to go with what all I've explained in several other comments. And yes, the pink triangle is obviously a homosexual symbol used by the Nazis. It was to point out that the victim in the cartoon was a homosexual so we would understand what was going on instead of just a generic guy being hit. Think of preacher's like Fred Phelps as the Bible thumper and it should all come to light. And that is all I'm going to say due to respect for Sizzle.

But the other guy's comment is still on topic.

[edit on 2/6/2008 by AshleyD]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 03:00 AM
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reply to post by AshleyD
 


yes, but I think why it really through me for a loop was because the symbol is NOT one used to represent Atheists, and any potential conspiracy to overthrow Christianity. I did read that guy's post, and I find it distasteful as well, however, religion is based on a subjective belief system, and there's an awful lot of evidence suggesting that being gay is not a similar choice in all situations...can we agree on that? Certainly it is not a symbol that represents Atheists because there are gay Christians and gay Atheists. That's why I don't understand the relevance to the topic here?

[edit on 6-2-2008 by skyshow]



posted on Feb, 6 2008 @ 03:10 AM
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Please focus further responses on the ACTUAL topic of discussion

Some people around here are going to be wearing red patches never mind pink so lets get back on topic.


Is There A Conspiracy Of Atheists To Overthrow Christianity?




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