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Organs to be taken without consent

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posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 11:08 AM
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P.S. Don't get me wrong...of course I understand the whole "Don't tell me what to do" thing...especially when it comes to the corrupt governments "Telling" us to do it.

I do think it should be a choice...here you get to sign up for it when ya get your driving license....plus so many people are aware of what an incredible gift it is, the gift of life and that's why many more people have signed up.

I agree with most of you...I don't want the government doing anything to me against my will while i am alive but when my body is dead....well, i really don't care cause i am SURE i won't need what's left behind. ^__~




posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 01:24 PM
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K, one more thing, i've been reading some of the other posts and just had to add one more thing...i do not "Hate" people who choose NOT to donate...c'mon it's their body, their choice...i respect and honor choice. besides, i don't HATE anyways.

i was dying, literally and one of my family members did not want to get tested for donation...i was upset that he felt he could not communicate this to me but i certainly don't hate him for his choice. he is my brother, i love him and always will...

i can say how much i appreciate and how thankful i am to those who choose to donate organs, living or upon death of the body...but, if i were to have died on dialysis, well, then that would be that...i was ready for all paths before me...still am!

btw...i am young and am in excellent frame of mind/body! ^_^



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 01:43 PM
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reply to post by dawnstar
 


Why would you want your body back AFTER DEATH? This whole post of yours is moronic, as you seem to operate under the assumption that the Government are

a) Automatically taking your body/organs after death. This is not the case. They would only take your organs providing there was a matching recipient and that your family didn't object or you hadn't previously opted out.

b) That the whole body is taken. This is not the case.

c) That YOU would want your body back after YOU died. How stupid does that sound?

Everyone here against this seems to be operating under some seriously false assumptions, which I can only assume is because it's typical knee jerk reaction to something they haven't actually read up on or have failed to understand due to limited intellect.

The proposals assume you're a donor, but you can opt out, or even after death, your family can opt you out. All this proposal does is make available those who would donate but didn't get a card or whose family wouldn't mind making organs available, but cannot at this present time due to the law.


Originally posted by magicmushroom
Biggie, what people like Stumason dont realizse that in the UK there are roughly half a million deaths each year from all causes if only 10% of those have their organs removed that means there will be a massive surplus of organs for sale to the highest bidder.

And that my firend is what its all about, making money, how can the NHS generate an income well there is your answer organ transplants are big bucks so under the guise of its to help save life money will be made and plenty of it.


I realise perfectly well, thankyou. What you seem to fail to realise is several things:

a) That ALL organs will be taken, creating a massive surplus organ pile. This is not the case.

b) Assuming that all recipients in the UK had their donated organs and there was a surplus due to ALL organs being removed from ALL dead people, who is going to buy this surplus, seeing as all the people needing transplants have been taken care of already?

Your operating under some seriously flawed logic here, chap.

c) You can opt out and your family can opt out at any time.

d)Organ sale is ILLEGAL, throughout the EU I believe. How is the NHS going to "raise revenue" this way? Seeing as the NHS doesn't need to "raise revenue", this point is moot.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 02:29 PM
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I see no problem with this. I bet 80 out of 100 people would agree to donate their organs upon death if asked, but I bet less than 20 percent actually go out of their way to become a registered donor. I'm a donor, I volunteered it. Its not like I'm going to use them any more right? And they have the option to opt out, just like I had the option to opt in. I'm sure people close to death would be asked about this regardless. Nothing disgusting about it, it saves lives.

[edit on 17-1-2008 by jmcivor]



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 03:59 PM
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This organ transplant thing has gotten way out of hand.
It seems to me that there are far too many organs that suddenly appear for waiting recipients.

Also it seems that there are suddenly, in the past few years a very large number of people declared to have this need.

Next I would like to know exactly what kind of life the recipient has.
How long do they live.

I knew one who only lived 2 years and was miserable the whole time.

HOw many of these operations are really unnecessary?
I see big money making that decision

Why can't the recipient get well on his own or with other aid?

How many of the recipients are dying anyway?

I am hugely synical as to the need for so many of these operations.
I see the creation of a new, highly profitable and very revolting industry here.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 04:44 PM
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reply to post by OhZone
 


In the UK, there is no money to be made from transplanting organs. The vast majority are done on the NHS as only NHS hospitals have the facilities. Guy's and St Thomas's in London is one of the leading renal transplant hospitals in the world and every time I have been there, it is full of children and adults who have suffered kidney failure and are on dialysis or medication waiting for a transplant.

My own brother was born in feb 1991 with renal failure. One was dead completely, the other only operated at 14%. He had to wait for 5 years for a transplant. In the meantime, he had to fed through a nasal drip (as renal failure kills the appetite) at night, take constant medication and balloned in weight due to the steroids he was on.

He had the transplant and is now, at the age of almost 17, very much alive and only has to take a couple of pills a day. He lives a normal life (as normal as any 17 year olds life is these days) thanks to the fact someone took the trouble of carrying a donor card. Had more donors been available, he would have had his transplant sooner, preventing him having a very poor early childhood.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 07:27 PM
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Originally posted by OhZone
This organ transplant thing has gotten way out of hand.
It seems to me that there are far too many organs that suddenly appear for waiting recipients.

Also it seems that there are suddenly, in the past few years a very large number of people declared to have this need.

Next I would like to know exactly what kind of life the recipient has.
How long do they live.

I knew one who only lived 2 years and was miserable the whole time.

HOw many of these operations are really unnecessary?



A friend of min has had hers for 25 years now. She is healthy and enjoying a fantastic life.

I was told I would live on dialysis for four years...my blood vessels were being destroyed by dialysis and the fluid used was elevating blood sugar making life very, very difficult, painful and I was soooo freakin exhausted I could not even illustrate...fell behind deadlines and lost income. I felt tired after treatment and during the time in between treatments, the toxins built up causing nausea, swelling (i'm a size four and when on dialysis i went up to a size twelve)dizziness, thirst beyond belief, can't drink if ya can't unload it. Muscle cramping ' low/high blood pressure because of the danger of too much phosphorus and potassium (try to find lo carb, lo fluid, no salt, no potassium, no phosphorus foods).

Not everyone on dialysis lives with the same symptoms but life is shortened and for diabetics even more so.

I am as healthy as a freakin race horse...i work out, back down to a size 5, have incredible energy, work like a mad dog and was told this kidney would last the rest of my life....blood work is beyond excellent!

i work out, visualize, meditate, and filter out any negative thought.....

here in the states there is a high demand...the wait in NYC is 8-10 years....tho i heard unos is also corrupt.

my life is AWESOME! everything about it is great! YAY!!! ^__^

the only reason many people are coming forward in need of organs is, well, not many peeps like to share this kinda info...there is HUGE DISCRIMINATION towards people with kidney dis-ease...K, any dis-ease. now there seems to be a listening/a place of acceptance or if you wanna go negative then you could substitute it with $$$.

ALL MEDICINE/INSURANCE/DRUG COMPANIES/INS. AGENTS ARE FOR PROFIT!!! ^_~

i didn't pay for my kidney but i pay 12,000 a year for health insurance...

and so far, i have rescued two teens from suicide, supported three people through cancer, found another person a support system for people living w/Lupus, saved my mom from depression before she too killed herself, rescued two dogs from a shelter (one was deemed unadoptable 'cause she bit, now she just loves, i've written and illustrated four books Fantasy w/subtle messages of acceptance, approval, acknowledgment and love of ones self...and others

MAJOR POSITIVE CONTRIBUTIONS TO LIFE! ^____^



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 07:41 PM
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Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by OhZone
 


In the UK, there is no money to be made from transplanting organs. The vast majority are done on the NHS as only NHS hospitals have the facilities. Guy's and St Thomas's in London is one of the leading renal transplant hospitals in the world and every time I have been there, it is full of children and adults who have suffered kidney failure and are on dialysis or medication waiting for a transplant.

My own brother was born in feb 1991 with renal failure.


i knew you had some kind of personal experience. your posts are definitely not the posts of an undereducated person but more like one who is well iinformed and speaking from a higher place.

i think it might be tough for negative people to understand these things, perhaps their lives are joyless, they don't appreciate their own lives so there's like, no way they can relate to someone who does appreciate it...but it is irrelevant... people do donate and people do not, some are AWARE and HIGHLY EXPERIENCED and/or EDUCATED and then there are those who are not.

that's why i choose acceptance, not for the uneducated, if you have a library, a computer or you ask questions then there is no excuse for ignorance...

glad to hear your bro is great!

^__^



posted on Jan, 18 2008 @ 04:09 AM
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"but I bet less than 20 percent actually go out of their way to become a registered donor"
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it's a donation, you go out of your way to donate to the salvation army don't you, you go out of your way to feed the african child?? It's a donation.....a sacrifice. people who donate sacrifice.

I work to earn my money, the money is mine, it's in my pocket. I want food, so I go to the store. the money is in my pocket for the food.....I don't go out of my way to spend my money now do I?

Same goes for the right over a body....it's my body, it will be passed to the family after I pass and they will do what they feel is best with the body....within the laws....but the possession will be held within the family. neither they, nor I, should have to go out of the way to have control over what happens to it...

as far as why should I care what happens to the body after I am dead, I don't, but I do care about what happens to those that are close to me after I am dead, and even one of them would feel overly against the government coming and taking any organ, well, then it shouldn't happen. Neither I nor they should have to go through a hassle to ensure it doesn't happen...since the family is in possession of the body!!

[edit on 18-1-2008 by dawnstar]



posted on Feb, 1 2010 @ 03:35 PM
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Presumed consent laws have been enacted in several countries now. I suppose this will soon be touted as the way to solve dissent concerning "organ trafficking" from disaster victims. It will give it a more reputable perspective for the dark deed that it is. After all, it takes much more expense to 'save' someone who will require extensive treatment. It all comes down to weighing the cost effectiveness.


I found this at www.medhunters.com...:
"As described by the Berkeley Organs Watch, a non-profit organization that monitors the organ trade,"...

However, it seems that the Berkeley Organs Watch website has been shut down for quite some time. I wonder why?

sunsite3.berkeley.edu...


I suppose once "presumed consent" becomes the norm we will no longer be hearing of organ trafficking.




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