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Ask Me Any Serious Quesses About Christianity, The Bible, Church

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posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 09:36 AM
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Originally posted by marg6043
Deception? so you are confirming my post that this thread has been Hijacked? by religious groups using ATS to bring the light and the Gospel to the people been deceived in this Forums?

Well thanks you just proved my point.



The only thing I can confirm is the uncertainty that has been in your heart of late and no more.




posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 09:46 AM
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Of course the God haters show up and try to derail the thread. It must be quite a chore to be so cynical and assuming all the time.

Why not leave the modding to the mods?

I for one am pleased to see a thread that's not bashing Christians for once. I guess you would rather have us just sit back and keep taking it.

Keep it up Joe as your beliefs are mine!



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 09:50 AM
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reply to post by jdposey
 


My dear Is nothing you are offering right now that I have need for. Perhaps is me the one that can enlighten you.


But still this forum is for conspiracies not preaching.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 09:56 AM
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Originally posted by jbondo
Of course the God haters show up and try to derail the thread. It must be quite a chore to be so cynical and assuming all the time.

Why not leave the modding to the mods?

I for one am pleased to see a thread that's not bashing Christians for once. I guess you would rather have us just sit back and keep taking it.

Keep it up Joe as your beliefs are mine!


The mods have spoken.
Unfortunately no one listens.


The title of this thread and the original post have absolutely nothing to do with a conspiracy. There is nothing wrong with the thread, except that it does not belong to a conspiracy forum. ATS has BTS where Theological and Apologetical material belong.

Again, post replies within the thread may have a conspiratorial angle to it, but those post would perhaps benefit if given their own thread.

I dont believe you or anyone is being targeted (as you implied) for attack because of your beliefs. It rather seems people are tired of seeing theology & apologetics showing up in a conspiracy forum. (that is, without the conspiracy attached.)

Anyway, these post are now getting off topic in a thread that is off topic.


Peace

dAlen

[edit on 11-1-2008 by dAlen]



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 10:21 AM
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This thread is for BTS.


Originally posted by joesomebody
I believe the original intent for "Church" is not as we know it. It was a chance for people to get together in a place in a small group, and discuss life, God, and pray. The intent was to use the strengths and spiritual gifts among the group to enhance everyone's understanding of the Bible, to further the propagation of truth. The goal wasn't to create an institution that dictates a big production.

When I use the words Christianity and Church I am not referring to an organization, denomination, or other man-made thing (ex: The Catholic Church). Rather, I am referring to the body of Christ, the body of believers who accept Christ according to the Bible's words, as I do.

May I ask you something? Are you baptized?


Originally posted by joesomebody
My studies come from many many years of study on my own, and with others. The truth in the Bible is what to go by, not neccessarily what a preacher (or anyone else) tells you. Honestly, the best way to learn and know the truth is to find it yourself. The best way to do this is to learn Hebrew Greek and Aramaic (which I do not know). An alternative (my route) is to study multiple translations and versions of the Bible, and to use a good lexicon. If you know someone who knows Jewish oral traditions and oral history, who can read Hebrew/Greek, that's even better. I know a Messianic Jewish Rabbi who has greatly enhanced my understanding of God's truth.

So typical for Protestants. Reason is enough for understanding Holy Scripture.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:37 AM
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What is the teaching of the kingdom of God?

What's the point of understanding God?

Why is it too many people believe that the bible and the chirstian church is the way to God and heaven when it is not?

What did I mean by that?

If someone does you wrong, slaps you on your cheek, why should you turn the other cheek to them?

What's the meaning of all this life in phyical reality and what is the real test about?


1. Basically, the teachings collectively are what we know as the Bible. The Bible itself collectively points to the ultimate teaching, that of Salvation through the Christ, Jesus.

2. You don't want to know where you came from conclusively? If one understands God, they will prosper if they are in His divine will. In the end, all things work for the further progression of God's plan and kingdom, both good and bad.

3. This is because man is physical, and naturally strives for the physical rather than the spiritual. The salvation is through Jesus as told in the Bible, not the Bible itself. The Christian Church (whether the Catholic church or a protestant denomination) is also a misconception by people - they think that the path to the golden gates is through the doors of a building.

4. I think my previous response alludes to what I perceive you meant by the previous question.


5. Because it would be wrong to retaliate. The "turn the other cheek" analogy is more about not turning around and sinning against someone who sinned against you. Be meek and mild, and if necessary, die for your beliefs. "Turn the other cheek" incorporates not only those things, but a "two wrongs don't make a right" type of ideal too.



Ok Joe I have a question for you my freind, explain to me in laymans terms exactly what this Holy Trinity is so its undeniably clear. Then distance it from the Ra - Isis - Horus Trinity inexplicitly so its unique and not a copy of the older religion of Egypt.

Once you have sufficiently succeeded in those explanations I have one more question.....The pagans of Northern Europe celebrated the 22nd of december because it was the time when the Sun stopped moving North for 3 days then on the 25th it was reborn by moving south again indicating that the growing seasons were returning. Why also does the Christian Religion celebrate this period as the day Christ ( Sun or Son ) dies and is resurected after 3 days ? Oh and the cross just so happens to be a circle dissected in 4 parts to represent the seasons in the Pagan religion.

Why is there twelve deciples and twelve signs of the Zodiac? Joe I will stop there as I obviously have too many queries at this point my freind.


I will respond to your first question in combination with the first question of kacou.

John 1 Says this (NIV...note that KJV had a few words that confuse many in this verse)


1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.

3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.


Pretty self explanatory there. The Word is referred to as He. The word is Jesus, God's son. God is mentioned there too. What about the Holy Spirit? Well, when we look into Genesis 1:


1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.


There's the Holy Spirit. We see also that the Bible relates them all as to being parts of God, in a sense..the Spirit of God, The Word was God and with God at the same time...and of course, God is mentioned there too. Three in one, one in three.

As for the Egyptians, their trinity is actually a perversion of the Holy Trinity, as we can see that the Holy Trinity was here first...no fabrication there.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:50 AM
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We see the trinity in Genesis, "Let us make man in our image."
The complete gospel message was twisted after the great deluge,
Read This

Many of our holy days come from Babylon as well,
BTW, I am a southern 'hick'.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:53 AM
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Also like many other Gods messenger, why is it that some very important years of their life is not mention in the scripture. Many people in the case of Jesus have speculated that the missing time can be recalled from some old Buddhist scripture where a man from Palestine called Issa was been teach spirituality. For sure Christian will not accept such a claim for the simple reason that it will undermine the very essence of the Christianity which is that Jesus was divine and got he’s teaching from God as oppose to been teach by human.


If they aren't there, they aren't important. If one believes the Bible is God inspired, the Bible includes what is necessary. We don't need the full story of Jesus' life to understand how to come to His salvation.

Again, Buddhism has various perverted versions of Chrstian doctrine and practice, so how can anything from such a source be considered anything but historical at best? Issa and Jesus were not one in the same.



How do you feel about John's comma being added to the Bible, even though it was never in the original manuscripts?

Also, Trinity means 3 in one, correct? Then what about the Holy Ghost being seven ghosts? 1+1+7=1?


I personally think that although the addition of Johns comma speaks a general truth, it probably doesn't belong there. At best it was a "footnote" of sorts left there to explain things to the Greeks.

Is it not possibly for the Holy Spirit to have multiple parts? I have ten fingers. Does that make me ten different entities?

-----

As for my theology, it is what I have found as the truth through personal study and experience...in the end, theology and doctrine aren't as important as people simply accepting and trusting in Jesus...the other arguments are meant to lead people away from the truth. Also, the rabbi may as well have been Hassidic and orthodox, as he knows and teaches that perspective of things also.

Yes, I am baptized through immersion. Also, where do you think the Catholics Organiations of the world glean their source (although the theology is perverted from that of the Bible...)...yup...the Bible itself. Since that organization is no longer concerned with being Bible centered, but instead being a world power, it is wrong to assume that the Catholic Organizations are correct.

(Sorry about not putting this in BTS...I didn't know there was a more appropriate area...I'd move it if I could.)

[edit on 11-1-2008 by joesomebody]



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:03 PM
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So typical for Protestants. Reason is enough for understanding Holy Scripture.


I don't understand what you're saying by that. ????
Are you Roman catholic?



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by joesomebody
(although the theology is perverted from that of the Bible...)...yup...the Bible itself. Since that organization is no longer concerned with being Bible.

Obviously you are no a Catholic, so what relgious denomination you bring your interprattions and teachings from.


(Sorry about not putting this in BTS...I didn't know there was a more appropriate area...I'd move it if I could.)



I hope you now unerstand what it means a conspircacy in religion.

Do you believe that all other christian religions that do not fall under yours are conrrupted?



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:29 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by Dorian Soran
 


Actually I found the conspiracy finally,

ATS to become the main portal for internet Gospel and religious teaching.

Obviously many believe that we are sinning in this forums and are in dare need of guidance to exorcise out of us the deceiving evil that has taken over.


That is a conspiracy


although I found amusment in this comment. I don't fit in "mainstream christian religious beliefs". And being that I see the mainstream is froth with errors and misunderstandings. I'd just like to point out, although amusing I don't think it is a conspiracy over a numbers thing.

They are wrong. Not fully wrong. But they are wrong for much hight. I know it. You seem to know it. Many of "us" know it. They don't know it. They don't want to know it. They will argue tooth and nail to their graves against the facts that they are wrong.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by joesomebody


What is the teaching of the kingdom of God?

What's the point of understanding God?

Why is it too many people believe that the bible and the chirstian church is the way to God and heaven when it is not?

What did I mean by that?

If someone does you wrong, slaps you on your cheek, why should you turn the other cheek to them?

What's the meaning of all this life in phyical reality and what is the real test about?


1. Basically, the teachings collectively are what we know as the Bible. The Bible itself collectively points to the ultimate teaching, that of Salvation through the Christ, Jesus.

2. You don't want to know where you came from conclusively? If one understands God, they will prosper if they are in His divine will. In the end, all things work for the further progression of God's plan and kingdom, both good and bad.

3. This is because man is physical, and naturally strives for the physical rather than the spiritual. The salvation is through Jesus as told in the Bible, not the Bible itself. The Christian Church (whether the Catholic church or a protestant denomination) is also a misconception by people - they think that the path to the golden gates is through the doors of a building.

4. I think my previous response alludes to what I perceive you meant by the previous question.


5. Because it would be wrong to retaliate. The "turn the other cheek" analogy is more about not turning around and sinning against someone who sinned against you. Be meek and mild, and if necessary, die for your beliefs. "Turn the other cheek" incorporates not only those things, but a "two wrongs don't make a right" type of ideal too.



Brother, I wish you well. I really do. But those answers are Colder then lukewarm.

Hey! To each theirown.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by Incarnated
 


Well he got his thread in BTS where it belongs, so I wish the thread started good luck with many good chrisitan members that will support his thread in this forum.

I am strictly on conspiracies on religion thread subcriber, so this forum is not my specialty.






[edit on 11-1-2008 by marg6043]



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:39 PM
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I hope you now unerstand what it means a conspircacy in religion.

Do you believe that all other christian religions that do not fall under yours are conrrupted?


Not necessarily. I'm not even saying my ways of understanding and practicing things are totally right. I'm sure I have flawed logic. They all do. If it is a truly Christian religion (protestant or Catholic, not the Mormons...they aren't really Christian...it's really perverse...the book of mormon is not of God), then I don't think that they are corrupted. Many things taken as facts come from men rather than God, which isn't good.

The most important thing is Jesus. If He is common among various religions, and people accept Him as Lord and Savior, the most important base is covered. Everything else can be found by personal study.

I'm not saying I'm even totally right or the authority on such things. If one studies for themselves rather than believing everything anti-Christians say, or anti-Christian websites say, and just figure it out on their own, they would be a lot better off.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:46 PM
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reply to post by joesomebody
 


I honestly wish you the best in your pursue of the truth and your faith in Jesus if that is what feed your soul.

I already have found what feed my soul and I am very happy and complete.

I am afraid I have nothing else to bring to your thread.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by joesomebody
Not necessarily. I'm not even saying my ways of understanding and practicing things are totally right. I'm sure I have flawed logic. They all do. If it is a truly Christian religion (protestant or Catholic, not the Mormons...they aren't really Christian...it's really perverse...the book of mormon is not of God), then I don't think that they are corrupted. Many things taken as facts come from men rather than God, which isn't good.

You forget something. :shk:
You didn't answer: are you baptized?



Originally posted by Clearskies


So typical for Protestants. Reason is enough for understanding Holy Scripture.


I don't understand what you're saying by that. ????
Are you Roman catholic?

I talk about sola scriptura.

I am not Roman Catholic.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 03:53 PM
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reply to post by joesomebody
 





I believe that the Bible (not including the Apocrypha)


Why don't you believe in the Apocrypha??

Just wondering,but i guess the answer is because you have been mislead by the Catholic Church.

All of the books that are now part of the Apocrypha were part of the original Holy Scriptures and over the centuries they were removed,replaced and removed again.(Except in the Ethiopic Bible,that still has many of those books in it.)

These books were not all removed because they could not be authenticated,as the Catholic Church claims,but because translators of the Bible put their own views on what the Scriptures should contain,and how Jesus should be percieved.(Martin Luther is a good example of this.)


It should be remembered that the Christian faith existed for 300yrs before Constantine and Rome got involved.
Also,many of these books are mentioned in the Bible,usually in the OT.
In fact,there are about 28 books that are talked about in the Bible but no longer appear in it,and there are about....uhm...can't remember how many are in the Apocrypha,lol...but its a lot







[edit on 11-1-2008 by jakyll]



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 03:55 PM
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reply to post by joesomebody
 





not the Mormons...they aren't really Christian



Never understood that.Aren't all those that follow Jesus Christ,Christian???



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 08:57 PM
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Originally posted by jdposey

Originally posted by marg6043
Deception? so you are confirming my post that this thread has been Hijacked? by religious groups using ATS to bring the light and the Gospel to the people been deceived in this Forums?

Well thanks you just proved my point.



The only thing I can confirm is the uncertainty that has been in your heart of late and no more.


Either you have read here on ATS for quit some time or your incredibly perceptive? either way I totally agree and have noticed the same very sad.

For a long time member with a brain in their head to make such accusations and be so attacking of a new member who can and will easily make a mistake of finding the appropriate forum to place their thread confirms this.

The very mention of Christs name can have people screaming and kicking and those that go out of their way to look for reasons to kick and scream are usually the ones being called by their own conviction to the Word.

If I think of some questions that you maybe able to help me with I`ll post them in the future to you.
Anywho welcome to ATS jdposey and joesomebody



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 09:58 PM
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Yes, I have been baptized, as an adult and in full emersion...the point is to do it like Jesus, and it doesn't save you to be sprinkled at birth.

As for the Apocrypha, it is a collection of books whose dates aren't verifiable like the others, and the ones whose dates are known are obvious attempts at man adding a spin to the Bible. Stories in the Apocrypha include things where Jesus takes a ball of mud, throws it into the air, and it turns into doves...That simply doesn't have a purpose other than showing a miracle...Catholics are obsessed with such things, and the general thought is that the Apocrypha is a fabrication.

The Mormons aren't true Christians, as they have their own man-made book that has hundreds of contradictions within, and it really isn't God's word, and you can tell if you look at it yourself. I don't want to explain Mormon views, but they are pretty messed up...see wikipedia.







 
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