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Satanic Paedophile Codes ZaZa etc.

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posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 04:03 AM
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Another thread has provoked me into sharing this.

I want to get down to brass tacks ASAP so I am providing references at the end. Let's begin with documented fact that international child protection relies on:


Did you know that "boylovers" make their presence known with a "small blue spiral-shaped triangle surrounded by a larger triangle"? The larger triangle signifies an adult male; the smaller triangle, a boy. If the boylover wishes to emphasize the smallness of the boys he covets, then he uses the "little boy lover" logo, which is more rounded and thinner than the boylover logo, apparently to "resemble a scribbling by a young child." Males or females whose taste runs to young girls identify themselves with a logo showing one heart inside a larger heart, while "non-preferential gender child abusers" indicate their enthusiasms with a butterfly logo made up of two large hearts and two smaller hearts. These logos are sometimes incorporated into jewelry or even stamped onto coins.


SOURCE: Pedophile codes

Summary-

homosexual child molestor male-male:
blue spiral triangle inside larger triangle
---for infant molestors a scribbly version of same.

child molestors who prefer little girls:
heart within a larger heart.

child molestors who don't care about the sex of their victims:
a butterfly made of two large and two small hearts.

the resemblance to some "alien" logos is obvious.

Going along with this ancient symbolism are certain words, popularised by the A.A. or Aster Argentum ("Silver Star"), the secret Satan cult popularised and created in its modern Western form by Aleister Crowley. Used at ritual magick orgies and so forth these nonsense words are all cognates of the names of fallen angels.

Golden Dawn FAQ

A.A. is a cancerous secret group whose outward forms are semi-secret and its deeper pathways totally secret, protected by murder and blackmail if necessary.

Thelemic Links

Lists of Satanists such as this one

Satanists according to Icke

frequently contain more truth than we might like to admit.




posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 04:17 AM
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I have just looked at your Icke link.

And in all honesty, how can Icke get away with slandering these people?

As for the symbols, well I have never seen any symbol such as you describe.

I am not saying its not true but never have I seen a symbol anywhere anytime I have been out and about.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 04:53 AM
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reply to post by DogHead
 


David Icke is a crackpot; there's not one shred of evidence that he's ever presented on anything.
As for the Golden Dawn, there's nothing whatsoever evil about it. They don't worship Satan and aren't Satanists by any stretch of the imagination. It is a Magickal system, that's all. The occult and magick are not by nature evil; it depends on how this knowledge is used.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 06:10 AM
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Magic that is ritual in nature is inherently amoral. Amorality is fashionably supposed to be beyond or between good and evil in a Nietzchean way. I can't logically see how anything unmoral can be anything other than contrary to morality since only a sociopath would not want to respect healthy boundaries.

The Golden Dawn, created by one fraud, spawned Aster Argentum via another fraud, Aleister Crowley. Through Crowley the world has rejoiced in the exploits of a series of unsavoury sexual deviants down to L Ron Hubbard and his latest philosophical scions within the "church" of Scientology.

The paedophilia symbolism is apparent in many places and similar code symbols turn up in computer games, tv shows and all sorts of other places.

One of the places that greatly surprises and disappoints me is in the "handwriting" style of some anime and Western toons wherein the BESM (big eyes small mouth) infantile look of supposedly adult characters is a clear pandering to a paedophilic desire for underage sexuality.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 06:26 AM
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Although an interesting and important read (especially for those with children!) - minus the David Icke part - I fail to see how the symbols paedophiles or the so-called "boylovers" use to "advertise" themselves have any connection or even hint to Satanism... Perhaps you could elaborate as to why you (not David Icke) believe Paedophilia and their symbolism equals Satanism?



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 07:31 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead
Magic that is ritual in nature is inherently amoral. Amorality is fashionably supposed to be beyond or between good and evil in a Nietzchean way. I can't logically see how anything unmoral can be anything other than contrary to morality since only a sociopath would not want to respect healthy boundaries.



A knife can be used to prepare meals at your local homeless shelter, feeding people who may otherwise not get a meal that day, and doing something socially concious that benefits your fellow man.That same knife could also be used to slice the throats of dozens of innocent people by a homicidal maniac.Was the knife evil or was it good?Neither it was simply a tool,amoral if you will.Your argument above is a logical fallacy.Though I am not a proponent of ceremonial magick, magick is in and of itself a tool, as the knife in my illustration and is part and parcel with the intention of the practitioner.People who are using magick for negative/evil intent are only fooling themselves in the end.Every action has its repercussions.

One thing that always struck me as odd about Icke ( well I could write more than one...aside from the "everyone is a shapeshifting blood drinking reptile except for me and you, and I am not so sure about you... mentality") is the fact that he claimed at one point to be an "earth healer" which would denote, in my opinion some sort of shamanistic overtones, but anyone that practices any form of magick besides him is a witch,satanist,blood drinking reptile , etc.

As the above poster stated Icke is a crackpot.He claimed that he was god's son at some point, and made some wierd reference about knowing he had special powers because he always found parking spaces in London when it was crowded.Don't get me wrong he has some interesting ideas and research, but you really have to dig through a compost heap of BS to find them.

Aside from the disagreement on your assessment of magick, thanks for the heads up about the symbolism, raising awareness is beneficial to those of us out there with young loved ones.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead
Magic that is ritual in nature is inherently amoral.


There is nothing in the slightest "amoral" about Golden Dawn ritual. In fact, it is very ennobling and inspiring, and one could possibly say, of divine origin.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by DogHead
The paedophilia symbolism is apparent in many places and similar code symbols turn up in computer games, tv shows and all sorts of other places.

I dunno. I play quite a few computer games, watch T.V. and generally go "all sorts of other places" and I fail to see any of the symbolism you claim exists in all of these places.

Could you please cite some specific examples?

Thanks.

Your pal,
Meat.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 04:18 PM
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Uh oh...
I guess that GB Glace (an Unilever brand) ice creams are targeted at pedophiles? At least their logo greatly resembles the symbol depicted in the document.




(Note: I do not believe that that brand is targeted to pedophiles. It's just so weird coincidence)



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 05:46 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by DogHead
Magic that is ritual in nature is inherently amoral.


There is nothing in the slightest "amoral" about Golden Dawn ritual. In fact, it is very ennobling and inspiring, and one could possibly say, of divine origin.


I don't really see what is ennobling or inspiring about it. To me, and to many I think, ritual magic is total bunk. As one biographer of Crowley said, the only problem with the wonderfully entertaining ritual magic(k) stuff is... It simply doesn't work.

Amorality is evident since it places humankind ahead of anything else through the espousing of a system where thought and meditation places a mortal in the position of a putative god. More evidence of the effectiveness of said process would doubtless cause many more people to flock to the practices. The more public practices anyway.



posted on Jan, 9 2008 @ 06:09 PM
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Those 3 main symbols the OP mentioned (triangle within triangle, heart within heart and butterfly within butterfly) were reported in a couple of UK newspapers some time late last year - think it was also picked up but one or two of the TV chat shows. I had never specifically seen them used before - but the hear within a heart is also the logo for Walls Ice Cream -

I know peados probably have a freezer with a variety of ice cream, but I am duty bound to buy my neice an ice cream if she is with me in the summer and the vans jingle is within earshot (by ear shot I mean do kids have radar or something?? I have excellent hearing - must be selective where handing over cash is concerned)...... So where does that leave me?? 20 something male with a 4 year old in a park - both of us sporting a logo on the wrapper.


Haven't looked at the rest of the links yet - saw Icke's (moron) name mentioned - maybe later if board.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 07:22 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead

I don't really see what is ennobling or inspiring about it. To me, and to many I think, ritual magic is total bunk. As one biographer of Crowley said, the only problem with the wonderfully entertaining ritual magic(k) stuff is... It simply doesn't work.

Amorality is evident since it places humankind ahead of anything else through the espousing of a system where thought and meditation places a mortal in the position of a putative god. More evidence of the effectiveness of said process would doubtless cause many more people to flock to the practices. The more public practices anyway.


Just because you don't find anything ennobling or inspiring to it does not mean that another individual should not or will not, another person may not find truth of validation in your inherent belief system, but does that give them the right, or necessity to devalue it?The last I checked, freedom of religion extends to ALL religions and belief structures, not just the ones that we ourselves are in agreement with.I know a great deal of people that come from many ecclectic paths, and some of those individuals are magickal practitioners, NONE of them nor any that I have met are claiming or trying to reach Godhood.

Meditation is used for many reasons, one of the primary ones being insight.Thought and meditation is not designed to transform oneself into a Diety. Also bear in mind (I never thought I would see the day where I would be defending Crowley) that the author of the book on Crowley was stating his opinion, and in the future please give us names and references, most of us here would prefer cold hard facts to " I read this book one time by this one author".



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 07:54 AM
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Ritual magic(k) is a religion? Interesting. What god or gods does it bow down to, I find myself wondering. What a perfectly interesting statement to make, in so many ways.

Authors such as Colin Wilson have discussed at length the hopelessness of most magic working as described. It is a topic where, the closer to the direct experience someone comes, the less believable, credible and let's be blunt real it seems to be.

The whole concept of serving with both hands ie good and evil practices balancing each other out in some psychotic parody of normal psychology is inherently morally ambiguous... or amoral.

And as for mental health, where are the reports of people integrating their psyche and growing as people to balance out all the reports of people destroying their lives with an unhealthy preoccupation with sick practices, delusional states and superstitions?


In order to elucidate the matter, let me again turn to the terminology of modern psychology. The term "complex" has achieved a fairly wide notoriety during the last quarter of a century since the circulation of the theories of Freud and Jung. It means an aggregation or group of ideas in the mind with a strong emotional charge, capable of influencing conscious thought and behaviour. If my interest is Magic, then naturally every item of information acquired, no matter what its nature, is likely to be built by association into that constellation of ideas clustering around my interest--becoming in the course of years a thorough-going complex. Mrs. Jones my dairywoman, because of her professional predilection, will have her complex centering about milk and cows and butter and the price of eggs.

Israel Regardie's wit and wisdom

The above is from Israel Regardie, an apologist for magical practices, and even this author confesses in a passing bout of realism that the practices have formed a "complex". What is totally erroneous is to in any way equate them with the earning of an honest living by "Mrs. Jones". In a field littered with grotesque juxtapositions, this patronising gaffe is ... illuminating.

He goes on to admit that the personations in magic are delusional, acknowledging Jung's view in the process. That the personations are given the names of pagan gods, demons etc. should not surprise anyone of course.
Clinical studies have established clear unambiguous and to many I would imagine unsurprising links to mental illness amongst those magically inclined and tortured by visions of the unreal: for example cf Sherilyn Nicole Thomas, Magical Ideation in OCD Ph.D. dissertation, Dept. of Psychology, SUNY at Buffalo (1999).

As for not being judgmental of the "religions" of others, a "religion" that refuses to condemn and indeed practices ritual sacrifice that includes human sacrifice, even in theory, is at the level of savagery that the twenty-first century should be entirely rid of. Likewise the pedophilic implications of worshipping entities who in their time on Earth counted amongst their followers the classical Greeks- who whatever their achievements were a race of paedophiles. No civilised person can expect to hide their paraphiliac tendencies under a cloak of claimed religiosity.

Magic is always about finding causation where none exists. Absent evidence, means absent causation prima facie until evidence is found. Anything else is just so much mental masturbation.

This could apply to many topics on this forum, but the average UFOlogist doesn't have a hobby that is quite so documented as being keen on bloodthirst, delusions and child molestation. It tends to be the evil aliens reptilians etc. who are into that rather than the experiencers themselves.

Paedophilia and Satanism are two of many objectionable traits in this new renaissance of fear-based cultism but it extends far into other realms of nonsense, including of course the quackery of many alternative medicines...
Skeptical Inquirer



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead


I don't really see what is ennobling or inspiring about it. To me, and to many I think, ritual magic is total bunk. As one biographer of Crowley said, the only problem with the wonderfully entertaining ritual magic(k) stuff is... It simply doesn't work.


Whether or not it "works" is a different issue. The Golden Dawn initiation ceremonies are both beautiful and inspiring, and required at least a modest degree of genius in their composition.

As for Ceremonial Magick itself, you are correct that it doesn't "work" in the Hollywood sense, but then again, no Magician would ever make that claim. As occult author and Magician Lon Milo Duquette famously said "The only thing I can change with Magick is myself".


Amorality is evident since it places humankind ahead of anything else through the espousing of a system where thought and meditation places a mortal in the position of a putative god.


Actually, amorality is the denial, whether implicit or explicit, of a system of morals. Obviously, the Golden Dawn does not fit this definition because it, like Freemasonry, has a strict code of morality. The basic theory behind this is that one must first conquer the passions through strict moral conduct before one is ready for more serious spiritual insight.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 08:17 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
Actually, amorality is the denial, whether implicit or explicit, of a system of morals.


No it isn't. Amorality is the absence of morality. Could be denial, could be ignorance, could be psychosis or sociopathy. Could be all four.


Originally posted by Masonic Light
Obviously, the Golden Dawn does not fit this definition because it, like Freemasonry, has a strict code of morality. The basic theory behind this is that one must first conquer the passions through strict moral conduct before one is ready for more serious spiritual insight.


Ideation as a means of doing that is dangerous, incoherent, and provably unsuccessful. Even if your assertion were true, which frauds like the founder of the Golden Dawn and Aleister Crowley are demonstrators to the opposite effect. Advanc(k)ed prac(k)titioners of magic(k) seem to have a disturbing tendencies to be arguably psychotic fraudsters of epic proportions, which doesn't really tend to make their other claims more convincing than any other ravings of common or garden madmen and madwomen.

Interesting too that you now, speaking with whatever authority, espouse that this is a belief system known not to work, and yet claiming for itself the mantle of Alchemy, a separate belief system and one that is universally seen as having merit, not to mention a clear moral axis.

And just to be totally crystal clear on the links being made:

Ritual Abuse

RA is rarer than some claim, and as conflated as any other form of rape, but it exists, and is real, and fits the general paedophile pattern. Look it up in a VICAP manual. But please note, unlike ritual magickkk books etc. there are no delightful pictures of sodomy, monsters, superstitious twaddle or other nonsense. Just the cold facts about mental alienation causing violent crime.

"Minnesota

Jordan
James John Rud, a 27-year-old garbage collector with two previous sex abuse convictions, agreed to plead guilty and testify against other defendants accused of abusing children in sex orgies, in exchange for a lighter sentence. Rud gave police a 113-page statement in which he graphically described sadistic assaults on children. (Emmerman, 1984).

Children ranging in age from 2 to 17 years old described being molested by their parents, relatives and family friends during ritualistic orgies. The children talked about playing games with adults that culminated in sexual assaults and said they had been drugged with alcohol and pills. Many referred to being photographed nude and of seeing child pornography in Rud's trailer. (Crewdson, 1984).

In addition to Rud, 24 adults were charged with molesting 37 children. (Emmerman, 1984). Two defendants were tried and acquitted when one child witness recanted his accusation of abuse. (Chicago Tribune, 1984). The prosecutor dropped the charges against all other defendants to avoid releasing 126 pages of police notes containing allegations that implicated some of the former defendants in ritualistic child murders. (Ogintz, 1984).

In January 1985, Rud was sentenced to 40 years in prison, the maximum sentence allowable by law. (Chicago Tribune, 1985)."

Some RA accusations are ridiculous and clearly not credible. Then there are all the others. And no amount of mealy mouthed defence of the unspeakable will cure the taint, any more than Christians can deny the failings of priests and ministers and parishioners. Of course Christian child molestation is CLEARLY against the teachings of their religion. Unlike the lunacy that hides behind the pleasant pagan flower power facade of ritual magic.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 08:22 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead
Ritual magic(k) is a religion? Interesting. What god or gods does it bow down to, I find myself wondering. What a perfectly interesting statement to make, in so many ways.


Ceremonial Magick is not in and of itself a religion, but most (if not) religions practice some for of it. The most widespread example in our culture is the Sacrifice of the Eucharist as performed in the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches, and to a lesser extent, Anglican and Lutheran congregations.


Authors such as Colin Wilson have discussed at length the hopelessness of most magic working as described. It is a topic where, the closer to the direct experience someone comes, the less believable, credible and let's be blunt real it seems to be.


The effects of Ceremonial Magick, like Zazen and other forms of meditation, are subjective. It is because it is highly personalized that it is often misunderstood.


The whole concept of serving with both hands ie good and evil practices balancing each other out in some psychotic parody of normal psychology is inherently morally ambiguous... or amoral.


Neither Ceremonial Magick, nor its sister meditation, serves both good and evil. They are methods some use to gain spiritual insight.


And as for mental health, where are the reports of people integrating their psyche and growing as people to balance out all the reports of people destroying their lives with an unhealthy preoccupation with sick practices, delusional states and superstitions?


There are none. However, there are many who have used Magick and Yoga for such purposes, while ignoring superstitions, delusions, etcx.



As for not being judgmental of the "religions" of others, a "religion" that refuses to condemn and indeed practices ritual sacrifice that includes human sacrifice, even in theory, is at the level of savagery that the twenty-first century should be entirely rid of.


This is pretty obvious. Ceremonial Magicians certainly do not advocate any blood sacrifices, outside of a few jokes from Crowley.


Likewise the pedophilic implications of worshipping entities who in their time on Earth counted amongst their followers the classical Greeks- who whatever their achievements were a race of paedophiles. No civilised person can expect to hide their paraphiliac tendencies under a cloak of claimed religiosity.


I certainly don't think this is fair. Firstly, the Greek society accepted pederasty, not pedophilia. Secondly, societal norms are cultural; they would have thought us barabaric, no doubt. Thirdly, not all Greeks practiced homosexuality and pederasty. Plato, himself a homosexual, spoke out against it, which gives us the term "platonic", i.e., non-sexual love.


Magic is always about finding causation where none exists. Absent evidence, means absent causation prima facie until evidence is found. Anything else is just so much mental masturbation.


Magick is not about finding causation. Magick is about self-discovery.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 08:27 AM
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Originally posted by DogHead


Ideation as a means of doing that is dangerous, incoherent, and provably unsuccessful.


The problem with your logic is that you say "provable unsuccessful", which is not the case. Neither success nor unsuccess can be proven by an outside party, because the matter is subjective. It is a personalized experience.


Even if your assertion were true, which frauds like the founder of the Golden Dawn and Aleister Crowley are demonstrators to the opposite effect. Advanc(k)ed prac(k)titioners of magic(k) seem to have a disturbing tendencies to be arguably psychotic fraudsters of epic proportions, which doesn't really tend to make their other claims more convincing than any other ravings of common or garden madmen and madwomen.


You have yet to show that any of these people were actually "frauds". They themselves took it very seriously.


Interesting too that you now, speaking with whatever authority, espouse that this is a belief system known not to work, and yet claiming for itself the mantle of Alchemy, a separate belief system and one that is universally seen as having merit, not to mention a clear moral axis.


Alchemy, by virtue of the body of Hermetic philosophy, has always been interwoven with Ceremonial Magick. Indeed, spiritual Alchemy, that of transforming the base metal of human nature into the gold of spiritual enlightenment, is the goal of Magick.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 09:05 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light

You have yet to show that any of these people were actually "frauds". They themselves took it very seriously.




No I mean frauds in the literal sense- pretending to be Scottish lairds, pretending to have been to places they never went, pretending to have experienced things they never experienced. That sort of thing. You know, fraud.



posted on Jan, 10 2008 @ 12:47 PM
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the OP wrote:

"As for not being judgmental of the "religions" of others, a "religion" that refuses to condemn and indeed practices ritual sacrifice that includes human sacrifice, even in theory, is at the level of savagery that the twenty-first century should be entirely rid of..."

"...This could apply to many topics on this forum, but the average UFOlogist doesn't have a hobby that is quite so documented as being keen on bloodthirst, delusions and child molestation. It tends to be the evil aliens reptilians etc. who are into that rather than the experiencers themselves..."

"...Magic that is ritual in nature is inherently amoral. Amorality is fashionably supposed to be beyond or between good and evil in a Nietzchean way. I can't logically see how anything unmoral can be anything other than contrary to morality since only a sociopath would not want to respect healthy boundaries..."

*******
I have been a practicing Witch for many years. I do spells to help people, to heal the earth and for my own spiritual self-improvement. NEVER have I ever been fraudulent in any of my practices in anything. NEVER have I ever done a spell to bring harm on anyone, though I've been sorely tempted, considering some of the evil people around today.


I can tell you taht you have many misconceptions about ritual and magick. We DO NOT do anything in the least sacrificial, not even Communion, which is based on the idea of human sacrifice. We don't believe in Satan and have nothing in common with Satanists. We DO NOT do child molestation. You are very confused about all of this.

And since I"m a practitioner of magick, you think I"m a sociopath? That's insulting to me personally and to my spiritual path. You need to do some real research about witchcraft, not just hurl bombs at those who practice any sort of magick. How dare you judge anyone as evil, just because they believe differently than you. My ancestors were burned at the stake by people like you - you don't think that is evil and sociopathic????



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 12:18 AM
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Doghead:

If Magick's goal is to expand the consciousness, how can it be "provably unsuccessful"?






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