Our congress wants to give Mexico our Social Serurity

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posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 05:29 PM
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Through a Freedom of Information Act Request, a private group recently obtained a copy of a 2004 agreement between the United States and Mexico that will allow hundreds of thousands of noncitizens to receive Social Security benefits.

The agreement creates a so-called “totalization” plan between the two nations. Totalization is nothing new. The first such agreements were made in the late 1970s between the United States and several foreign governments simply to make sure American citizens living abroad did not suffer from double taxation with respect to Social Security taxes. From there, however, totalization agreements have become vehicles for noncitizens to become eligible for U.S. Social Security benefits. The new agreement with Mexico would make an estimated 160,000 Mexican citizens eligible in the next five years.

Ultimately, the bill for Mexicans working legally in the U.S. could reach one billion dollars by 2050, when the estimated Mexican beneficiaries could reach 300,000. Worse still, an estimated five million Mexicans working illegally in the United States could be eligible for the program. According to press reports, a provision in the Social Security Act allows illegal immigrants to receive Social Security benefits if the United States and another country have a totalization agreement.

Thanks to Ron Paul he will help us not do this, this is his site ( www.house.gov... )




posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 05:34 PM
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It may be the final solution to the north american union, since it was 2004 when it was written. Its a way to bate the fish, if we where fishing for mexicans. They would overwhelmingly aprove. We have to stop this CFR thinking and we can do it with the people running for president.



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 05:40 PM
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I would like to see the illegal workers here PAY social security tax! Also I would like to see their wages be SPENT in America. And as far as them being eligible for SS in five years they have to first pay in to SS. Correct me if I am wrong. And what if Ron Paul abolishes the IRS tax? Then THAT will if nothing else only incourage illegal workers to flock into our country. I also wonder if the IRS tax is abolished just where the money will come from? Something will be exchanged and it always falls on us working class stiffs.



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 05:50 PM
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Originally posted by antar
I would like to see the illegal workers here PAY social security tax! Also I would like to see their wages be SPENT in America. And as far as them being eligible for SS in five years they have to first pay in to SS. Correct me if I am wrong. And what if Ron Paul abolishes the IRS tax? Then THAT will if nothing else only incourage illegal workers to flock into our country. I also wonder if the IRS tax is abolished just where the money will come from? Something will be exchanged and it always falls on us working class stiffs.


[font=Courier New]You know we all want to be fair. I mean wages for those who work, but we also want it done legal. I see that the congress has completely lost its mind. Ron Paul did say that getting rid of the IRS was a way towards finacial freedom. But he also noted he could not do that unless we stop sending 10's of billions of dollars to other nations. Which is a reason for pulling troups over seas that are not needed. Imagine we could use those troups right here protecting us, instead of protecting the world. You know and I know that the working class gets it up the. But we are the people by the people and since we the people voted in the people who did this to us then we are to blame for that. We should demand that everyone who votes knows these facts before going to the poll to vote for another CFR member. [/font]



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 06:45 PM
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the NAU is a tricky argument. on one hand, you eliminate a large portion of what would be considered illegal immigration, and you no longer have to worry about what portion of the economy is under the table. on the other hand, you have the argument that secure borders and improved immigration legislation will make america stronger, preventing people who are here illegally from receiving the benefits of the nation while not having to pay the taxes that foot the bill.

it's a question of humanity vs. national economic security(and military security when it comes to the border patrol) vs. the will of the elite to create more powerful institutions at their disposal.

i say america needs to stop directly influencing the rest of the world, and simply lead by example. focus on the problems here and allow the world to follow a model that can lead to the successful progression of all mankind. flexing your muscles in other parts of the world does no good for the nation at home, it only stresses the resources and wills of the citizens.



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 07:39 PM
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You're right, congress has completely lost it's mind. That's because it is no longer the will of the American people, it is an appendage for the CFR and all the globalists.

It's frightening really. America is not in control by Americans anymore. We were infiltrated by Nazis generations ago and we are still being run by globalist maniacs BENT on crippling The United States.

Allowing an influx of illegal immigrants to collapse the realty market and social security is just one of the more flagrant tactics they've used.



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 08:02 PM
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"...the requirement to pay [excise] taxes involves the exercise of privilege."
United States Supreme Court, Flint vs. Stone Tracy Co. 220 U.S. 107 (1911)
There’s seems to be a couple of misunderstandings in the mind of some people concerning Social Security. First off it’s a tax not a retirement plan. as many Americans will soon find out. Even the Social Security Administration admits it’s a tax on their website. In light of the above Supreme Court decision, one might wonder what is the privilege they are exercising in order to be taxed. It’s in the tax statutes. The taxing statute imposing S.S. taxes
Subsec. (g)(1)(C)(iii). Pub. L. 105-277, Sec. 4005(b)(4), inserted before period at end ''and the functions of the Social Security Administration in connection with the withholding of taxes from benefits, as described in section 407© of this title, pursuant to requests by persons entitled to such benefits or such persons' representative payee''. "SEC. 1532 DEFINITIONS.
As used in this subchapter.
(A) Employer.-- The term "employer’ means any carrier (as defined in subsection (h) of this section, and any company which is directly or indirectly owned or controlled by one or more carriers or under common control therewith, and which operates any equipment of facility ( except trucking service, casual service, and the casual operation of equipment or facilities) in the connection with transportation or passengers or property by railroad . .
So the tax being imposed under the guise of Social Security retirement is an excise tax for the benefit of working for the Railroad. A person paying into Social Security has already received their benefits, remember there is no contract. This is also the reason for tax on tips, the tips are ones received on railroad cars that serve food or drinks. Doubt it? Goggle Railroad Retirement Act “tax on tips”. Truth is stranger than fiction. BTW Ron Paul wants to repeal the tax on tips, why not instead point out that it does not apply to those in the private sector, besides the tip is a gift, gifts are not taxable under a certain amount.
A real brief history of Social Security might be in order. Congress first tried a retirement plan (tax) on railroad workers in the fifty states, however the Supreme Court struck it down see Railroad Retirement Board vs. Alton Railroad Co.- 1935.
Faced with this ruling, Congress moved the plan (tax) to the insular possessions, Guam, Porto Rico, Cayman Islands, and D.C. See tax code 26 USC 3121.
Had enough fraud? Well hold on . Anyone who reaches a certain age, has a letter A added to his or her number. They are auxiliary beneficiaries. The real beneficiary is Congress.
26 CFR Sec. 301.7701-11 Social security number.
For purposes of this chapter, the term social security number means
the taxpayer identifying number of an individual or estate which is
assigned pursuant to section 6011(b) or corresponding provisions of
prior law, or pursuant to section 6109, and in which nine digits are
separated by hyphens as follows: 000-00-0000. Such term does not include
a number with a letter as a suffix which is used to identify an
auxiliary beneficiary under the social security program. The terms
``account number'' and ``social security number'' refer to the same
number.
[T.D. 7306, 39 FR 9947, Mar. 15, 1974] *

Some Americans are waking up, and have had with the fraud. There is no money set aside, and the tax doesn't apply. A nice list of these Americans, are receiving full refunds,(everything) liens and levies removed, some securing refunds for the last three years. Visit www.losthorizions.com to see scores of copies of refund checks, and letters removing liens and levies. Click on "These Americans"



posted on Jan, 7 2008 @ 11:22 PM
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Im amazed that this isnt in the news or being talked about in congress. Who is against this disgusting plan?



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 03:59 AM
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Originally posted by karlkar
"...the requirement to pay [excise] taxes involves the exercise of privilege."
United States Supreme Court, Flint vs. Stone Tracy Co. 220 U.S. 107 (1911)


Some Americans are waking up, and have had with the fraud. There is no money set aside, and the tax doesn't apply. A nice list of these Americans, are receiving full refunds,(everything) liens and levies removed, some securing refunds for the last three years. Visit www.losthorizions.com to see scores of copies of refund checks, and letters removing liens and levies. Click on "These Americans"



I understand, as I am now receiving SSDI due to my illness (MS) . I worked hard all my life had the TAX removed from my pay. I made allot of money during my working life. I was a broadcast engineer for an ABC affiliate and trained the NG in desert warfare from 1997 - 2002. Before all that I worked on the F-18 fighter plane and space shuttle communication system. But if you pay into the system and the system does not pay for you and sends the money to people who did not contribute then there is a problem here. My understanding while I had to wait 3 dam years to receive my disablity insurance is that they never ever give you the insurance when you fiirst apply. I had to wait 3 years before I could get my insurance I paid for. This of course is like living homeless for 3 years. My government which I grew up in seemed like it did not work correctly. I mean here I am worked hard and served my country in the AF right after Vietnam. I and beleive in my oath to protect the consitution and serve with honor. I makes me said to say I have been hood winked into believing that my country has given money to mexican imigrants instead of me who worked very hard and defended the constitution of this great nation. Since that time I first understood that I woke up to the fact something is wrong and needs to be fixed. And will continue to point out and post on the wrongness of the government and its policy. I am happy Dr. No is there to point out these problems to us.

[edit on 1/8/2008 by zman]



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 05:01 AM
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In all actuality, does this really even matter? At the current rate of expenditure and population growth the SS fund will be depleted by about 2040, maybe even earlier. Even Medicare's funds are gone by 2020! So even if a bill like this does get passed, there won't be any money to give out anyway! The more I think about it, this bill is really just a false promise to Mexico if it even gets passed.

[edit on 8-1-2008 by Sacreligion]



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 05:55 AM
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Originally posted by Sacreligion
In all actuality, does this really even matter?

[edit on 8-1-2008 by Sacreligion]




Yes it does matter, and no one is talking about it in the debates. Information to truley make ones mind up in an election for the right person to be placed in office. Stop making mistakes and placing in globalistic representives and place in true americans. I am not trying to get you to vote for one person or another. That is your right. But bringing up this infraction of government I feel is my duty and yours.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 06:14 AM
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Well, to be completely straightforward, where is the actual proof of this? All the original post says is that "a private group found a 2004 agreement." There's no actual backing to the story to prove it.

If this is definitely true, it's a terrible idea. But like I said, SS is going to be gone in a short while anyway...so it would seem that even if this argument were to be made in Congress, it would not be feasible due to the short lifespan of the funds available to SS.

[edit on 8-1-2008 by Sacreligion]



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 07:47 AM
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Originally posted by Sacreligion
Well, to be completely straightforward, where is the actual proof of this? All the original post says is that "a private group found a 2004 agreement." There's no actual backing to the story to prove it.

[edit on 8-1-2008 by Sacreligion]


If you go and google NAU and look at the CFR web site you will see that it is indeed true. You may have to search on the CFR to get the documentation. It comes about at that time that our president, honarable Bush has made an agreement with Mexico and Canada to form a one North American Union with out congress or the Americans people say so. This is a treasonist action. Our media, by the way has not said one word about it and our debates are controlled by who?. Our rights to protest this is being erroded to the point of calling us conspiracy therorist. They are laughing at us. We have to reign them in. Question is on how to. I do understand that our SS money being used for other projects we are not aware of too. They see the money as their money to use for what ever they can use it for. Bringing a sound fiscal responcibilty forward can only help the problem, now what person will do that for us. Please before you respond look at the CFR web site and google NAU.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 07:50 AM
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Is there any wonder why the approval rating for Congress is lower than that of dubya's?

If these illegal alien sympathizers feel so strongly about this issue then they should be forced to make their Social Security Numbers public and I'll make sure to share these with the first group of illegals I see tomorrow.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 07:58 AM
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www.eagleforum.org...

This tells allot about the NAU and its intentions.





www.cfr.org... ype.authors.region.issue&oe=&btnG.x=19&btnG.y=7

Above is what the CFR wants to do with us. Now if you want to, search this site and look what has been discussed about that. I only want to help people understand.



[edit on 1/8/2008 by zman]



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 08:04 AM
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Originally posted by Alxandro
Is there any wonder why the approval rating for Congress is lower than that of dubya's?

If these illegal alien sympathizers feel so strongly about this issue then they should be forced to make their Social Security Numbers public and I'll make sure to share these with the first group of illegals I see tomorrow.



I understand your fustrations. Well your fight is not with the illegals as you call them, but with our institution. Talk to your congressman and senate. Vote for ones that will do something. Think out of the box.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 08:16 AM
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Originally posted by Sacreligion
In all actuality, does this really even matter? At the current rate of expenditure and population growth the SS fund will be depleted by about 2040, maybe even earlier. Even Medicare's funds are gone by 2020! So even if a bill like this does get passed, there won't be any money to give out anyway! The more I think about it, this bill is really just a false promise to Mexico if it even gets passed.


This isn't exactly true. the fund is already depleted. Congress has been spending the SS money as fast it comes in for decades. What remains are piles of IOUs. Once the payments going out are more than the payments coming in, these IOUs are going to have to be cashed in and guess where the money is going to come from?? That's right...you, me, and Joe Taxpayer. The entire SS system is a farce and a majority of the bigwigs in Washington are too comfortable with their expensive suits and lobby money to even care that it is that way.

I've been paying into the system for 18 years now and I've already accepted the fact that I will never see a penny of the tens of thousands that the government has stolen from me.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 08:20 AM
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Originally posted by zman
Our media, by the way has not said one word about it and our debates are controlled by who?. Our rights to protest this is being erroded to the point of calling us conspiracy therorist. They are laughing at us.


Exactly. Although, I think Lou Dobbs has had warnings like this on his show, and he's even had Ron Paul on to talk about it. Unfortunately, most Americans are too self-absorbed to realize what's happening underneath their own noses with their own hard-earned money.

As Ben Franklin put it, You get the Government you deserve. I'm afraid if Dr. Paul does not win this election, then America has about a 1% chance of getting back on track.

I can't believe there are videos of Clinton, and Cheney, and others talking to the CFR televised, and saying what they want to do on television, and people are still clueless!



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 08:28 AM
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If the fund is already depleted then where are we getting the money to pay Mexico.

Now here is lies some truth. If we stop supporting the world in cash we lend out and I mean billions of our dollars then we could easily afford SS. Heck we could afford to repair the whole Infrastructure of our nation. This would provide employment would it not. Hence more income to the government to keep it rolling.



posted on Jan, 8 2008 @ 09:05 AM
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Originally posted by zman
If we stop supporting the world in cash...


Bingo!

And the best way to start is by stopping welfare for non-citizens, stopping free healthcare for non-citizens, and stopping free schooling for non-citizens. After that, we can stop propping up puppet governments, stop giving giving 10 billion dollars to Pakistan and other countries in HOPES that their military dictator might do something that faintly resembles cooperation, stop giving foreign aid, etc.

Man could we get a lot done here if we had all our own money back in the States.





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