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Iraqi soldier “Caesar” killed three American soldiers as they kicked , beat a pregnant woman

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posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:07 PM
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reply to post by birchtree
 


This seems to be the version that is being widely quoted. It appears the Iraqi soldier opened fire when the joint patrol came under fire from insugents. Try as I might, I can't find any news agency source that mentions a pregnant woman or indeed anyone else being kicked to death. Even if the US soldiers were psycopaths, would they really have done such a thing when patrolling with a squad of Iraqis?




posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by birchtree
reply to post by Legalizer
 


Legalizer quit being a hater!!!! I think you could focus all that energy somewhere it might be useful.


I'd say he's angry...not being hateful. That's ok because that anger is overdue. I have to say that legalizer has come up with a pretty good catalogue of ills here...many of which define the way folks look at America in general, and the military in particular. However, I'd be more inclined to blame the leadership...not the grunt. And if you consider the degree of mental illness turning up in your (and our) vets...well, it's their circumstances in the field that create that legacy. Legalizer should take his anger out on the politicians, instead. Personally, I can hardly wait for the next election.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by Legalizer
No you can't do anything about political corruption in your own country, you are too busy oppressing third world nations and serving your masters like pitiful dogs.


Damn you got a warped view.

First, the military does not create policy.

Second, the federal military does not act within the borders of the US.

Third, if the military are “dogs” to its masters than the whole country is at fault for voting in those that do make policy.

An old saying…don’t hate the playa, hate the game.



Why do Americans citizens with a brain not respect you uniformed goons?


Why don't Americans with brains vote into office the people who should be there?



Because you earn disrespect with your mentality, your actions, and
your continuous disrespect of the civilian population that raised and fed you.


You really do not know what you are talking about do you? This doesn't even make sense above.




Your arrogance in thinking we owe you something and that you are actually


Who thinks they are owed anything? The military doesn't, but when people like you who just sit back and generalize that the US military is full of evil, corrupt and mindless people then you’re going to have an argument on your hands.

If you want to blame the destabilization in Iraq on someone then blame it on the US government for creating it and then blame it on the sectarian violence, other Arab countries and terrorist groups for continually sustaining that destabilization.

The US military did their job by quickly and efficiently removing Saddam and his party, period. The mess that we see there now has a lot of different forces involved with the US military unwillingly stuck in the middle of it all.


[edit on 5-1-2008 by Xtrozero]



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:25 PM
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reply to post by JohnnyCanuck
 


I agree with your assessment of his projecting his disdain for governmental policy, on the grunt. The soldier, sailor, marine, airman, doesn't make foreign policy, so it's the elected official with whom one's beef should be with, when there's disagreement. As a member of the Armed Forces, you don't get to pick and choose which wars you will participate in, or which orders you will follow(assuming they're not an unlawful order). You're integrity is only as good as your word, and if agree to serve and obey those who are lawfully in charge, you must act in a disciplined manner. A military unit with no discipline, is an ineffective one. What Legalizer fails to grasp, is that there are other ways that his/her freedoms and way of life are protected, that aren't quite as obvious as an invasion of US soil. There are far too many who take things for granted, without considering the costs that have been paid in securing those very things.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:30 PM
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Originally posted by Xtrozero
If you want to blame the destabilization in Iraq on someone then blame it on the US government for creating it and then blame it on the sectarian violence, other Arab countries and terrorist groups for continually sustaining that destabilization.

The US military did their job by quickly and efficiently removing Saddam and his party, period. The mess that we see there now has a lot of different forces involved with the US military unwillingly stuck in the middle of it all.


[edit on 5-1-2008 by Xtrozero]


Excellent point here, as well as your previous rebuttals to his blantantly subjective views. The insurgents are not freedom fighters, or even liked by the majority of the Iraqi people. They are nothing more than thugs and criminals who want to ensure that they have power, and not an elected government.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:40 PM
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News reports say that 2 American soldiers were killed and 3 others wounded, along with a civilian translator. They were setting up an outpost and they were under attack by insurgents, and this Iraqi soldier opened fire and fled, but was identified by other Iraqi troops and captured. This pregnant story is just propaganda in hopes of turning Iraqis against Americans since many Iraqis have been working with Americans and violence has been going down. Need some ammunition to help turn the tide. This pregnant story confirms that desperation. Why this make up story? Not enough motivation?



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:51 PM
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reply to post by manson_322
 


Murder? that should do it... you see in a REAL democracy, you don't have vigilante justice. You have victims and you have aggressors. The Preggo (if she existed at all) WAS the victim, UNTIL the Iraqi Soldier SHOT the American Soldiers, Thus turning the I.S. into the Agressor, and the A.S.es into the victims.

It's fairly logical, BUT it requires you to NOT prejudge EITHER side.
Which you sire, have yet to do. Thank god your not a judge. (or an Iman...)

Coven

***guaranteed there is more to come This thread is PISSING me off***



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 02:56 PM
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Have to pat CavScout on the back for that great contribution to this thread,you have a conscience that is sadly lacking these days.

Thank you for taking the time to post those thoughtfull words,and those words mean all the more considering your history in that region

As for this topic,Its going to be hard to find the truth here considering both sides can easily say black is white!On past examples one can say this incident could be possible,but on the other side it could be bogus!

Anyway,if the troops were beating a pregnant woman then they got what they deserved.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:05 PM
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Originally posted by deltaboy
This pregnant story confirms that desperation. Why this make up story? Not enough motivation?


Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Nothing is confirmed. You can beat on conjecture til the cows come home...that doesn't make it fact. Learn the difference.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:06 PM
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Originally posted by eyewitness86
Good!! I hope that every Iraqi soldier with a gun kills every American solider that abuses the law and human rights. ***snip***

We are becoming worse than anyone we ever fought against in this world....all due to the sick Bush and Clinton NWO lackeys who love money and hate liberty for anyone but them. I say let em all get killed opver there and then maybe the people will wake up



WOW.... WHOA... HOLD UP..... YOU WANT US Soldiers to die? WOW... I guess the British Soldiers who fight in wars should die too, eh?

If I could Punch through a computer A LOT of you posters would have a black eye right now.(note SARCASM)

Did you people start ranting on this crap drunk or something?

SUCH HIGH MORAL GROUND.... HE HIT A WOMAN! KILL HIM!

Very Christlike/Buddha like/Zen of you. Learn something about morality before you throw the word around.

As a Great Prophet once said "When he doth strike me, I shall turn the other cheek and offer it to him" NOT "When He Hits me, I'm gonna blow his ass away with a high caliber rifle."

YOU PEOPLE ARE MAKING ME SICK...

MOD's Shut this internationally baited thread down... JEEZ.

If ceasar were ANY kind of hero, he would have STOPPED THE ATTACK without lethal force. He is just as bad as the men who were beating the pregnant woman... THERE ARE NO HEROES IN THIS STORY... QUIT LOOKING FOR ONE.

Plus this is 70% propaganda (after all the only English link you could find to ANY type of story closely related was a WEEK prior to the story you are posting about... I seriously doubt this HAPPENED)

But anyways good luck with your Fatwa against the Western World... After all... We are the Great Satan, Coming to eat your babies and drink your blood (note sarcasm). Just like communism in the 50's... But only its the Middle East who's now afraid of US....



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:11 PM
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Anyone who would beat a pregnant women deserves death. It is not complicated or hard to figure out. I believe it would be nothing less than human instinct to kill or at the very least, attack, someone who was harming a pregnant woman. Especially if the attackers are foreign, and they are attacking a pregnant woman from your own country and religion.

I believe it is natural human instinct to protect women, but especially pregnant women because they symbolize the continuation of your species.

Regardless, this is nothing new on the American soldier's behalf. There are countless stories of them gang raping women, beating children to death, and just plain executing innocent civilians. If you think it's bad now, wait 10 years when all of the stories have surfaced. Do I think the soldiers are bad people? Yes. Did they go to Iraq as bad people? No.
These guerilla wars always corrupt the invader because they cannot tell an enemy from a civilian and end up murdering countless innocent people.

Just like Vietnam.

[edit on 5-1-2008 by Trauma]

[edit on 5-1-2008 by Trauma]



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:22 PM
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There are countless stories of them gang raping women, beating children to death, and just plain executing innocent civilians. If you think it's bad now, wait 10 years when all of the stories have surfaced.


WOW ! and where are these countless reports?

I think if anyone purposely post propaganda with the intent to vilify the innocent and spread hatred, they should be banned.

If this forum is indeed read by thousands, it then seems to me that a propagandist has a good platform to create discord.

If this story is true, there would be riots in the streets of Iraq, if they riot over teddy bears and cartoons, I imagine this would top that.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by manson_322


I have said to say :
Well done Caesar , you saved the dignity of woman and maybe the unborn child too from death from the bloodthirsty american occupation soldiers
may the good God bless you for your deed.


Not so fast. This could be a PR stunt by al queda in Iraq. How do we not know that this Caesar did not infiltrate the iraqi military first, killing 3 US soldiers and then saying they were kicking a pregnant women. Sounds fishy to me. IT deffinatly makes the US forces look bad.

I just dont see it...american soldiers kicking a "known" pregnant women. Somthing isnt adding up.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:43 PM
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I don't know why people would automaticallu assume this story is false, obviously verification is desireable, but it is hardly a shock considering the behaviour of many of the american troops in Iraq, take this story from 2006 for example
A 14-year old girl gang-raped, killed and burned by americans, the girl had to listen to her parents being shot dead by the evil sick twisted americans as they raped her
www.youtube.com...

One of the americans involved said he went to Iraq to kill people.

www.cnn.com...

Now if those americans aren't a representation of totally depraved evil, then what is. And those guys are representatives of the nations that sent them there to kill.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:48 PM
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If I take the side of the Iraqi soldier is not because I hate "America". If those who kicked that pregnant woman were Romanian I would still be on the side of that Iraqi soldier.

I am against racism and nationalism. If I see person beating a pregnant woman I could not care less about his religion, country, race, and so on

[edit on 5-1-2008 by pai mei]



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by Trauma
Anyone who would beat a pregnant women deserves death. It is not complicated or hard to figure out. I believe it would be nothing less than human instinct to kill or at the very least, attack, someone who was harming a pregnant woman. Especially if the attackers are foreign, and they are attacking a pregnant woman from your own country and religion.


I think your right, however I dont think we have the whole story here. Al Queada is very very sneaky, and in the past, have infiltrated the Iraqi government. This could be a cover story for something much more sinister than what meets the eye.



Regardless, this is nothing new on the American soldier's behalf. There are countless stories of them gang raping women, beating children to death, and just plain executing innocent civilians. If you think it's bad now, wait 10 years when all of the stories have surfaced. Do I think the soldiers are bad people? Yes. Did they go to Iraq as bad people? No.
These guerilla wars always corrupt the invader because they cannot tell an enemy from a civilian and end up murdering countless innocent people.

Just like Vietnam.

Im sorry, but you cannot be taken seriously with the above drivel. Unless, you perhaps have seen first hand what has taken place.

I have heard stories where young Iraqi children have shot at US soldiers. Its either shoot, or be shot. Soldiers have died at the hands of children in Iraq. Alot like what happened in somalia. Children shot at US soldiers, and in return, they were shot at.

I think its alot easier to judge others when its their ass on the line and not yours. This is a case that applys to you, and all the stereotypes who based there cherry picked, biased opinions on it.

I assure you, the extremist are doing far worse then the US soldiers, and it has been well "documented". Yet you choose to blame US soldiers? You, sir, suffer from anti-americanism.

[edit on 5-1-2008 by West Coast]



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by Xeros
But pesonally think the term bad "apples" seems a bit 'playschool' considering we are be talking about the death of others, which is a serious issue, not to be tainted with cliched phrases (imo). I'm not debating who's right or wrong, it's just that term that makes me feel that death/war is becoming an obvious meme, and thus being trivialsed.


[edit on 5-1-2008 by Xeros]



Can we change the term to every battalion will have 1 or 2 bad soldiers in it?

That should put it more in a realistic non-playschool terminology.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:57 PM
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Originally posted by manson_322
Well done Caesar...may the good God bless you for your deed.


Is this the kind of language and opinion that we wish to see on ATS?

You can't use the n-word, you cant swear, you cant show photos of a pair of knockers and you can't quote more than 3 paragraphs from an external source.

But you can wish people were dead, you can congratulate people for murdering someone and you can celebrate death and murder.

Quite bizarre.

Until the facts are borne out in this matter then I will reserve judgement.

But rest assured. Irrespective of the actions of any indiviual in this case and despite the final outcome for all concerned, I will not be celebrating, glorifying or justifying the death of anyone. Ever.

We need to tighten up on this kind of language on ATS because rather than add to the content of the OP, it actually incites hatred and discourages benevolence.

Dont get me wrong, the OP has a place on this forum. The hatred does not.

[edit on 5/1/2008 by skibtz]



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 03:57 PM
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Just more out of control violence perpetrated by inhumane products of filth who are proudly representing our army.

Way to make us look like the devil! Beating on pregnant woman, yeaaah... America is really doing the right thing in Iraq.

The thing that disgusts me is the fact that we are sending people over there who are heartless and xenophobic enough to BEAT on a pregnant women. These aren't Americans, they are military products of our satanic-mind-controlled institutes. They are taught that human life, especially that of Iraqis or 'insurgents' is worthless. These are the same scum we can expect to shoot American citizens when they finally stand up to the government. Blah.

This war and anybody remotely supportive of it fits squarely in the realm of : LOST CAUSE.

This war is a lost cause, and anybody still supporting it is a LOST CAUSE.



posted on Jan, 5 2008 @ 04:05 PM
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Originally posted by birchtree

As far as the Iraqi soldiers go......America does not know who they are training and in fact at times are training insurgents themselves....

insurgent Muslims kill each other all the time...and rape women....and rape little boys...and steal, and kill women and children. Even though they say this is against Allahs law but then they turn right around and praise him for their little victories.



You're right, the Military is so clueless that yes, we are training insurgents to watch Iraq. They've been recorded on video speaking about hidden bomb sites in FRONT of American soldiers, while being trained by them. It's a joke and it makes America look absolutely clueless (which it is).

As far as "Muslims" killing and raping little boys? Give me a break. Those aren't Muslims. Those are insane people hiding under a religious flag. Oh, kind of like, I don't know, the conservative christian politicians who ACTUALLY rape little boys and murder people. Sounds kind of familiar to me... I don't believe for a second they are christians and I don't bother labeling insurgents as 'Muslims'. This is something you've been trained by the military to do.





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