!!!Mars Blue Sky & Water!!!

Originally posted by Mogwai

Originally posted by Horusnow
Very interesting thread indeed.

I examined the pic a bit more and found what seems to be an imprint of some
circular object on the left side of the 'water pond' in the background. I enhanced
the picture by using 'auto levels' in Photoshop. Check it out:

Where I come frrom they like to call those "craters" crazy ain't it?

It could just be a patch of a rock.

That "water" appears to be sitting on a slope. The "water" has not flowed down the slope. (To the left) Very un-water-like behaviour, even in lower gravity than earth's.

"NASA'S Mars Exploration Rover Spirit captured this westward view from atop a low plateau where it spent the closing months of 2007.

With its daily solar-energy supply shrinking as Martian summer turned to fall, Spirit drove to the northern edge of the plateau called "Home Plate" for a favorable winter haven. The rover reached that northward-tilting site in December, in time for the fourth Earth-year anniversary of its landing on Mars. Spirit reached Mars on Jan. 4, 2004, Universal Time (Jan. 3, 2004, PST).

This panorama covers a scene spanning left to right from southwest to northeast. The western edge of Home Plate is in the foreground, generally lighter in tone than the more distant parts of the scene. A rock-dotted hill in the middle distance across the left third of the image is "Tsiolkovski Ridge," about 30 meters or 100 feet from the edge of Home Plate and about that same distance across. A bump on the horizon above the left edge of Tsiolkovski Ridge is "Grissom Hill," about 8 kilometers or 5 miles away. At right, the highest point of the horizon is "Husband Hill," to the north and about 800 meters or half a mile away.

Spirit was perched near the western edge of Home Plate when it used its panoramic camera (Pancam) to take the images used in this view. This view combines separate images taken through Pancam filters centered on wavelengths of 753 nanometers, 535 nanometers and 432 nanometers and is presented in a false-color stretch to bring out subtle color differences in the scene."

Took from www.nasa.gov...

Tell us something we don't know Iseek....



The structure in the backround, if you look closely, blends in with the white crust on the horizon... definitely natural.

This is a impressive picture, but there is something wierd about it, what are those metal plates doing there? It looks as if something could have landed there besides us.

reply to post by tati.12


Metal plates?

The only metal plates that I see, on the bottom of the image, are the solar panels of the rover.

The humanoid figures appear to me to be fossilized remains of beings that were caught in the final cataclysmic event that wiped out life on Mars. Ever seen the pictures from Pompei of the people frozen in time after dying in the ash from the volcano eruption? The being on the rock has turned at the last moment to check on the fallen being to his right rear side. The being on the left may have been checking over the rock on them both. Yes I know they are small....but who says that the humanoids would not have been alot smaller than Earth humans? You all have surely heard of the stories of giants upon the Earth in ancient times. Maybe these tales were told by these Mars beings and were describing us. This is as possible as any theory I have seen posted here.

Certainly does appear to be water. It could be oxidized minerals. Like a silver oxide..Which would appear blue...But that doesn't explain the waves or the color depth gradient. Great find!

reply to post by mikesingh



thanks Mike!!! I knew they were a little TALLER.


Seriously. Maybe I believe in Tinkerbell. I wasnt trashing the "humanoid" theory. However, I would think a "humanoid" would be more "human" size.

Eh, who am I? No expert, thats for sure

reply to post by imdeceived


Looks like a crater.

reply to post by Dont Hate Rats


Mabye a real Martian was playing w/ his GI Joe when he got startled by the Rover and ran off, leavinig his GI Joes to tumble over.




[edit on 5-1-2008 by greeneyedleo]

Good thing ya'll have a level headed CG artist on this forum (me).

It looks like water, but it is at and angle, almost 45 degrees. The "humaniod" isn't humanoid at all it's just a rock formation. I've seen people go into the woods and take random pictures in multiple directions and then later try to see things that aren't there (like fairies, woods spirits ect.). The eye sees what it wants to lots of times, that's why we need to look at this without our minds made up about what we THINK is the truth about mars. I believe some of what we are seeing as "water" are just different types of soil or mineral deposits as others have said.

The only thing I see that is really strange and stands out to me is the sky. Even when I adjust the hues to what would be the proper color, it still comes out like total cloud cover at about 4pm in the winter time. Or maybe it's just whitesh grey, not sure though. The crater is kinda cool, the thing being a body of water to the right of it though, well it defies gravity if it is, looks like some darker mineral deposit to me, maybe a reflective one is the sky really is blue. The part about NASA saying that it's false colors, well, I find that hard to believe even when I try to color correct it, it still looks a lot like what it still does. Honestly, NASA's full of BS as far as I'm concerned.

Many issues arecdiscussed here. Lot's of redundant material, but that is to be expected I guess.

We discussed the color issues a short few weeks ago and as I know some of the experts and linked their sites. Don Davis is a colleague of mine and he is likely one of or the best astronomical artists there is. See his Site

He was actually one of the people who did the compositing for the first Mars lander color photos. He is also a photographer and can talk about these issues with experience and science that is clear and accurate. See his work on this issue here

Color in Space Photography

On the "figures" you see in the images many are making some mistakes very easy to make.

First, the dunes waves mistaken for water waves. Waves are caused by wind, and on Mars the air is so much thiner that in many cases all it can do is blow around talcum powder sized particles. Wind there would not make waves that big if indeed what you where looking at was water. Sand is another thing and can be duned there, but it is slightly different physics.

Even the shapes of the waves is different from Mars to Earth sand environments because the physics with respect to the air density is so different.

At Ames Research Center in Mountain View CA where I was contracted to do illustrations for Advanced Life Support, one day I stood next to a NASA researcher looking at a Silicon Graphics Indigo monitor with a section of a high resolution B&W image from the first Viking 2 Mars images and he was commenting on how the sand around a rock formed differently from the Martian wind than that of terrestrial (Earth) sand and wind. I learned about this from him.

Depending on conditions, size and shapes of sand particles wave shapes and effects can be very individual. I've done lots of desert exploration and seen many different structures for dune and wind-blown surfaces. I even have experienced "Booming Sand" where the particle shapes when flowing down a slope make very weird sounds. We where in a bowl in the Panamint Dunes and thought a squadron of WW2 bombers was going over, but when the sound did not Doppler or end we shook our heads and decided it was just a strange heat effect. Years later I read an article in Scientific American on it. So we all can be fooled.

On the humanoid figure I see what this is, but you need to do the homework. I have not done this yet, but you can. With the image and a good photo editing application like Photoshop or Thumbs Plus, push the saturation a bit and you might see that the arm extending from the rock of the figure is actually a shadow structure in the ground behind it that so happens to be in the right place to look like it is an extended forearm. The saturation push will show it is part of the background by amplifying the color inherent in each pixel hex set. The background pixels will likely be of a different color and the push will show this.

Anyone familiar with artists like Bev Dolittle will know how arranging foreground with background features can create such illusions of color, shape and form. I won a contest in Omni magazine for using such an effect for an illustration in 198?.

As a long time visual researcher and 40 years of illustration I have seen and exploited many of these and other effects. You need to see these to actually understand how our eyes can be fooled. Another thing that helped me was taking a course in Cognition and Perception at SJS University with my now wife in the late seventies. Much more is known now on this and I try and keep up, but Google some terms like, "Automatic Pattern Recognition to the Study of Human Pattern Perception" or similar.

Also look at some of the old threads and do a search on these subject. I did not do that back in September when I started posting here and a nice mod showed me I was talking about very much older threads already discussed.

I believe there is water and life on Mars. I just don't think any of these discussed are actually evidenced here. We need to educate each other and our new friends to understand without trashing them. There is lots of material we will find that is much more clear and challenging here. We need to bootstrap each others skills at reaserch to get good at this. I still am educated by some other sharp people here. Keeping our humility close, we can all get better at this.

Good effort everyone.

ZG

reply to post by FutureAbductee


Something you got to keep in mind, when the folks dies in Pompeii they didn't fossilize. Their bodies were enveloped and then basically dissolved, except for a few bones (I think). It wasn't known that the pockets found in the rocks were bodies until a scientist had a great idea to fill the holes with plaster to see what might have cause the holes that they were found to be human remains. So it wouldn't be remains. Personally I agree with the fellow above me here, a lot seems off in this picture, it's not water, and it's not a humanoid figure.
Now, for the benefit of the doubt, I will say that it's slightly possible that it could be a small metal statue, that somehow withstood thousands or more year of abuse in the elements of mars after whatever tragedy befell it and it's supposed civilization.

Originally posted by jimmyjackblack
Good thing ya'll have a level headed CG artist on this forum (me).

You may spend the rest of your life trying to colour correct that image that you will never get anything close to true colour, unless you can find a way of showing what was photographed with the infra-red filter as if it was photographed with a red filter.

To see the color spectrum of the "Blue sky" you can go to the top of the OPs pic, and move your slider back and forth along the top of it, and watch the sky change. Its bluest exactly over the "Water".

Is it possible this is do to the terminator between night and day? For all I know A mars day is 50 years long.
-or-
Is it from NASA (And why does everyone keep calling them NAZA? ID that like NAZI?If so, clever! ) changing the picture for better contrast as stated?

And to GreenEyedLeo: I see why, if they did, fudge the pictures a bit. I mean, A Martian artifact is one thing, but a Martian Collectible? The price on Ebay would be astounding and we could drive small countries to poverty just by selling it.

Flagged, Starred, waxed, cleaned with 401, and displayed.

That is not a pond it is a sand dune, we the same effects here on Earth.

The rover looks very dusty and as if is slowly leaking a oil or grease of some type.

That whit object on the horizon appears to be a pyramid of some type, strange. It reminds me of how the pyramids on earth used to be, they were covered with a white coating that made them apear very bright, but over time that layer was removed so now they have the golden undercoating we are so use to seeing.

That figure, is strange from waist down it appears to be a matching rock formation, but from waist up it appears to be a human type shape, but is too shaded so perhaps it was photoshoped in there. Either way the way the head and arm looking objects do not appear to be natural.

reply to post by ZeroGhost


It came to my attention the link was deeper for colors on Mars.

Here is the direct link

ZG

ZeroGhost,
You said:
[quote]On the humanoid figure I see what this is, but you need to do the homework. I have not done this yet, but you can. With the image and a good photo editing application like Photoshop or Thumbs Plus, push the saturation a bit and you might see that the arm extending from the rock of the figure is actually a shadow structure in the ground behind it that so happens to be in the right place to look like it is an extended forearm. The saturation push will show it is part of the background by amplifying the color inherent in each pixel hex set. The background pixels will likely be of a different color and the push will show this.

Could you please try this out for yourself and post your results on the above information?

I just want to see your results on this. Not that I don't agree with you on this -- but just want to see your edit of it because I think you've brought up an important point here but since you were the one to bring it up (the thing about the shadows) it would be best that you show your own edit of that figure that's showing what you are saying here.

Have a look at the joystick/sun dial on the colour callibration target.

Notice anything?

I find it strange that red dust covers most of the surface of the rover yet the top of the joystick is free of dust.

NASA fake or something has handled that section of the rover.... curious ET's?

For those that may say the dust may not have settled all over the sun dial, check out the previous picks in this thread of the surface of the rover. It's covered (from above).

It would be good if we could see a picture of that guide without the dust for comparison. I'll try do dig it up.
















[edit on 5-1-2008 by Grimholt]