!!!Mars Blue Sky & Water!!!, page 21
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reply posted on 1-8-2008 @ 06:32 PM by Dan Tanna
reply to post by zorgon



I had all this fancy data, a few pics, log into ATS with the intention of adding them, and I see I get beaten to the punch by yours truely.

I just think that 1996 pic is beautiful beyond words. Some thing about its barren but life giving qualities all in one pic.





reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 03:45 AM by fleabit
Originally posted by zorgon
Originally posted by fleabit
Finally, NASA, if they were covering things up, would not make such huge blunders as to put pictures on their site for the general public to view, if it contained things they wanted hidden.


UNLESS...

They wanted to start letting the info out slowly



Or... there is nothing there. Which seems more logical by far. Just using your head: There can be no actual water, as it would be frozen solid. There are no ripples, because there is no wind. So people are jumping to conclusions. Just like they do with ALL OTHER rocks and shapes, that they assume are kittens and skulls and homes and mars-marts and who knows what else.

By the way, I find it terribly amusing, that we have folks that have found endless skulls. But.. no femurs, ribs, or other bones. Why? Because people are used to seeing skulls. In art, tattoos, on t-shirts, you name it. It's embedded into people's brains. So it's a pattern that jumps out, and people just find it. Like you'd find whales in clouds. Do you find rotors in clouds? No.. because it's not a common object you often see. People find shapes in rocks that are imprinted in their memories, because they see it alot. Pyramids, skulls, and other very commonly "known" objects by their shape. Not more complex shapes. Because like an ink-blot test, you see stuff that you know.

I believe there may have been water on Mars once. And there is frozen water there now. I don't believe for a moment there is free-flowing water, grass, trees, and buildings. For one, like on earth, they'd be covered up by ages of dust from sand and dust storms. And while I personally WISH there was some astounding discovery where we find evidence of a great civilization there, I don't think we've even gotten close to a shred of proof. We are barely at the point of saying there was the most basic forms of life there. I hope we do find evidence of more, but I don't think we've found it yet. And I certainly don't believe we've found lakes and grass.


reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 03:06 PM by zorgon
Originally posted by fleabit
Which seems more logical by far. Just using your head: There can be no actual water, as it would be frozen solid.


Logic? Is THAT what you are using? Well then using logic what happens when the soil becomes +81F? Any idea? My logic tells me that ice melts above +32F... perhaps you have different logic?

Heck even the guys at Bad Astronomy know the temps on Mars...

There is an extensive discussion of the temperature on Mars at this website: Mars Temperature Overview (www-k12.atmos.washington.edu...), by James Tillman from the University of Washington. He says that the maximum recorded temperature at the two Viking sites was +1 F (256 K, -17 C), and the minimum -178 F (156 K, -117 C). He gives the maximum soil temperature as +81 F (300 K, +27 C). - Tim Thompson

www.bautforum.com...


But I see by the questions there that the others use your logic while only Tim uses my logic, that logic being actual RESEARCH from NASA


because there is no wind.


No wind?

Well then what keeps blowing the dust off the Rovers to keep them running all these years?

What causes the planet wide dust storms?



How about all these trails made by dust devils? You DO know what dust devils are yes?



Here is one climbing a crater wall seen from orbit



Here is a whole bunch of them caught in action by Spirit



Clouds moving by...




Here is a WHOLE PAGE OF STORMS I would suggest you take a minute to educate yourself


By the way, I find it terribly amusing, that we have folks that have found endless skulls. But.. no femurs, ribs, or other bones. Why?


Because people like yourself are not looking... I find THAT amusing

This is the famous Rotelli fossil reported at NASA... its easy to find in google (thats a search engine)



Here are some of mine and Skippers








Do you find rotors in clouds? No.. because it's not a common object you often see. People find shapes in rocks that are imprinted in their memories, because they see it alot.


OR the 'imprint' is actually there and THAT is why we recognize it... Those nature Spirits are very tricky

You see a FACE in this storm because the FACE is there... what caused the face may be natural, a fluke, or the work of mischievious spirits.. but EVERYONE sees the FACE not rotors, not rocks not anyrhing else... simply because it is there




I believe there may have been water on Mars once.
I don't believe for a moment there is free-flowing water, grass, trees, and buildings. For one, like on earth, they'd be covered up by ages of dust from sand and dust storms.


Then why are the Rovers still running clean and clear? I can show you many pics of the dust on them... which is gone days later... They have been running FIVE YEARS without maintenance or cleaning... so explain your dust theory regarding the rovers

What you believe or do not believe does not change the facts...

There IS wind on Mars.. lots of it.
There are days it is warm enough for water to melt or do you doubt NASA
There ARE clouds in the blue sky... even ArMaP agrees with that



And I certainly don't believe we've found lakes and grass.


Well I just showed the frozen lake ESA found... I guess they are fibbing too

And then there is THIS one...




And THESE



But it looks MUCH better in COLOR (thanks to Spines)



Personally I find it really sad that so many on ATS have such closed minds and don't even do a minutes worth of searching on what is really happening out there... yet seem to feel the need to 'explain it' to us


[edit on 2-8-2008 by zorgon]



reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 03:34 PM by menguard
So they are sending our little bi-ped buddy there in hopes of creating more stable jungles and forest perhaps along with a petting zoo. interesting.

www.dvorak.org...

Mother Russia, doing its part. Trying to create a petting zoo up there hugh?

Noahs ark to Mars in 4...3...2.....1

[edit on 2-8-2008 by menguard]


reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 04:24 PM by menguard
reply to post by zorgon


That might be a problem in that -timespace- they are a lot more intelligent and planet of the apes rules supreme.

They might be sending back those (animal lovers) with dog tags, and names.



With the stamp EARTH REJECTS NEED NOT APPLY.



(Zorgon your welcome)
Glad to help out where I can.

Also on another note think along the lines of The One Hundredth Monkey Syndrome and how prevalent that could be now.

WIKIPEDIA

The “Hundredth Monkey Effect” is a supposed phenomenon in which a learned behaviour spreads instantaneously from one group of monkeys to all related monkeys once a critical number is reached. By generalisation it means the instant, paranormal spreading of an idea or ability to the remainder of a population once a certain portion of that population has heard of the new idea or learned the new ability. The story behind this supposed phenomenon originated with Lyall Watson, who claimed that it was the observation of Japanese scientists. One of the primary factors in the promulgation of the myth is that many authors quote secondary or tertiary (or worse) sources who have themselves misrepresented the original observations.


The above didn't really help.

Okay supposedly one monkey on an island learns how to do something that the others couldn't, but even though he is the (only one) on the island one hundred miles away, he is sending information back to his people, by him just being there. The monkey did this for a week or so, soon, later a hundred miles away other monkies were doing it to.



[edit on 2-8-2008 by menguard]


reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 06:24 PM by menguard
reply to post by zorgon


Correct its a NEXUS POINT for mankind, its a rise in consciousness, alertness, awareness,intelligence, and physiologically.

My sources say 2014 is the bread and butter but ohh well.

This also deals with the sun being moved into another position in space and time, which is increasing the resonance.

Well this increased intelligence goes out like a wave into the eternal sea of awareness affecting all that is and ever will be.



[edit on 2-8-2008 by menguard]


reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 09:00 PM by fleabit
No wind?

Well then what keeps blowing the dust off the Rovers to keep them running all these years?

What causes the planet wide dust storms?


They are actually still not completely sure what causes the wind storms. Saltation when the atmosphere was perhaps denser may have created dunes on Mars, or so scientists presume.

As far as the ripples *in that picture* there obviously no wind. No dust whatsoever, it's calm. Ever fish? I guess not. If you fish and it's utter dead, there are no ripples. Ripples and waves are caused by atmosphere.. wind.. and the wind is very light on Mars, the asmosphere almost non-existant. With ripples that noticable, you'd need a fairly brisk wind. I see no evidence of this at all. On what weather phenomena do you attribute obvious ripples? Just curious.

And those "fossils" for cripes sake.. they are rocks. If a rock has holes in it, it's automatically a skull or bone? Gee, those can't possibly be just rocks, could they. People need to get out of the notion that all rocks look identical. Even on earth we have rocks and minerals that are quite amazing looking.

People are so eager to find stuff on Mars, anymore, all people see are shapes and lakes and objects in anything that is not perfectly rock-shaped. If it does not conform to our preconceived idea of what rocks should look like, or dunes, they are obviously leaked images or a bygone civilization, eh?

Um.. coloring something blue by the way, doesn't automatically make it water. You can't think of ANY other natural phenomena that could produce similar pictures? That's what I'm talking about.

If it looks like ripples, it can't POSSIBLY be dunes or anything else, it MUST be water. If they are not "normal" rocks, they are obviously fossils. If there are pictures of flat smooth areas, it's CLEARLY water, it can't be anything else.

Whereas when I look at it, I say to myself, "there is almost no atmoshphere on Mars, almost no wind (btw, you might want to do some research if you think it's "very windy," because it's not), it's seemingly devoid of life, it probably never harbored life over anything bigger than a bacteria.... so anything that seems out of the ordinary should be researched for all other possibilities first. If I can explain all of those away, then maybe I can entertain other more hopeful ideas."

I don't immediately make a leap of faith that "omg that's WATER!" just because it looks like ripples. You have absolutely no proof other than your common knowledge that it is what you think it is. Are you a master of geology? I work in an industry where we have a lot of geologists in my office, and I've seen rocks and mineral formations that blew away any preconceived notions I had. And yet daily here, I see folks circling and coloring what are to me, simple rocks, and coming up with all sorts of obtuse ideas about what they are.

Coverup? Disclosure? Or just overeager folks wanting to find gold in the pan? I think the latter.

[edit on 2-8-2008 by fleabit]


reply posted on 2-8-2008 @ 11:44 PM by sarcastic
Here's another differently colored version of the same West Valley.

Only in this one it looks like people are all over the place. What do you think?

33 megabytes takes a while to load.




Gosh!

If you click on the bottom right corner of that photo you get an enlargement the size of a bedsheet. Wow!

It's like YOU'RE THERE, taking a walk ... must be rainy season ... mud everywhere ... just a few souls here and around. They look like fleas.

What a trip.


sarc


[edit on 2-8-2008 by sarcastic]

[edit on 3-8-2008 by sarcastic]


reply posted on 3-8-2008 @ 12:50 AM by zorgon
Originally posted by fleabit
there obviously no wind. No dust whatsoever, it's calm.



Serendipity....

Interesting photos from Phoenix and rovers
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Presented here are some of the best images of Martian atmosphere (and beyond) in action.

Must see and very timely weather on Mars pictures... better than the usual NASA Sources



reply posted on 3-8-2008 @ 04:36 PM by menguard
reply to post by monkeybus


Interesting possibilities, it could be the sun, it could be a dome, it could be a pyramid.

Now I see white light, but it could be refraction off an object that is close to the sun.

If you look at the object or the outline of the picture depicting the area you will see almost a triangle outline of light. Now is that the sun reflecting off a pyramid creating the light.

Can somebody enlargen that picture, and give thermo pictures uploaded.

I know it has an atmosphere but I am curious of the light behind the shape and picture outline.


reply posted on 3-8-2008 @ 04:48 PM by menguard
reply to post by Awarenessiskey


I would say different space settings. Depending on where a shot or location is taken whether it be in the miday or night or morning.

Now the planet itelf looks like a HUGE RED MOON, I was lucky enough to see it one night come the closest it will in many years, looks just like the moon pictures with impact craters, but just red and larger. Now upon the planet Earth from the outside you would see it as a blue hue, so maybe from 'the perspective' it looks different from the inside and the outside.

And I do believe Nasa just uses maybe shots of Arizona deserts (on some) while others here and there throw some actual shots of Mars in unpopulated areas, yes places that wouldn't expose people up there.

They usually take astronauts to places that close replicate the areas they will be going in while training, I know their is one is Nevada, and Arizona.

How this affects us down here while having other members of the human population on Mars could also be part of the one hundredth monkey effect down here, there is transmissions from humans projecting that vibration back to Earth which speeds up our frequency also. Now think of all the other humans that are on other planets in different space and times, then what we have here, that is a form of time travel.

I would say Mars Carbon Monoxide levels are higher on Mars. But still a breathable atmosphere.
And I can't forget Nitrogen a planets friend. Give life to that planet with an explosion of energy.

Throw some trees up there some animals and water, and people and you got Adam and Eve. Eutopia. (Terrafirming) a planet they are and have been doing it for the the last twenty two years.

I am sure they got that atmosphere down pat for human living.

[edit on 3-8-2008 by menguard]
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