reply to post by Justin Oldham
Even if we factor out Ruby Ridge and Waco . .
RUBY RIDGE. In January, 1991, ATF agents posed as broken-down motorists and arrested Randy and Vicki Weaver when they stopped their car to assist.
Randy Weaver was told of the charges against him, released on bail and told his trial would begin on 19 February 1991.
Two weeks later, the trial date was changed to 20 February, but the US Probation Office sent out a letter which stated the date as 20 March. Weaver
did not appear on the correct trial date and the judge issued a warrant for his arrest.
On 14 March a grand jury which the US Attorney's Office had not informed of the incorrect date in the letter, indicted Weaver for failing to appear
on the correct trial date.
[THIS PRACTICE HAPPENS SO OFTEN IT IS REGARDED BY DEFENSE LAWYERS AS AN OLD PROSECUTOR’S TRICK!]
On August 21, 1992, six marshals were sent to scout the area to determine suitable places away from the cabin to ambush and arrest Weaver.
[RANDY WEAVER COULD HAVE AVOIDED THE TRAGIC AFTERMATH OF THIS SIEGE HAD HE ENDED IT ON THIS DAY BY SURRENDERING TO THE FBI.]
On August 22, the second day of the siege, an FBI sniper, Lon Horiuchi, shot and wounded Randy Weaver in the right arm, while he was lifting the latch
on the shed to visit the body of his dead son. Then as Weaver, his 16-year-old daughter Sara and Harris ran back toward the house, Horiuchi took a
second shot, which struck and wounded Harris, and killed Vicki Weaver. The stand-off was ultimately resolved by a negotiating team and Weaver and
Harris surrendered and were arrested.
The surviving members of the Weaver family filed a wrongful death suit and Randy Weaver received a $100,000 settlement while his daughters received $1
million each. Kevin Harris received a $380,000 settlement. From Wikipedia.
WACO. The Waco Siege began on February 28, 1993 when the US Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) attempted to execute a search warrant
at the Branch Davidian ranch at Mount Carmel, located nine miles east-northeast of Waco, Texas. The Siege was to end April 19, 1993, some 50 days
after it began. Seventy-six people, including 21 children and two pregnant women, along with Davidian leader Vernon Wayne Howell, better known as
David Koresh, died in the fire. From Wikipedia.
COMMENTARY. I regard those two events as anomalies. In the case of Ruby Ridge, Weaver made a mistake not uncommon when people set out to modify a
shotgun barrel by shortening it. Federal law forbids making a rifle or shotgun barrel shorter than 18 inches. It’s easy to measure the end of the
barrel, the problem is where to measure the beginning.
Due to lower internal pressures in a shotgun the firing chamber merges with the barrel in one smooth transition. You might say the chamber segues into
the barrel. [The word segue (pronounced segway) is defined as "to transition smoothly from one state to another”].
The problem with shotguns is made all the more complex with the fact that many shotguns have a 3 inch chamber (for standard loads) while others have a
3.5 inch chamber (for high power loads). Note: It is flat-out illegal to alter or modify (say cut-down) the stock of either a rifle or shotgun in the
US.
So Randy goofed. He measured wrong. He cut the shotgun barrels to 17.5 inches. A Federal no-no. Then add to that he also had a bad attitude. It was
that bad attitude coupled with an overload of stupidity that cost the life of his son and his wife. So much for bad attitudes. And for stupidity.
Randy was over "blessed" with plenty of stupidity and bad attitude.
Waco was a similar fiasco based on grievous misconceptions of what “law and order” means. Frequently demagogued by right wing anti-tax politicians
and sometimes exploited by super ego leaders and misunderstood by their ignorant followers. What I have called the Nuremberg Syndrome and what others
have labeled the Jim Jones phenomenon. After FIFTY (50) days of rejecting the authority of the United States District Court for Waco, Texas, an
unintended event ended in the deaths of many who need not have died.
Somehow or other many right wing say NRA types have jumped onto these two events to advance their anti- cause. They seek to have every citizen over
the age of 10 years armed and carrying! Which if you follow their demented rational will give you either the world’s safest country or the world’s
largest collection of unrestrained lunatics!
Lest we are tempted to assign presidential “blame” equally, I should point out that Ruby Ridge occurred 3 years into the Bush41 term while Waco
occurred a mere 89 days into Clinton’s first term.
Given the Democratic party's taste for big government, I worry that future Democrats may take a cavalier attitude when it comes to the use of
force.
Well, you might say it takes a big government to run a big country. 3,600,000 square miles. No. 3 on the planet in area. Only the RF and PRC are
larger. And 304,000,000 people and counting (any one know if the 12-20 million undocumented workers supposedly in the US are included?). Also number 3
on the planet, behind the PRC and India. Somehow I don’t think Switzerland’s 48,000 bureaucrats can get the job done here!
Let’s put it this way: Size should not be the OBJECTIVE; size is only the consequence of doing a good job of the tasks assigned to it! Let’s not
cut the cart to fit a scrawny HORSE nor measure the LOAD by the size of the horse. We need a HORSE big enough to haul the LOAD we have to pull!
As for use of force, the Dems nave NOT struck a peaceful country preemptively on the shaky and unsupported premise they MIGHT someday POSSIBLY pose a
RISK to the US. Nor have the Dems set up prisons outside the territorial limits of the US - hey I thought it was GOP mantra that the Canal Zone was -
UH, THE UNITED STATES - so all the more would Guantanamo Bay be! It was not the Dems who began RENDITION of prisoners to places where they could be
tortured legally? Or the Dems who no doubt authorized TORTURE on that “a million people will die in a minute if I don’t light this match to his
foot” theory.
It was not the Dems who authorized DETENTION inside the US in violation of most of the First Ten Amendments. It was not the Dems who wrote the Patriot
Act allowing warranted-less eavesdropping on US citizens inside the United States. This is just the short list but I recite it to allay any worries
the Dems would follow the Republican's lead. The Dems say NO thanks to Bush43, to Alberto Gonzales, and to Newt Gingrich! That's your legacy!
We Dems are still Americans who BELIEVE in Law and Order, the US Constitution and in helping others. I am not so sure about Republicans.
[edit on 10/20/2008 by donwhite]
