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This NEEDS to be taken care of

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posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 12:57 AM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
The most interesting thing that I see going on here is the example of ATS's self regulating nature in this thread alone.

Someone (in this case the OP) makes an extraordinary claim or suggestion and is taken down point for point by (mostly)sane people with basic logic and reasoning. So far, the OP has shown nothing to back up his/her claims.

That's why I love this place.


You and me both brother


Omega




posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 01:02 AM
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reply to post by Omega85
 


Thanks for the compliment, you're open minded as well. I thought it was kinda funny we were both writing long posts at the same time covering many of the same points.




Originally posted by Rasobasi420
Someone (in this case the OP) makes an extraordinary claim or suggestion and is taken down point for point by (mostly)sane people with basic logic and reasoning.


Mostly... haha, I agree and I'd rather be mostly sane than completely sane. There are a million others who will plod through their normal lives, and by brute force, accomplish normal extensions of our current knowledge. I say let them be, they mean to harm no one but I am one who knows they can harm me if I let them do my speaking. (I almost got that sentence to reverse itself
) Insanity is merely a deviation from the norm so being mostly sane is almost as good as insanity... right? Ha, whatever... it's all semantics.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 01:05 AM
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I felt most of the same feelings posted above this. That is, until I took a moment to research.

Not to speak for Snoggins, but I think this thread is probably what got under her skin. Before more irate posts verbally browbeat her, perhaps take a moment to read it.

While I agree with most of the posters above, after reading that thread I can easily see why she, as a professional was frustrated and posted this thread.

I would never be a proponent of putting ATS members thru a mental evaluation in order to post. Nor would I ever suggest that the owners should call the authorities based on a few lines of odd text. Neither am I a firm believer in the mental health industry.

However, every now and then there is a post that may cause one to raise an eyebrow and wonder if the poster is serious, and if something could be done to help.

*Besides, its kinda nice to have a shrink on the board, I could use some advice sometimes. :-)


[edit on 12/27/07 by makeitso]



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 01:22 AM
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Yeah, that guy probably is a little nuts, but what can an online forum do for him aside from what has already been done in that thread. The next step would be for the 3 Amigos to track down the IP and call the local authorities.

Lucky for us they'd never do that.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 01:25 AM
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reply to post by Rasobasi420
 


Agreed, and I wouldn't want them to go chasing all the odd posts IP's down and alert the authorities. (I've made a few odd ones myself)

But I can understand Snoggins post now that I read that thread.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 01:35 AM
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reply to post by Rasobasi420
 


I agree. While I have great sympathy for anyone going through something like mental illness, there is little that people here can do. Likely, unless this person seeks help on their own, then there's not much that the local authorities can do either.

This is a forum that has different goals and directions than to try and cure mental illness. If someone came on an auto forum with this problem, would they be expected to "take measures" to help that person?

This is the internet, and while we may discuss a lot of things, we cannot be expected to do more than open each other's minds to possibilities. The poster in the thread came here after saying they had drank antifreeze because of a demon. They know they need help. They have to seek that help, not only by talking to members here, but by seeking help locally.

The OP of this thread is expecting more of an internet site than it is possible to give.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 02:00 AM
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Very true. I agree.

I do understand her post better though, now that I read that other thread. Imagine being indoctrinated into non-alternative psychotherapy for most of your life, and then see people openly post about demons and the like.

Poor thing must've got quite a shock! LOL

Anyway, ATS is all about seeing other peoples point of view. Perhaps if she could withhold judgement of ATS a bit, and continued to provide some of her insights on those threads. If she did that, we could all get a bit of insight into the world of psychology that we otherwise would never see without being rich and visiting an office. Everyone wins that way.

That would be much more helpful than imposing additional rules requiring some level of higher learning on a staff that barely got their GED. (jk)


So I hope we didn't run her off permanantly.

Besides that I've got this twitch. Doc, you there doc...


[edit on 12/27/07 by makeitso]



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 02:18 AM
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reply to post by makeitso
 


Wow, ok, I hadn't seen that thread. The antifreeze thing is pretty upsetting. I don't even know what to say about it. That person needs help if it has come to something physical like that. Mine, and others experiences, have been about increasing control of reality or becoming more aware of yourself. This person, however, has physically harmed themselves and they don't know why or didn't control it. OBE's, spirits, demons, that could all be hallucinations but poisoning yourself is a real physical thing we can scientifically verify causes death.

But... wow, as stated above, what could we do besides get an IP address and contact someone? On one side I don't think ATS should invade board members privacy like that, this could be a joke for all we know.

On the other side the antifreeze could have killed him and there's a chance he could do something like that again. At this moment he is hopefully alive, and there is a literal means of contacting authorities, or possibly helping this person out (i'm not sure exactly what would be do or who would be contacted). If we, as human beings, were to find out that this person died or suffered a serious injury when we had a means to prevent it how would we feel? How would we feel about not breaking the principle of using an IP to help them? I'm not calling anyone out, I completely see and understand what's been discussed but as a student of psychology and someone who generally cares for others I just want to see the best for this person. I think about their parents wishing they could have helped their child. I think about how they'd probably never know there were people who knew of his problems and could have helped, and how they'd give anything for us to have taken that chance if they did.

I haven't read the entire thread and I'm sure people are telling this person to get help but it may not be enough. I pray that nothing happens to this person and that things get better. Maybe it's for attention, maybe it's not that serious, but maybe this person is scared out of their mind and they went to the anonymity of the internet for help. ... I love being empathetic, and knowing I genuinely want the best for others, even those who would call me their enemy... but things like this are tough, it feels like a thick sheet weighing me down.

I'm going on a lot about this but I think it speaks to a deeper issue, not just this individual. We have all these intangible laws and systems that can take precedent over human life because we can't trust our fellow humans enough to assume that good things will be done. It feels like we have to see the worst in others to plan the best for ourselves, I don't know, it makes sense in my head but I feel like I'm dragging on...



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 02:31 AM
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I agree with the OP.

Last night I was going to start this very thread myself or email
the three amigos and say "you need an official psychiatrist on this board".
I decided the reports I made on about ten threads enough for one day though.

I think it would help if a trained psychiatrist would make an evaluation
of people's mental state in clinical terms before these threads get thick
with superstitious ignorance.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 02:42 AM
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reply to post by Legalizer
 


Oh really ?



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 02:46 AM
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reply to post by Legalizer
 


I agree with the premise of what you're saying but it doesn't really work that way. If OP is a psychiatrist then they obviously have more experience than my B.S. of psych, but determining a psychological profile over the internet would not be advisable. You can take basic symptoms and say 'well it could be this or that' but a lot of psych is ambiguous and there are no definite disorders. What I mean by that is a lot of it overlaps and a diagnosis is an attempt to group a number of effects for which the causes may be unknown. It's not like the physical body where you can find a definite source and treat specifics. As much as my $150 textbooks would hate to admit our knowledge of the brain and consciousness is primitive, even compared to our understanding of the physical body.

And some of what you call superstitious ignorance your grandchildren, or mine at least (i'm 25), may call science. I don't think we're dealing with a demon in this case so I'll go with you on that one but there are other unknowns that may turn out to be valid.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 03:01 AM
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Legalizer, you may want to consider getting analyzed too.

You're spending way to much time reporting people.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 03:02 AM
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reply to post by Legalizer
 


You mean pass a test to be allowed to post? How about one for ethics then? Or one for loyalty? Honesty?

Please. Be reasonable. This is a website for discussions, not a clinic.



[edit on 27-12-2007 by NGC2736]



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 04:54 AM
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Type 1/Type 2....huh...heard it all before. All that was missing was the caps....

What Bo is trying to say is that in his/her little word, anyone that posts something outside of the ordinary needs to be catalogued and labelled as nuts.



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 05:15 AM
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The antifreeze thread was a bit disturbing, no make that a lot disturbing...

It would seem to me, that it would behoove us, not just mods, etc..., to try and get some of these people the attention they quite obviously need. Yet the problem with that is they may indeed be just attention seeking individuals.

It's a gray area, but one that should be at least discussed. I, for one, would be ashamed of myself, if I had an opourtunity to help someone, and didn't at least try. Better to err on the side of caution, IMHO.

The down side of this is obvious. But shouldn't we at least try, if we feel the circumstances warrent? It's been done in the past.

Wouldn't any possible legal ramifications be covered by so-called "good samaritan" laws?

[edit on 27-12-2007 by seagull]



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 05:47 AM
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I will add that we have had a member here that shot his grandparents and then went to school and continued killing, 10 in all.
He no longer posts because he also killed himself.

query.nytimes.com...


A high school student went on a shooting rampage on the Red Lake Indian Reservation in northern Minnesota on Monday, killing his grandparents, five fellow students, a teacher and a security guard, as well as himself, the authorities said.

A dozen others were injured in the barrage, which erupted at the 300-student Red Lake High School about 3 p.m., officials said. The grandparents were apparently killed at their home earlier in the day, and the authorities were investigating whether guns used in the shooting were taken from the grandfather, a veteran officer on the tribal police force.


I certainly don't think the board Admin or Mods have any responsibility to try to spot such behavior before the fact because the posts he made did not indicate intent. I know I've reported a few members that made threatening statements to other members in a thread and the Mods jumped on it. They treat stuff like that very seriously.

You can read his posts if you like, he has the username Weise and is still listed as a member. Personally I think he should have been banned, but I guess that's a mute point because he won't ever post again.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The staff have the thankless task of enforcing the T&C, not psychoanalyzing each and every member. And I doubt they have the qualifications or time to do so.

Perhaps Snoggins could start a thread called "The Doctor Is In".
It could turn into a popular topic, and we could look in and see who's on the couch.




Edit: Link


[edit on 27/12/2007 by anxietydisorder]



posted on Dec, 27 2007 @ 06:06 AM
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Originally posted by Legalizer
I think it would help if a trained psychiatrist would make an evaluation
of people's mental state in clinical terms before these threads get thick
with superstitious ignorance.

No trained mental health professional, worth the paper their degree is printed on, would attempt to compile a diagnosis based solely on anonymous online postings.

ATS is a method of shared collaborative communications and the only promises we (owners) have made is to keep things running and keep participation civilized. It's not our responsibility, nor is it possible, to ascertain a member's mental state based on what they contribute.



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