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The coming financial crisis may make 1929 look like a 'walk in the park'

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posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 06:37 AM
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PrplHrt gives Dulcimer a non-existent Way Above Top Secret for the post regarding people living within their means.

Well said. Interesting to note that people immediately denied it. Proof that you hit the nail on the head.

Young people seem to feel they're entitled to the biggest and the bestest right off the bat. It doesn't work that way. Good things come to those who wait. And save. And eat mac & cheese for ten years while their kids grow into elementary school. And drive beaters. And live in a not-so-glam neighborhood.

The young need to start living in the real world. I'm sort of amused by the mess they've gotten themselves into.

[edit on 12/25/2007 by PrplHrt]




posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 06:40 AM
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deezee: Was it Yougoslavia under Tito where they printed so much money the inflation was 100% A DAY ?

If so, could you share your experience, it would be great!



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 06:50 AM
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reply to post by frailty
 

Pucky. You can stay out of debt if you use your head. Someone's always making excuses for stupidity. It's gettin' old.


Take responsibility for your life. Live within your means. Don't use Visa if you can't pay off the bill in 30 days. You don't need a boat and personal watercraft and cruise vacations. You don't need brand new furniture and brand new clothes. Save. Stop blaming everyone else for your own financial stupidity.

If you're in the hole, you've got no one to blame but yourself.

There is one exception to this rule, which was created by overzealous family court officials and retarded lawmakers. Those who have the audacity to have children and then get divorced are often forced by exorbitant child support to declare bankruptcy. The usual victim is the father. I absolve you.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 07:10 AM
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Thanks for the heads up loam

Also thanks to everyone participating in the discussion, there is a lot of good information in here and as the article states, it doesn't look too good.

I have seen many theories and angles on the root of this crisis but I was wondering is there anything besides buying gold and stocking goods that we can do to help ourselves out with this impending crisis?

Is this our only recourse? To prepare for a collapse?

I am not too tied to conveniences in life, besides the internet and discussing topics here with fellow members, if it has to go then it must,
I will miss the intermingling of the global mind though


Other than that I can be pretty self sufficient, food will not be too much a worry, I can produce and the natural resources where I live will provide.

I just haven't heard about something we can do to prevent a collapse, and quite frankly I haven't been able to begin to come up with a solution myself, it seems out of our reach, our lives are in a hands of a few people I don't even know? How wrong is that?

Even if the collapse does not happen, shouldn't there be some changes to how the economy runs to prevent this type of crisis from affecting everyone. When will the greedy be held accountable for their actions, why is it the regular folks who pay the price for their mistakes?

Who here has the answer, please share with us....



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 08:00 AM
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reply to post by Dulcimer
 


Man I am so glade you posted that i was begining to think the whole world was crazy...........



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 08:05 AM
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ya, all this mess is being caused by the lowly american citizen living way above his means....
I'm sorry, but I've seen many people go into debt....and they weren't living a life of luxury, they were just buying the necessities for themselves and their children. They were trying to keep up with the social services recipients!!

and, I'm sorry if some of yas feel like society is going overboard when they expect you to pay for the children you bring into the world...but quite frankly, I had nothing to do with those children being born!! and, it's the american taxpayer that you seem to be expecting to pay for that new bundle of joy!! Pay for your own children....in case you didn't catch on, this whole thread is about how our economy is about to fall apart at it's seams. Sooner of later, that's gonna effect our government's ability to spend like there's no tomorrow, since the day of reckoning will be upon them...and then, dear, the only thing the american taxpayer will be paying for is the interest on that danged debt!!! Who's gonna be taking care of your children then?

you have more value going out of the social services vault to it's recipients than the people who are being refused for these programs are getting out of their paychecks. The people who find themselves in that rut have three options, find a higher paying job, if they can, find a lower paying job (or split the family up) that will give them these benefits, or try to make it on what they are making, and accept the idea that they are the designated "new poor".
This is what it leads to!!! the influence of the government through their social service programs will be inflationary, rents, food, medical care, ect...will cost more simply because it can!! there will always be enough customers regardless of what the cost is, since their will always be plenty of poor to make up where the ultra rich leave off!
and, wages will lie stagnant for the average joe. since, well, there's plenty of average joes out there just like you looking for the lowest paying job they can get since, well, if they don't fall below that income guideline they will lose their childcare, their food stamps, their rent assistance, ect....and then, they will be a member of that new class.....the designated poor....who no help is offered, and well, their income doesn't even meet all the expenses of life.
These people have no other choice but to go into debt....
they can't live within their means...

Too many segments of our assetts have been hyperinflated, the stocks, the real estate, ect.... the average joes just don't have the spending power to do this. I can't help but think that it's the influence of the speculators, the "flip these houses to make your fortunes", the day traders on wall street, flipping those stocks, even when they don't own it!!

ya...get rich buying houses, no money down!! get rich selling stocks, sell it before you buy it!! ya, no need for money, just use the system. you'll be rich before no time!!
then you have those who are speculating on the speculations, so what the heck do you expect? we can't all be rich!! sooner or later, the rooster will come home to roost...that day is coming sooner than we would like to think.

but, ya, shame on those of us who actually expect to have a roof over our heads, warm clothing on our bodies, food on our tables, and medical care when we're sick....I mean, what the heck, we're paying taxes to help others have this, so what if we go into debt getting the same crap for ourselves. But, if you would prefer, we are willing to set up a small shanty in the vacant lot next to yours, find ourselves a few cheap chickens, or hey, maybe send our hungry kids over to your house around dinner time... would that be better for yas?

there's more going into the downfall of our economy than just some of our population spending more than they can afford.....we got a large sized upperclass that expects to be paid way more than they are worth, and they are getting it at the expense of everyone else.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 08:14 AM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo
deezee: Was it Yougoslavia under Tito where they printed so much money the inflation was 100% A DAY ?

If so, could you share your experience, it would be great!


Good guess..

Indeed it was. But Tito died when i was two, so i only remember the end of it all. It was shortly before we were the first country to break away from Yugoslavia, and had a short war because of it.


What would you like to know?


The thing is, i was a kid back then. All i remember is going to store with the funny paper with incomprehensible numbers and a little of what i heard the adults talk about.

I actually remember much more of the war. A couple of times, we had air attack alerts, and i remember people running for cover, and nothing happening afterwards.
The other things i remember is tanks plowing through buses and trucks, which were supposed to stop them.
A lot of soldiers, one exploded tank, and playing "hide from the bombs" with my friends.

And then it was over. A very interesting summer vacation. Other countries were not so lucky.

Oh, one last thing... A communist ended up being our president for 8 years, after we split from the "communist" Yugoslavia. Interesting, huh?

[edit on 25-12-2007 by deezee]



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 09:32 AM
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reply to post by loam
 




The only remaining support is the 'trust' in the fiat money system...

a fiat system orchestrated by the Central Bank system
which is basically the status quo of the global banking monopolies.


the major error you refer to is already being played in it's 1st stage...
an unprecented 'cooperation' between the central banks of the EU,
USA, Canada, Switzerland... and any others coerced into joining.
The USA central banks are using leverage to have these other
partners-in-crime reduce their interest rates and reduce the 'acknowledged' impact (writedowns) of all that American mortgage/bond paper the foreign firms & individuals invested in.

...delaying the inevitable is all that is being done, and all those other
central banks will be left to hang out to dry in the long run.


one would be wise to excise the 'tumor' (in this case the USAs 'Fed')
which is causing the world's fiscal system into a Intensive-Care Emergency Room situation...

~~~~~~~~~


as far as whom to blame...
start with Greenspans unregulated credit expansion which led to the housing bubble, then trickling down to the realitors who inflated prices,
to assessors who inflated values,
to flippers who were the once-in-a-lifetime opportunists
(but all those were just the little guys picking up the crumbs from the
conditions set in motion by the Central Bankers and that not easily defined concentric circles of elites)



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by St Udio
a fiat system orchestrated by the Central Bank system
which is basically the status quo of the global banking monopolies.


If i understood it correctly, it's basically a piramyd scheme, that can only work as long as the population is increasing rapidly.


If there is any truth in that "they" want to reduce the population, it could make sense they would first destroy the current monetary system and replace it with a different one.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by deezee

Originally posted by St Udio
a fiat system orchestrated by the Central Bank system
which is basically the status quo of the global banking monopolies.


If i understood it correctly, it's basically a piramyd scheme, that can only work as long as the population is increasing rapidly.


If there is any truth in that "they" want to reduce the population...



unrestrained capitalism needs constant credit expansion and forever increasing debt to maintain the existance of the CentralBank model.
so...in a sense it is Pyramid scheme.


as far as depopulation, i find that line of thought irrational,

but a constant war machine is good for business & enterprise,
the collateral damage of a human population is a necessary consequence
(as 'they' reason).
but s to a massive genocide, depopulation in the long term agenda...
think about what enterprises would be harmed or go bankrupt,
who would be selecting just which group of executive elites would be
consigned to the dustbin of the monetary mountain and become paulpers
because their workforces were liquidated?
No, the elites scrub one another's backs, so they won't have a master plan
whch will physically or financially hurt one-of-their-own...

even an alienated and taboo individual like a porn & scatt peddler
is given a wide berth in the people-of-wealth (elite) circles as their
product provides riches for other elites to profit on



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 11:54 AM
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I mentioned credit cards in one of my earlier posts, but I want to state that I do not believe this is purely to blame for the problems we are in now.

The more debt you rack up, the more you have to pay back and this in turns leads to lower spending in the future, especially when you are losing money on your home "investment".

Lower spending in the future is what people should be worried about. This in turns hits the stocks which then leads to adjustments in the real world. Job cuts, store closures etc.


Words to live by:

Its not about how much money you earn, its about how much money you save.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 12:02 PM
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Originally posted by St Udio
as far as depopulation, i find that line of thought irrational,


That's exactly why i said "if there is any truth in...".

I don't just randomly believe stuff, but instead always try to consider all possibilities, before deciding which one is most likely.

And i say "most likely" as opposed to "true".


Anyway, i hope you are right. But from everything that's going on, it's not hard to understand why people believe it.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 02:44 PM
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reply to post by dawnstar
 

I don't have an issue with people paying child support. It's the ratio that's ridiculous. No where did I write that I think the state should support the children of divorced families. Stop putting words in my mouth.

People shouldn't have more children than they can support well. When divorce hits, the child support payments shouldn't be so ridiculous that fathers have to declare bankruptcy, which happens all the time.

I'm a dame, so don't go slapping the misogynist label on me or something stupid like that. Ask just about any divorced man about his finances and his child support. Unless he's rich, he's been screwed.

I've seen what divorced women do with the child support. It doesn't support the children. It buys jewelry and F-250's, luxurious vacations and a constant rotation of new furniture. I've seen it with my own eyes.

Child support is out of control and the one exception to the rule that if you live within your means, you'll do fine.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 02:55 PM
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It is not the agenda of the NWO to implement depopulation. They are preparing for mass depopulation that will occur naturally, even if they are speeding it along a bit. I posted the following at New World Order Questions About Population Control:




If the NWO intends to deliberately wipe out the bulk of human population on Earth, I certainly believe that it is technologically feaseable and within their means.

As I said before though, I think they are just planning to manage an inevitable population crash.

I'm gonna share a little story I heard back in college, but I can't remember the specific details for sure so please don't nitpick. The general point of the story remains the same. This is how a population crash occurs.

Teddy Roosevelt liked to hunt game in Yellowstone. It may have been moose in particular, so let's just say that's what it was. The only problem was, that the wolves were getting their fair share and leaving little for the hunters. So the President decided to call it open-season on the wolves. Within a year or two there were plenty of moose, too many in fact. They now overpopulated the area, and could no longer be sustained by the environment. They did not start do die off, or die off slowly to adjust to their environment. They all died suddenly. There were not enough resources to sustain them all, but they each took a small share, and therefore there were not enough resources for even some to survive. If a few had been able to horde away resources, they would have been the only ones to survive.

The NWO is hording the resources. Everything is funneling right into their pockets. They may be speeding up the process even, to let the masses work even more furiously to complete their master plan, but I think they are simply capitalising on the inevitable.


There is of course, also the possiblity that there may be some other great cataclysm that will befall mankind other than depopulation. If they know about it and have predicted it, they are surely not going to share that info with us. Maybe there really is something to the whole 2012 thing, that they knew was inevitable all along. Maybe the survivors of Atlantis are the perpetrators of the NWO.

Keep in mind, that it is the design of their system, the pyramid scheme, which incurs the debt. And they will never have to repay it when the bubble bursts. They get to walk away with all the natural resources that were put up to inflate that debt. This includes property, goods, and yes even human rights.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 03:30 PM
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The crisis is here!!!

According to an AP report I saw on television, the number of accounts that are more than 90-days delinquent has risen by 50% in one year. Credit card holders have not suddenly decided to become irresponsible spenders.
Click here to read the Fox News report.

Those who are defenders of the system and choose to blame individuals foo poor choices, I implore you to learn the facts about poverty before you end up learning them the hard way. Do yourself a favor, click on the following links.

Click here for VIDEO
Click here for TEXT

This is where America is headed. Also keep in mind, that the official poverty line is clevery understated in official measurements, both in the monetary threshold figure, and the number of people actually living in poverty. If you make a single dollar more than the threshold, you are no longer considered to be living on poverty. Homeless, and institutionalized (prison, group homes, etc.) persons, as well as many others, are not counted in the figures of impoverished Americans. A person living on their own is expected to survive on about ten-thousand a year according to the poverty threshold. Let me just stop here for now.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 03:50 PM
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Get a better job. Go to school. Work two jobs or overtime. Don't have more children than you can pay for. Quit smoking if it means you can afford food or gas. Quit drinking if you need a couple of sticks of furniture.

I've been poor. Started out that way just out of college. I literally camped in a room - tent (kept me warm in the winter!), stove, the whole nine yards - for a couple of years. You can get out of hell if you work at it.

Easy to get into debt, not so easy to get out of it. People are finally learning that lesson.

Even your article cites the reasons for this "crisis" - people want a lot of crap and they don't care about the long-term consequences of their desires. They just want it now.

Only a fool buys a home when he can't really afford one. Only a fool buys a home with an ARM.

This is basic fricking math. This is what calculators in grade school gets you - an entire country of morons with no concept of what the figures really mean.


Don't stick your toe in the water unless you're prepared to be bitten by Bruce.

[edit on 12/25/2007 by PrplHrt]



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 05:55 PM
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reply to post by Dulcimer
 

greed greed and more greed our home is accessed for taxes at 120k supposed value--we payed 67k for it back in 1990 and spent 12k fixing it up in meantime=79k is what its worth but there is no way you can get this towns accessors to come down to reallity and tax us honestly.we are all being manipulated by the greedy parasites that use us to sponge off of while they drag all of us into the "hell" their greed is deserving of for them alone.



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 06:06 PM
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reply to post by PrplHrt
 


I am not trying to make excuses for idiotic people who live beyond there means with lavish cruise vacations and fancy new cars. I merely trying to point out that there is more to this crisis then reckless personal finances. It has to do economics on a large scale, that is why it is an economic crisis. I agree that consumer spending is out of control, but that is only part of the issue. Do you think that dollar is weak just because of consumer spending?

I absolve you from not being able to see the bigger economic picture. I know where you are coming from. It is not cool when people are irresponsible financially when you have worked so hard to keep your finances in order. There are just more forces at work than bad personal finances that factor into the equation of our economy and its problems.

BTW, You also forgot to factor in unemployment and health-related issues as exceptions to the rule. A large chunk of unavoidable bankruptcies stem from these two situations.

[edit on 25-12-2007 by frailty]



posted on Dec, 25 2007 @ 08:34 PM
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BTW, You also forgot to factor in unemployment and health-related issues as exceptions to the rule. A large chunk of unavoidable bankruptcies stem from these two situations.

You're right. I forgot them. The latter in particular.



posted on Dec, 26 2007 @ 02:38 AM
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i agree that its not just wreckless spending getting people in trouble, although that does happen quite often. i know several folks who have filed for bankruptcy and just a few days before that spent the weekend in vegas and have piles of the hottest CDs and DVD's this years newest SUV etc.
But for the regular folks who know how to keep within their means, the means are changing, gasoline= doubled in the last decade, home prices=doubled in the last decade, food prices up, stamps went up, (not a big deal but it shows prices are moving) heating oil= doubled commodities all up (corn, wheat, etc)... wages= up a few percent.

historically, the growing divide between the rich and poor has lead to alot of revolutions, coups, war, etc. its only a matter of time, no peoples have been immune from collapse and America is no exception, except this time it will be felt by a wider "audience"



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