Americans Falling Behind on Credit Card Payments at Alarming Rate

reply to post by LazyGuy


This video is a fantastic and enlightening piece. I posted it a week or two ago here, and a lively discussion followed. I think today's news is proof-positive of the illegal conspiracy which has been perpetrated upon Americans specifically, and even Western society in general to varying degrees. The inevitable is upon us I fear.

On the predatory nature of lenders and their deliberate perpetration of the crime I will give this example: I had applied for a credit card, and recieved a phone call to for the final approval. The caller asked what my total household income was. I asked if he meant my own personal income that I claimed taxes on, or the combined income including my two roomates. He plainly said that he wanted to know the combined income so that he could give me the highest possible spending limit. This basically means that I was able to take out a limitless loan from a bank who knew that I had no means whatsoever to pay it. This begs the question, why?

If you haven't seen this FrontLine report, "Secret History of the Credit Card", I suggest you watch it.
Now!

Google Video Link

Myself, I was raised with the idea that you don't buy what you can't pay for. I've never gotten a credit card, mostly because I don't feel I should support that industry, but also because I honestly believe in doing my purchases via cash-in-hand.

I have been considering a pre-paid debit card for the convenience value of doing on-line shopping, but I've made due with Pay-pal direct debiting so far.

The only debt load I've taken on was my student loan... and that was a fiasco.

[edit on 24-12-2007 by BitRaiser]

What about eBay? Does it accept debit cards? Like through paypal, or..?

Regards

[edit on 25-12-2007 by TheoOne]

I personaly do not have the nerves to do it, but i think the best way to get a credit/loan and do not pay it is to allow them to sue you and work on your insanity! Insane people are nor responsable,etc!!
I think this sharks of the modern time needs a "wave" of "insane" clients to learn a lesson.
They just not rip your skin, eat your flesh and spit your bones, because it's a obvious crime!!

I used to have bad credit. I took a self credit course, got the award and learned how to deal with the reporting agencies. now I have good credit and a nice history. even celebs get in trouble for this. the thing to remember don't use it if you don't got it..

reply to post by TheoOne


Er...
eBay not only accepts Paypal, they own Paypal!

As for pre-paid debit/credit cards, they work exactly the same way as normal credit cards, only their limit is based on how much money you've put on them. They're just like your ATM card... only they have a number on 'em that works with the CC system.

About a year ago i was actually 10,000 in the hole but now have zero problems, so I guess I can say I've been there and done that for my last time. All I can say to those in the middle of a crisis maybe that you can recover and get yourself out of the hole, try living like a modest life and don't overindulge your senses, especially get of TV.

Check out my situation. Try going through a divorce where your wife of 23 years leaves you for another man and leaves you $87,000.00 in debt and you get to keep the house while all the bills have tripled on just one salary. Then having to refinance to get your wifes name off the deed only to be scamed by a company that re-evaluates your property higher than what it's worth to get you to barrow more money and doesn't tell you you just signed a variable rate mortgage. Then get laid off while paying child support. Guess what guys, your child support doesn't go down even though your wife married a guy making $100,000.00 a year less than one month after your divorce. I hope the entire banking industry collaspses and hope the super rich ceo's jump off the nearest building in shame.

reply to post by Mutantalien1947



Well that outta teach you about getting married and having children.

I think there are a lot more cases like yours than people who are putting luxury goods on credit.

hey mutant alien.

if they didn't disclose all the details to the enth degree verbally with you before you signed the contract it illegal on their part. They signed all sorts of banking compliance acts before they even were highered. even new bank tellers are aware of this stuff and have to sign that they understand the laws before they can even offer you an atm card. I believe the penalty for obsfucating or failing to disclose stuff like you mentioned on your mortgage is up to 10 years imprisonment and a 250,000 fine. it's not called willful blindness but it's sort of up there in that smae catagory. turnes out that since lending practices by these institutions are pretty unscrupulous these days and the govt. had to make laws like the one I'm alluding to to curtail it. do some research on it or call a rival bank and have their manager verify it. then bring that little issue up with your mortgage lender and see how they react. they can't do that to you as of about 2 years ago even if it's disclosed in the fine print. it's illegal now. they might give in to a few of your demands. it's worth looking into.

Funny enough, I just managed to break my zero barrier yesterday, I'm back in the profit levels again. That's right, I don't owe anyone anything... in fact, my tax return this year should be pretty impressive on top of that.

Then again, I'm Canadian, but our economies are pretty closely linked.

Heres hoping everyone here can get themselves out of any debts they are in aswell.

Happy holidays everyone.

reply to post by Extralien


I know beyond a doubt this would fail in a United States court - don't know about else where. Cases of this sort governed by contract law precedent have always stated amendments to contracts (the effective impact of the letter) after the initial contract (the original credit card terms and conditions) must be agreed by both parties through good faith. Good faith in contracting includes that each side of the contract may not fulfill their contractual obligations using conditional tactics that are not explicitly outlined in the initial contract. That would be what you are doing with this method. I am not a lawyer nor do I play one on TV - but I've had enough law school classes as electives to know this would not work. If you don't believe me, contact a real lawyer and ask.

If you stop paying after sending a letter like this they will charge you fees, and if you do not pay they will take you to court. And they would win. Of course the lower level jobs that process payments might not know all of this and just send it back anyways - but if they accept it you've still got nothing. This is just case law, not my opinion.

[edit on 25-12-2007 by LightinDarkness]

reply to post by HighDefinitionFilms


I am not a financial advisor, but I truly do not see the point to this.

If people stop paying their credit card bills for 6 months, their credit will be horrible - they will not be able to recover it for years. At that point, when their credit is trashed, why still pay the money? If you are going to stop paying your bills, stop completely. The only exception is if you can get the collection agency to agree for a "pay for delete" - basically, you pay that 15% or whatever it is you offer, and they agree to delete the information on your credit profile showing you did not pay your bill. I would never, ever, advocate settling debt without a pay for delete - if they wont delete the negative information, just wait 7 years for the account to drop off your report. It will take just as long to recover from 6 months of 90+ day late reporting on your credit file, and you won't have to pay back anything

I do not advocate this personally - I think not paying back what you owe is horribly wrong - but if you must do it, at least get the most bang for your buck...

reply to post by manta


It is also disclosed here in the US. In fact, the law requires the penalty interest rates to be printed in huge print on the credit card application. The huge print also tells you what the penalty fees are if you miss a payment or otherwise do not follow the terms of the loan.

Heres just one example that I randomly found, but all credit card terms and conditions include a huge table like this outlining all fees and interest.

This is required, by law. I have about $100,000 in available credit that I do not need and will not be charging up because I read the disclosures - I know how much interest I would be paying - and I don't want to pay it. In my opinion the smart thing to do is use credit cards and pay them off every month - use credit card rewards to rack up free points for free stuff. If you just buy what you would normally buy anyways, its a good method to give yourself a few hundred dollars worth of free stuff every year (or more, depending on your spending level).

Finally, I think the OP article could be a classical example of playing with statistics. So 90+ days late have increased by 50% - but what amount did it increase from? I notice they don't quote that in the article - possibly because the actual number is very small compared to total outstanding debt, but saying that it increased by 50% is much more sensational. Also, the article only analyzes credit card trusts which sells debt to investors - which only makes up 45% of total outstanding debt. In general, banks tend to sell loan portfolios when their models indicate that a default is more probable - otherwise, they make more money holding the debt themselves. It is unsurprising then that such a portion of the debt would actually be late.

[edit on 26-12-2007 by LightinDarkness]

reply to post by mythatsabigprobe


We did our Christmas shopping this year with all cash. We paid our Credit cards off and only keep two with $1500.00 limits. I don't like them and the other poster is right. You miss a payment and they jack up the rates.

Interesting that Light metions good faith contract practices. I have seen the large print that you speak of however i feel that this is not even the issue anymore w hen taking into consideration the fact that there is no accountability on the part of the creditor and the banking cartel. The practices that they use (fractional reserve banking) to purposefully inflate the economy, which has been hurting US citizens for years and many more to come, are fraudulent and unethical. If those issues are cleared first then there will be no argument regarding not paying what you owe because we wouldnt be in this position in the first place. If you havent the money why buy it....thats a good argument and i pose this question to you as a counter point. If there is no money to lend because it is created out of thin air then why lend it? Also if the process is as ethical and legal as you say it is then why the microprint under your name in the form of a dotted line? Why not disclosre information voluntarily and place warnings on the applications regarding penalty rates in stead of putting them amidst the fine print?
We are being held accountable to the highest degree of strictness and yet there is no oversight to what the banks are doing because they own you, me, and even the president of the united states. Thats why you pay income taxes and thats why inflation occurs....just so they can make an extra buck from interest.

[edit on 26-12-2007 by GUICE2]

Still echoing everything you've read on some website, guice?

Once you can give your creditors the finger I would fully support and encourage a personal battle against the bankers. Until then it's wasted time and wasted energy because the law is on their side. When you're up to your cackles in debt, the only way to tell them off is to pay it off very very fast. And write your representatives. This site capitoladvantage.com... is very easy to use and will provide you with everyone to yell at. And they'll actually listen, unlike your lenders.

And sell your car!

reply to post by apc


I get it i get it....i just called one of the creditors now trying to settle but they dont do that anymore and they dont charge off the account at your request. They force you into 3 months worth of deliquency before you can bring it to collections and try and settle. This allows them to gain the maximum amount of interest. I see what you mean man but its obvious that we cannot waste time writing congressman when the interest is piling up daily right? I want to pay what i have used but they force you into a corner and dont want to help you get out. The law is actually on our side APC....when there is a judgement against you on a particular debt and you go to court to settle with the collections agency the judge is always on your side. That is directly from the horses mouth i.e. a floor manager in the collections department for a large law firm in NY. A good friend of mine....its great having inside info. The illusion that the law is on their side is created by the beuracracy and the red tape. There is a difference between legitimacy and the illusion of the same.

reply to post by apc


Selling the car wont work....it isnt worth close to what it was 2 years ago so there is so much more loan to pay back.