Dysgenics: Dumbing down of society.

Originally posted by abelievingskeptic
I had a kid tell me the teacher told them we were in Iraq to fight terrorism!

These kids lack the foundation to think for themselves and it is quite sad.

There are still adults who say we are fighting terrorism in Iraq. Alot of them. They're even on ATS believe it or not.

And yes, they were once kids too, and they went through the same choices, should I think for myself, use critical thinking etc, or should I accept what I'm told and never go beyond that? To this day you can tell which people have made what decision.

There are some good points raised, but many people are still missing a big part of the solution. It is so simple that I think people don't actually see it as part of the solution.

-Yes, it's important to read.
-Yes, people aren't paying attention sometimes because they don't know what in the heck the teacher is talking about. And they end up being problematic students.

But, just saying to a child, "read" does not make them necessarily make them much more literate. And it's not necessarily enough to just get the problematic child to "focus" and read more.

If you want to solve illiteracy, then for one thing, you must, must, must put dictionaries in the hands of people. Tell your kids, tell your students, if you don't understand a word, then look that word up and get it defined in a dictionary. It's not geeky, nerdy, or a sign of being stupid; it's simply a good thing to practice.

And it is not, I repeat, not, necessarily an automatic occurance that someone will understand what a word means just because the you verbalize it to them, or it is written in a book. It is unfair to assume it. This does not make the person stupid if they don't understand it, they simply don't know what the word means.

I'm not saying, though, that my own literacy level is superb, but I would say I am in much better shape than many. I'm still finding myself cleaning up the mess left by our education system. It's aweful that I have to do such a thing, and I was an A/B student through much of my schooling. You should come out of high school and college all ready, fresh, and full of useful knowlege. But it doesn't allways happen like that. I'll bet a lot of you spent your time in some of your classes daydreaming, snoozing, and zoned out. I sure did. Talking to that pretty girl in the back of the class room was sure more interesting than Pre-Calculus.

You teach a child to use a dictionary, then the windows to learning will start to open up. You can conquer the messed up system, and actually come out of school with a real education.

Troy

Hi There,

Actually, I think it is quite a disturbing prospect this seeming entropy within the education system. One can see a pattern in the lessening of the breadth and comprehensive learning that is taught from the late seventies onwards. The main issue today when it comes to education is to 'teach' oneself. By all means go through the system, but it is better to seek a self-educationary process by accepting the responsibility to augument what one is taught.

When I went to secondary school here in the UK (year 1 - 11 years old), a certain teacher of history gave the class a valuable piece of advice upon first meeting him. He said that we were to take nothing of what he told us as 'truth', but to seek out for ourselves the truth of what he taught (a brilliant piece of secular advice). Infant and Junior schooling is all about becoming equipped with the necessary skills such as reading and writing in order to take one's education further. It is about awakening the mind of the child to its own curiosity and to instil self-interest with its own learning at a pace its intelligence can handle.

Today, teachers are tutoring children simply so that they can meet the national curricula targets, and that means giving them just enough to learn so that they can achieve grades by passing certain exams. Schools are simply factories pumping out automatons to the idustries, but of course, a certain percentage that come out of schooling do so as innate 'free-thinking' individuals, whom pursue further learning under their own steam. If these 'free-thinkers' were parts manufactured in a factory, in today's educationary climate, they would be rejected. Contemporary education seems to inhibit free thinking, by by-passing the stimulation of curiosity. Free thinkers are too much of a variable, and seem to be discouraged.

At the same time, many western countries are signed up to the globalisation process, and that means their equalisation with each other, by adopting characteristics of the main economy (in this case America), whilst subverting their own historical way of doing things. The change has been subtle, and most certainly undermining of national character. It's got a long way to go yet, but is achieving a global uniformity as we speak. Remember, if countries remained individually nationalistic to their own identity, globalisation could not be truly effected. It is all about control, it is about getting you to become a citizen dependent upon the system for your survival, but by giving you too much education and turning you into a free thinker, you would become a non-complying critic of the system...you could not have the wool pulled over your eyes...you would question things...and that is something the system cannot have...can it?

I agree with the dude above me, but just want to add one thing. The environment that surrounds you (including your parents) is so influential that more than likely you will become part of that environment. Of course there are exceptions. But generally speaking if a kid has crackhead parents and crackhead friends and grew up in the ghetto, that kid is gunna be a crackhead. If that kid is surrounded by free thinkers and mostly wealthier people (unless you live in the oc..god have you seen that show?...sad, very sad...like wuteeeever),as sad as it is to say, he MIGHT grow up to be a free thinker if he/she doesn't get involved in drugs ,which in my opinion is another way to control people. Anyway, point being is environment plays the biggest role in my opinion.

Originally posted by Beachcoma
Good find! I'm saving that link.

A stupid population is easier to control. In the past it was done by keeping people illiterate. Today it's done by keeping people occupied with utter rubbish. Less resistance that way.

Turn off your prolefeed, people.

Intelligent people are denigrated in all the movies...referred to as nerd ...geeks,...swot.....even though it was these nerds and geeks who invented movies and computers and the cellphones in their hands.

in all the dramas and films they all wear glasses and have stupid haircuts and wear their granny's jumper...

The media love to glorify and actively promote stupidity and drunken behaviour by so called celebrities...

You can see them smirking after each report.

[edit on 24-12-2007 by esecallum]

Just watched some cartoons(I´m 27... Okay!! ) this morning and in one of the episodes the only point with the whole plot was to tell the viewer that being a nerd was the worst and degenerate thing you could be.
I can´t recall any of the shows I watched as a kid being anything else than open minded, maybe with a bit of a hippie attitude. And specifically the good guys/girls did not have "faulty" moral, they may do bad/ill considered things but they always realised they error in the end(very standard stuff but still basic social training). I think that can leave some distinct empression on young kids(especially with the amount of hours being spent in front of the telly).

Maybe we have another way of making tv for children in DK(or maybe it has changed here as well, I don´t know) compared to US, UK , Japan and whoever´s producing these mainstream and I assume massively watched cartoons/shows, but if what I watched this morning and with what appears to be going on with tv in general(realityshows, celebrity news etc) is anything to go by it´s no wonder children seem derailed these days(DK kids appears to have embraced this trend as well, but have´nt taken that hard a look).

Edit: Clarification and stuff

[edit on 24-12-2007 by FedtStensDyr]

Originally posted by Gun Totin Gerbil
You can't really check the integrity of the population sample of this video, but I'd hope they weren't typical.

"How many sides to a triangle? ...4? ...none? ...1?"
"Who won the Vietnam War? ...We did."
"...Diaper heads?"

Good gawd!

No wonder we are in the mess we are in... I too hope the video isn't representative of the "average" American citizen.

But I couldn't help but notice how the ridiculous answers cut accross the generational lines.

Whatever explains this problem, it didn't 'just' happen yesterday. It takes time to produce these kinds of results.

Originally posted by infinite
But, have notice how our politicans talk to us like we are children?

Yes, but then you consider that some politicians couldn't possibly do otherwise:

White House press secretary admits she didn't know what Cuban Missile Crisis was

White House press secretary Dana Perino has been front and center of the White House's push to continue to label Iran a rogue state for its pursuit of uranium enrichment technology...

Appearing on National Public Radio's quiz show, "Wait, Wait ... Don't Tell Me," this weekend, Perino admitted a story she'd previously only shared in private: When a reporter asked her a question during a White House briefing in which he referred to the Cuban Missile Crisis -- she didn't know what it was.

"I was panicked a bit because I really don't know about . . . the Cuban Missile Crisis," said Perino, who at 35 was born about a decade after the 1962 U.S.-Soviet nuclear showdown. "It had to do with Cuba and missiles, I'm pretty sure."

More...

I wonder if Dana knows how many sides there are to a triangle?

:shk:

[edit on 24-12-2007 by loam]

I go to school in the United States, and believe me, the education isn't that great. I don't know if other countries governments try and put lies and stupid cover-ups in their students heads, but here it's crazy. I'm sure some if it is just public safety issues, but you're basically not allowed to think for yourself. I have to keep my thoughts in my head because the teachers are educated to just stick to the book, and outrule every other possibility. I'm probably over-reacting, but it sucks that the government is trying to control my generations thought process and it's working.

I have long thought that our education system is deficient. When I was in grade schooll there was a repeat of the same old stuff almost every year from about 6th grade on. High school was not much better. The only thing was that the type in the books was smaller.

I asked my grandaughter who will graduate from High School in June if she thought that she could have done the same amount of work in 10 years, she said "yes". Then I asked her if she thought she could have done it in 8 years. She thought a minute and replied, "yes".

Further to this, we as a culture have kept out children playing with games and toys for too long. I hear people talk of letting them be children because they will be "grown up soon enough". We talk about letting them be children as opposed to giving them responsibility. In the early days of this country children worked on their farms from the time they could walk.

We have pre-school and kindergarden, but what exactly is accomplished with the time spent there? Couldn't these children be given some type of "game" that would be a productive learning tool for the future? As they got older, instead of afterschool roaming the streets or watching TV, they could spend a few hours doing real work. This could be a part of the school/school system itself. Two hours or so of simple assembly line stuff or whatever.

Excellent topic OP. This is a real problem of our current civilization. We are declining from a cultural and intellectual level at an alarming rate.

We can blame the educational system, our parents, etc. In the end you can only blame yourself. But does an ignorant person ask why our world is in total decline as a culture and society? No, he does not ask. He will never blame himself for being ignorant, he's too ignorant to see it.

When 80 million people are born each year, you have to imagine that you need to educate these people, but I wonder how many of these 80 million end up with at least a decent education (read & write and maybe think for themselves).

I do believe there is a global conspiracy, if you will, to dumb down people in general. This can be seen each day by watching tv. But it's not like some elite planned this, it is because the media realized that to get high ratings you need to provide very basic needs and instincts. Like violence, sex, humor, etc. These things are not cultural in any way. Anything cultural on tv is boring. No one wants to watch informative and constructive documentaries, they want action, sex and amusement.

Together with money and lust, these basic instincts and needs dominate our lives. It is a sad reality which can be seen on your tv daily. If these things govern our lives then these things are representative for our civilization.

I never heard people say that sex made them smarter. It certainly amused them and made them feel good. Pleasure should be preceded by hard work and study. If you skip the first stage, then even pleasure will ultimately become useless.

I do believe that our world will face a huge shock soon into the future. A cultural and social one. We are too many acting too stupid. Things always tend to balance themselves, so you see, this cannot continue forever.

I have hope in my heart, I know that any man can change, if he desires that, changing from an ignorant person to a person involved and interested in basic questions when it comes to life. That is the first sign that a person thinks for itself. When you start asking the basic questions of life, you just began a new adventure. And if you keep yourself on that track, life will offer you great wisdom and truth.

You think this ill-education, unawareness is reflected in the music that these generations produce ? , the US used to produce a lot of political motivated groups, so did the uk with the likes of the Clash. Nowadays the music is as dumbed down as the people , theres no ingenuity, no inspiration, no rebellion.

reply to post by dampnickers


Excellent posts. My Mother made sure I knew how to read whether the schools did or not, and it has made all the difference.

IMO this dumbing down effect is not the result of any genetic watering down. Some of the highest achievers in the USA’s history have come from large families of modest means. Not everyone has the personality type that leads to becoming a PHD or a CEO, but that doesn’t make them mentally deficient, nor does having an abundance of siblings make you an imbecile. We have to consider culture in these things as well. Many just prefer a simple life to the constant conflict of becoming a ‘mover and shaker’. The intellectual capability of the people is still there, it’s just not being developed.

So what is causing this dumbing down? Seems to me that the clear deficiencies of the education system are where we should start. Add to that the toxins that are intentionally introduced to our systems like fluoride, aluminum, mercury, excitotoxins , etc. that are well known to inhibit brain function. The way that these toxins and many other food additives cause hyperactivity in children, thereby decreasing their ability to focus and learn is a contributor as well, add the constant brainwashing of all of the ubiquitous media, and you end up with a compliant and easily deceived majority, who ‘perish for lack of knowledge’. A tyrants wet dream.

reply to post by Gun Totin Gerbil


This is because music like Bob Dylan's, the Clash, John Lennon, Crosby, Stills and Nash etc.
were effective in helping the people grow and move towards peace and wisdom.
The Corporate Military Industrial Complex figured this out and owns the media like
Clear Channel and Fox. Clear Channel owns hundreds of radio stations and would never play
Ohio by Neil Young, or Give Peace a Chance by Lennon, or London Calling by the Clash or even Dylan's -Blowing in the Wind.
Still there are small bands in smaller studios that still crank out
protest songs.
"It's the same old team since 1916..." Zombie The Cranberries
Who's the team-the Russian Czarists who looted Russia and stole billions before the repressive Communist takeover
then they went to Austria and found Hitler and funded that madman to try to retake
Russia
(why do you think he was so obssesed with taking Russia when if he listened to his Generals he could have easily taken all of Europe).
Then when the Czarists saw that Hitler was going to lose they re-located to Texas and joined with oil barons. Hence the Cold War obssession-next-these guys takeover Defense Department of US and in conjunction with oil barons like the Bush's they buy, sell and steal elections and voila-you have today's madness.

Now it would seem to me that this dumbing down is in direct correlation with the fluoride in our water. Not only does fluoride not clean help your teeth, it completely passes them on the way down your throat. It is poison. The nazis knew this and used fluoride to make their inmates lackadaisicle and easy to manage.

-Dev

This tendency towards idiocy is something I've been witnessing for a long time now. It seems it hasn't been mentioned yet but I believe that a major contributing factor in intellectual decline is the qualities in which society places such value.

I have always felt it quite odd that an athlete who does little more than play a game as a child would is revered so strongly yet someone who can compose a song, paint a picture or write a book is thought to be relatively useless to society. There is such value and emphasis put on what logically would seem quite useless that it's easy to understand why people grow into adulthood placing no value on intellectual ability. Most of what we see in our daily lives, most of what we come in contact with was created by some intelligent productive person. Take for instance art and design, everything you see and use has been designed by someone, every ad, cellphone, t-shirt and car has been designed by a creative intelligent person. However, very little value is placed on artistic ability in relation to athletic ability even though athletes in essence produce nothing of value to society as a whole.

There is some sort of weird dichotomy in society these days where the creators and producers are shunned and the worthless leeching celebrities are venerated yet the world relies quite heavily on the product of the creators and producers. There is very little incentive to become an intelligent creative person and a great deal of motivation to be an unthinking, anti-intellectual imbecile who is incredibly attractive. Society's values are completely illogical and verging on the out right insane.

I am really an average person .However, I like to learn and i have an unstopped curiosity . This is how I got my Master in Science, going for the second degree next year. My little secret- passion to know. I guess if I can do it, at least 50% of the Earth population could do it. The only problem is the passion for science - it looks like the governments are not interested to stimulate it. When I was a young, most of the children wanted to be Pilots (i ended up an aviation engineer) or doctors . Now they want to be singers and Paris Hilton! This would explain it.
However, I have to admit that I am bit concerned with the "self-adjustment" of the brain to the lack of mental activity . Normaly the brain uses 40% of the energy of the body . It seems logical that the body would reduce this "waste" of energy used by the brain if this would not be essential for survival..

[edit on 27-12-2007 by sty]

With regards to education -- I thing the Teachers' Union has something to do with the declining quality of education.
John Stossel's 'Stupid in America'

We've got a Teachers' Union here in Malaysia, too. It's a bad idea... I think any trade union of public servants is a bad idea... can you imagine if hospital workers or fire-fighters go on strike? Sorry for the mini-rant..

reply to post by sty


Aristotle said, "All men by nature desire to know." It would seem that you are no exception. And although I do not have a degree (yet), you and I are alike in that respect.

There's a lot of possibilities for what could cause the dumbing down of society, but I think a lot of it is a persons will to learn too. If you don't have the mentality to want to progress, you won't. Obviously their are some factors limiting that for some people. I'm in 12th grade, and I honestly don't think I've learned anything new through school since probably 5th or 6th grade. It's whatever though.

esecallum,

Excellent point on how intellegent people are portrayed by mediums like TV shows and movies.

Truthfully, why can't an intellegent person be "cool." The sad ignorance of some folks sure isn't "cool." Some of the high school graduates that are coming out now from the USA are pitiful. I have a relative coming through school, and she was clueless when it came to some some things she is being taught. She'll probably get through the system some how though. No offense to her, she just isn't being truly educated.

Some of the most intellegent people I have known are some reall butt-kickers when it comes to tackling the game of life.

What does a high school diploma mean anymore? Is a college diploma any better? It depends on the person who receives it. Did they take the time to study correctly and learn? Companies look for those diplomas many times. They need to look for individuals who demonstrate competence in skills related the positions they are trying to fill. Some companies, however, do check for competence. If they don't check, they may have just hired themselves a nice "piece of paper" who isn't going to be effective at their job.

Troy