You can't take Christ out of Christmas

Originally posted by Equinox99

I am agnostic and I celebrate Christmas because I enjoy being with my family. So what you are saying is non-Christians should not celebrate because they are non-Christian?

That's what I think. So you say you celebrate christmas just because you like spending time with your family? that can be done any other day of the year, not on jesus birthday. either you believe in jesus christ or you don't and if you don't you shouldn't celebrate xmas.

and on the subject. this year I didn't buy one single gift. I don't celebrate christmas the commercial way. I only pray and hope for a better day. I don't go around talking about santa and speding ridiculous amounts of money of gifts, greeting cards and things that no one needs. yes, coworkers and family think i'm a grinch and a cheapskate, but I just don't believe in the hype.

tell, ya what.....try to take the pagan out of christmas if you are so bent out of shape over a wiccan symbol being displayed by a nativity scene! That's right, no christmas tree, or star to top it. NO MORE BABY TREES BEING SACRIFICED ON A YEARLY BASIS!!! after all, I thought Christ was the last and ultimate sacrifice, no more were needed.

And, well, let's even try to purify this holiday even further....no more holiday themed commericials to convince people to spend their money.....definately not in october, not in november, or in december even.. I'm pretty sure that Christ or the Christian religion doesn't exhalt the idea of people going into debt up to their ears....in the name of God or in celebration of Christ's birth!!

by the way, the wiccans don't celebrate christmas...they celebrate yule, and it's not on christmas day, I beleive yule was a few nights ago...the winter solstice. and well, sorry to tell you this but people have been worshipping the solstices far longer than christianity has been around. and we have massive monuments like stonehedge to prove it.
so, when can we expect the christians to give the tree back to the pagans, what about the bunny and the fertility eggs that were swiped for the easter holiday? there's more, but it's just too danged early in the morning to think of them.....but, with the addition of these holiday symbols into the christian religion's celebration, a little bit of christ was taken out....add the commercialization to the festivities, and well.....I don't there's much more to take out....
It's not the nonbelievers that have taken christ out of christmas...it was the popes of long ago, and the merchants of today....purify your religious holiday so it stands apart from the pagan.....then maybe christ will return to your holiday!

but don't expect the pagans to cease their holiday festivities simply because your leaders of long ago decided to swipe them for their own and now you think that they are solely yours! Heck, yous don't seem to have the common sense to celebrate on the right day.....

celebrations based on symbols are unsignificant. A wiccan symbol, a tree symbol, a crusifix. etc. You shouldn't have to need symbols to remind you of something unless you are religious. Too many people are spreading their own religions on me these days, at work we have the hanukka symbols and the kawanza stuff. being christian, I don't NEED any of that.

Originally posted by jedimiller
celebrations based on symbols are unsignificant. A wiccan symbol, a tree symbol, a crusifix. etc. You shouldn't have to need symbols to remind you of something unless you are religious. Too many people are spreading their own religions on me these days, at work we have the hanukka symbols and the kawanza stuff. being christian, I don't NEED any of that.

ahhh......poor you.....
one of my coworkers at work.....A DRUID.....is practically assaulted by the old ladies on a daily basis with their christian talk....heck he was even introduced to the baby jesus in the form of a doll last week...
he doesn't need any of that either, but then, the boss even get into all that action so he's kind of stuck with it....surprisingly, even though they are driving him nuts....he's been patient as a saint with them....but well, I don't want to be around if he loses his patience...because he's gonna BLOW UP!! after all, does anyone really want this guy to marry a lady who uses him for a wallet and then runs off with every other guy around simply because some lady at work tells him she knows the lady's baby was a gift of God to him???

Hello!!! I'm interrupted on a weekly basis by people wanting to leave me little tracks about God......Personally, I don't need any of that either. But, if I am to have to put up with that, and my coworker has to put up with what he's putting up with.....you'd think that the christians can live with a brief intrusion of having a few foreign symbols popping up around this time of year! ain't gonna kill you...
It's sure the heck is less irratating than that group of people thinking you're gonna stand at the door and hear "the good news" as the food in the oven burns to a crisp!!

Originally posted by dawnstar

It's sure the heck is less irratating than that group of people thinking you're gonna stand at the door and hear "the good news" as the food in the oven burns to a crisp!!

LOL Yeah I hate that too ha ha ha

Lets make it a "Personal Beliefs" Day! and what ever your religion is or what ever your angst for religion is we make it a day of tolerance. Then atheists can learn to tolerate all our symbols pagan and Christian and we can tolerate all the nit picking about them being pagan symbols!

Of course then again that poses a problem too. Since so many of the Christmas symbolism has it's start from pagan celebrations and they seem not to mind that. It's only when Christians use them that seems to upset them so. isn't that the reason I see it posted so much?

So guess if we make the holiday in that way they will at least have to wonder if the person they are about to acost with having it "rubbed" in there faces. We can just assume it is a pagan using that Tree with little lights and they have a right to use it too. I couldn't care less.

If someone sees the "tradition as ignorant" then sue em for being ignorant. It wouldn't surprise me if they bring it to the supreme court since it seems to be such a big deal. Then we can have political debates to remove all fables we grew up with stricken from our culture. No more Rudolph the red nose reindeer no more peter cottontail no santa because they are ignorant lies and not entertaining cartoons of a christian tradition. Lets legislate intelligence and attitudes opinions too. Make it against the law to believe in God at all. It's been tried before? That won't make the ignorant any smarter nor will it give them any less a reason to lean on the hope that there is more to life then living to die with nothing after. No legacy we would remember no reason to justify any point to why we were ever born. That we just happened and when we existed,,, oh what difference does it make, you get the point. Life is too short such deeply entrenched American cultures as Christmas. I was watching TV where one of the candidates was castigated for having what looked like a cross in his Christmas commercial. He has even been the subject of lawsuits that are looming. I swear it is as if he displayed a noose because people got as "offended" acting as indignant as Al sharpton was by that noose on a tree. Lets make accomodations for everyones sensitivities where we can all walk around on eggshells worrying who the next person with a self concept one molecule away from being an eggshell is gonna have ther "witto feewings" hurt. Now thats IGNORANT.

I don't believe in Santa Claus, but I'm not going to sue somebody for singing a Ho-Ho-Ho song in December. I don't agree with Darwin , but I didn't go out and hire a lawyer when my high school teacher taught his Theory of Evolution

Life, liberty or your pursuit of happiness will not be endangered because some one says a 30-second prayer before a game.

So what' s the big deal? It's not like somebody is up there reading the ten commandments . They're just talking to a God they believe in and asking him to grant safety to the players and the fans going home from the game.

But it's a Christian prayer!

Yes, and this is the United States of America , According to our very own phone book, Christian churches outnumber all others better than 200-to-1. So what would you expect -- somebody chanting Hare Krishna? I see it in some places airports and taxi stops but it's like water off a ducks back to me.

If I went to a game in Jerusalem, I would expect to hear a Jewish prayer.

But what about the atheists? Is another argument.

What about them?
Nobody is asking them to be baptized. We're not going to pass the collection plate. If you see a cross and it offends you ,, look the otherway. If you hear the word Jesus or "Merry CHRISTmas. If that's asking too much, bring a pair of ear plugs. . Call your lawyer!

Unfortunately, one or two will make that call. One or two will tell thousands what they can and cannot do. I don't think leaving Jesus in Christmas is going to shake the world's foundations. So give it a break.

That said Merry Christmas

- Con
PS; if that last sentence offends you, well .. just sue me.





[edit on 23-12-2007 by Conspiriology]

[edit on 23-12-2007 by Conspiriology]

Originally posted by jedimiller

Originally posted by Equinox99

I am agnostic and I celebrate Christmas because I enjoy being with my family. So what you are saying is non-Christians should not celebrate because they are non-Christian?

That's what I think. So you say you celebrate christmas just because you like spending time with your family? that can be done any other day of the year, not on jesus birthday. either you believe in jesus christ or you don't and if you don't you shouldn't celebrate xmas.

Well Christmas is the only time when we do things together. Every day we each got work, school, and other activities, so it is difficult to spend quality time with the whole family.

Originally posted by Equinox99

Originally posted by jedimiller

Originally posted by Equinox99

I am agnostic and I celebrate Christmas because I enjoy being with my family. So what you are saying is non-Christians should not celebrate because they are non-Christian?

That's what I think. So you say you celebrate christmas just because you like spending time with your family? that can be done any other day of the year, not on jesus birthday. either you believe in jesus christ or you don't and if you don't you shouldn't celebrate xmas.

Well Christmas is the only time when we do things together. Every day we each got work, school, and other activities, so it is difficult to spend quality time with the whole family.

I like how people get selective about the context of your post.

Gee I think what you meant was everyone should celebrate Christmas to mean whether you are celebrating the birth of Jesus or the holiday. How one can take that to mean anything like you were suggesting they be "compelled" to,, is reaching and where many could take that as far as saying by force would get the idea. Makes you wonder where some peoples sensibilities are.



- Con

Originally posted by Equinox99
reply to post by The Soothsayer

 

When was the last time you saw an American city hang the Star of David on their light posts? Or instead of lighting the village Christmas tree the town board lights up the (sorry, people) Jewish candle thingy?

What are you talking about? USA has a bigger Christian population...I'm sure if you goto Israel they have that stuff all year round. If you go to Mecca you will see their stuff all year round. Why don't you go make a complaint about them?

Christmas should be celebrated by everyone but if you drop the traditions of Christ and just make it a shopping holiday then that is wrong.

Oh really? I should celebrate x-mas? Who exactly do you think you are that you think you can tell me what religion I must follow?

Yo Saturnalia!

Vas

Originally posted by Vasilis Azoth
Oh really? I should celebrate x-mas? Who exactly do you think you are that you think you can tell me what religion I must follow?

Yo Saturnalia!

Vas

He thinks he's a Jedi, or an expert on films, or an expert on technology, or an astronomer, oh and now he's an expert on other peoples reasons and need to celebrate or not.

Of course he didn't spend any money on gifts for others this year, he has no friends and all his money was probably already spent on action figures for himself.


Oh a reply to the previous page, do I really think people should be tied to a pole and burned? Only if they have no sense of for sarcasm.


"Practice the worshipful day of mitachlorians, you will"



[edit on 23-12-2007 by Legalizer]

Originally posted by Vasilis Azoth

Originally posted by Equinox99
reply to post by The Soothsayer

 

When was the last time you saw an American city hang the Star of David on their light posts? Or instead of lighting the village Christmas tree the town board lights up the (sorry, people) Jewish candle thingy?

What are you talking about? USA has a bigger Christian population...I'm sure if you goto Israel they have that stuff all year round. If you go to Mecca you will see their stuff all year round. Why don't you go make a complaint about them?

Christmas should be celebrated by everyone but if you drop the traditions of Christ and just make it a shopping holiday then that is wrong.

Oh really? I should celebrate x-mas? Who exactly do you think you are that you think you can tell me what religion I must follow?

Yo Saturnalia!

Vas

Rarely do I quote myself but this is one time where I must as I had already said this about the very person you are talking to in the post right above yours .

Again...

I think what he meant was everyone should celebrate Christmas to mean whether you are celebrating the birth of Jesus or the holiday. How one can take that to mean anything like you were suggesting they be "compelled" to,, is reaching and where many could take that as far as saying by force would get the idea. Makes you wonder where some peoples sensibilities are.


"xmas" isn't a religion,, it's about Christianity but celebrating doesn't make you practice religion. It isn't a requirment one way or another. It's a holiday,, nothing more. No one said you HAD to do anything so relax. He didin't mean anything by it other then to suggest its celebration anyway you want.



[edit on 23-12-2007 by Conspiriology]

I have a similar grievance that I need to express. I spent all day drawing a scale Formula 1 racecar on a refrigerator box in my backyard. I bought myself NASCAR certified gloves and a helmet. In the end it was picture perfect. To my utter dismay when I got in and turned the popsicle stick key, it wouldn't start. Someone must take responsibility for this...

Who took the CAR out of my CARDBOARD!


Merry Holidays and love from a devout atheist.



P.S. Yes, the date was stolen from pagans. Easter also.

In our family, christmas is more about santa claus, christmas tree, gifts and enjoying eachothers company with a good meal and christmas carrols.

We decorate our home with figures of elf's and santa claus's and stars and a big christmas tree.

We say that santa claus lives on the north pole, and is bringing the gifts to children, who have been acting nice and not naughty the past year. We say he looks much like this image:



We do not relate christmas to Jesus really, but more to santa claus as painted above.

I believe anyone have the right to celebrate christmas, in the way they choose.

For me it is the childrens day.


[edit on 23-12-2007 by Bluess]

Originally posted by WarrenPiece
I have a similar grievance that I need to express. I spent all day drawing a scale Formula 1 racecar on a refrigerator box in my backyard. I bought myself NASCAR certified gloves and a helmet. In the end it was picture perfect. To my utter dismay when I got in and turned the popsicle stick key, it wouldn't start. Someone must take responsibility for this...

Who took the CAR out of my CARDBOARD!


Merry Holidays and love from a devout atheist.



P.S. Yes, the date was stolen from pagans. Easter also.

Nobody stole anything and pagans (who ever they are these days) can celebrate it too. Merry Pagan day I guess

The car thing?? whats that about?

reply to post by Bluess


HA HA HA I Love it! Makes no apologies for the origin of symbols that have an extinct meaning and purpose,, none of that.

brought back many memories. Thats how Christmas is in your family and very much how it was in mine growing up.

Bottom line,, you are right,, it's really for the kids and it is a perfect excuse to spoill em rotten hee hee.

Your family use that one about the bucket of coal too?



Great Post !

- Con

[edit on 23-12-2007 by Conspiriology]

Originally posted by Legalizer

Originally posted by Vasilis Azoth
Oh really? I should celebrate x-mas? Who exactly do you think you are that you think you can tell me what religion I must follow?

Yo Saturnalia!

Vas

He thinks he's a Jedi, or an expert on films, or an expert on technology, or an astronomer, oh and now he's an expert on other peoples reasons and need to celebrate or not.

Of course he didn't spend any money on gifts for others this year, he has no friends and all his money was probably already spent on action figures for himself.


Oh a reply to the previous page, do I really think people should be tied to a pole and burned? Only if they have no sense of for sarcasm.

"Practice the worshipful day of mitachlorians, you will"



[edit on 23-12-2007 by Legalizer]

Help me out here, I never mentioned jedis or techology or film or astronomy so what are you talking about? I was commenting to someone who said everyone should celebrate christmas. I REALLY don't understand why someone who isn't christian would celebrate a holiday that is meaningless to their religion. Why do you accuse me of not buying presents? I said no such thing, the children in my family get presents from me but that's all. Only reason they get them is because the religion thing is over the heads of most 4-10 year olds. Were you even talking to me? Because you DID quote my message...

Vas

reply to post by Vasilis Azoth


I think you're getting cross-posted. I believe he was referring to this post: www.abovetopsecret.com...
and not going after you.

Personally, I find this comment

either you believe in jesus christ or you don't and if you don't you shouldn't celebrate xmas.

to be the hight of ridiculousness.
First off, there's the whole issue of it originally being a Pagan holiday (and yes, I plan on attending an old school treelighting this year).
Secondly, telling anyone what they should or shouldn't calibrate is straight up foolishness.
Third, Jedi... You really need to get out more. Maybe even get laid. Even Vader did the nasty at least once.

Haha... Christ was taken out of Christmas a long time ago. What once was a time to celebrate the birth of Christ and whatever else Christians use the day for, has now turned into nothing more than a consumer created holiday, with people spending obscene amounts of money to satisfy each other's greed.

Why do people care if Wiccan wreaths or whatever else is added to nativity scenes? All religious aspects were stripped of Christmas long ago. I think the term Xmas is suitable because, like I just mentioned, all of the Christian aspects related to the day were replaced long ago with consumer greed.

reply to post by zephyrs


Wouldn't $mas or maybe Xma$ be more appropriate then?

Wait... I got it...
Consummas!
Greedmas?
I-Can't-Think-For-Myself-So-I'm-Led-By-Mass-Media-mas?

That last one is prolly a little long, eh?

Originally posted by BitRaiser
Wouldn't $mas or maybe Xma$ be more appropriate then?

Wait... I got it...
Consummas!
Greedmas?
I-Can't-Think-For-Myself-So-I'm-Led-By-Mass-Media-mas?

Like anything else in life, whats written reflects the beliefs of the writer.

This day has evolved to be recognized as the birth of Jesus Christ and the subsequent life, teachings, death, and ressurection was a gift to us, long before all of you slandering the recognized holiday were born.

Jesus Christ has done nothing to deserve this nor have those that genuinely celebrate his birth, regardless of accuracy of tradition or date.

Its the spirit. The spirit of Good will towards all mankind, and peace on earth. Thats the message that the birth of Jesus brought forth to the world.

What kind of a person would attack a person delivering a message like that? Its really sad when you think about it...

Like anything in life, things are what you make them. Lets be about friendship and helping, rather then hatred and hurt.

Peace