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"Why are there no whistleblowers?"

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posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 08:54 PM
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He used his "official" email for his response...what part of misuse of government computer systems is difficult to understand? Misuse of government property is always grounds for investigation. Although I am sure there are probably a few more issues than are listed in the article.




posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 09:06 PM
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reply to post by Swampfox46_1999
 


For once, I agree with you swampfox. He should have known better than to use his government e-mail.



posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 10:12 PM
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If a whistle blows in the forest, does anyone hear?

This has been discussed in the form of suggestions to many people in this forum who claimed to have come across some explosive evidence but did not know how to go around sharing their secret with the world. Many of them (maybe all) were hoaxers, but the replies sounded mostly sincere and full of precautionary but amateurish advice on what to do to protect one's self.

Even if a potential whistle blower accepted all the risks including death, if he/she could not see a way to achieve his goals before getting whacked, it would simply feel like a pointless exercise at best, and a pointless loss of one's life at worst.

So, my question is, where and to whom would a whistle blower blow his whistle? Who would hear it in the cacophony of today's scattered and self-involved society and it's buzzing daily bickering? Who would notice a whistle which gets muffled by the deafening drums of war and the noise of TV?

Yes, they are compartmentalized, and, yes, probably no one involved who'd pose even a "potential" risk would have been left alive...

But let's say, for the argument's sake, there is someone out there who is dying to come out of the conspiratorial closet? Or someone who finds a microfilm in a pck of cigarettes that a dying agent slipped in to her bag at the movies? Where to go?

Where would one go and what would one do to survive long enough to guarantee that the whistle reaches the right ears who are powerful and passionate enough to do something about it? As well-intended as it may be, ATS forums won't cut it I am afraid.

The simple absence of an avenue to whistle-blowing-success could be one of the main reasons why the "closet" is a much safer place for the moment.

And if the Democrats,unlike the Nixon era, were not so damn confident that whoever their candidate, they are guaranteed to win the next presidential elections, there might have been additional motivation to investigate more and keep a more open ear for possible faint whistles.



posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 10:16 PM
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I'm going to have to agree with the OP. As many people that are out there hating President Bush right now, you would think that at least one of them would step forward with a small piece of evidence. The CIA can't even secretly destroy interigations without it leaking out. A plan that involved two airplanes and bringing down the two biggest buildings in the U.S. is bound to have some leaks. Or maybe there are none because the story is true.

[edit on 20-12-2007 by dbates]



posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 10:43 PM
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reply to post by dbates
 


Majority of leaks are intentional and are used to disguise a much deeper and uglier truth. Throw one to the lions to protect the rest of the pack....

If an Intelligence agency is confessing to destroying 2 tapes, they probably destroyed 222 tapes that we don't even know about... It is like coughing to hide that you are farting..

Our big mistake is that as common-folk, we assume there are rules to the game... Rules are only to protect the weak. There are no rules!

Mission goal is to succeed at any cost. And that means at ANY cost....





[edit on 20-12-2007 by may_be_true]



posted on Dec, 20 2007 @ 10:52 PM
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reply to post by deltaboy
 



Throw in the fact that Clinton tried to arrest Osama on multiple occassions and was declined. In fact, the a major member of the GOP was quoted as saying he was a great President except for the fact that he was "obsessed" with Osama Bin Laden.



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by Griff
For once, I agree with you swampfox. He should have known better than to use his government e-mail.


Well for 1, since when is that a court martial offense.

Second, i bet if the e-mail was not about 9/11 he would have have gotten in trouble.

[edit on 21-12-2007 by ULTIMA1]



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:28 AM
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I also just found out that William Rodriguez is on the no flight list - it was on the ATS Mix interview. That's not quite as serious as being court martialed, but the man has done nothing.

Basically this guy was there with the fire fighters on 9/11. His only "offense" would be that he is in support with the 9/11 truth movement.
And... he's on the no fly list because of that.

I suppose that kind of goes with the patriot act and the new definitions of possible terrorists?



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:33 PM
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reply to post by Sublime620
 


concerning other matters not remotely connected to 9-11 or area 51.a "friend" of mine got so angry at watching surplus government "equipment" going all the time to certain/specific buyers that had put in far lower bids than others that he started to complain over his bosses head. after/later -----he found out his boss and his bosses boss were involved together being in kickback scams-------this ended up in the courts when he was fired by his bosses-- my "friend" sued the government over the matter over 5 years ago----this "litigation"is still ongoing my "friend" owes in excess of a million dollars legal fees and he doesnt think he will win--when we last spoke he told me he wished he had kept his mouth shut--i had some disputs with my government boss--stealing and harassment of the men--his bosses did nothing and the military police were not interested either so i retired earlier than i hoped to but will still receive a full government pension---its not worth the stress--and if you take the law into your own hands--they will catch you eventually--i guarantee it--and depending on how far widespread the problem is that you find--you could end up in an "unhealthy" condition by saying too much.they all hang together for safety because if they dont they will hang seperately==the unwritten rule



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by ULTIMA1
Well for 1, since when is that a court martial offense.

Second, i bet if the e-mail was not about 9/11 he would have have gotten in trouble.


Actually, I believe government e-mail addresses are to be strickly for bussiness. I could definately be wrong though. I know my work e-mail is not used (and is not allowed to be used) for personal e-mails.



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:47 PM
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reply to post by Swampfox46_1999
 


This is very true. I know a guy in my husband's shop who was given an article 15 and kicked out from the AF for spreading porn via government computers.

Not much conspiracy there.

There are rules and regulations for using government computers AND government email addys.

If this guys misused it, then of course he will get in trouble. I see (well, hear about it) happen all the time.



[edit on 21-12-2007 by greeneyedleo]



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:50 PM
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President Bush made it crystal clear almost immediately afterwards that we should tolerate no "outrageous" conspiracy theories. So the sheep fell in line.

That statement was "their" undoing and proves undoubtedly that there was a conspiracy regarding 9/11. That wasn't a request from Bush, it was a warning.

Peace



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by eyewitness86
 


great post.....I am going through all of them and I just felt the need to say that you bring up some good points. I agree with you 110% my friend





posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by greeneyedleo
This is very true. I know a guy in my husband's shop who was given an article 15 and kicked out from the AF for spreading porn via government computers.


But posting porn (something illegal) is not the same as posting your opinion (not illegal).

Yet another whistleblower.
www.cooperativeresearch.org...

August 2, 2004: Retiring Whistleblower Criticizes FBIFBI agent Mike German quits the FBI and becomes a whistleblower against the bureau. He claims that FBI superiors committed illegal acts to hinder his investigation into terrorism in Florida (see September 2002). He complains, “What’s so frustrating to me is that what I hear the FBI saying every day on TV when I get home, about how it’s remaking itself to fight terrorism, is not the reality of what I saw every day in the field.” He also says, “Opportunities to initiate proactive investigations that might prevent terrorist acts before they occur, which is purported to be the FBI’s number one priority, continue to be lost, yet no one is held accountable.” He cites “a continuing failure in the FBI’s counterterrorism program” which is “not the result of a lack of intelligence, but a lack of action.” (Lichtblau 8/2/2004)


December 3, 2005: FBI Whistleblower Exonerated by Justice Department ReportA report by the Justice Department’s Office of the Inspector General is leaked to the New York Times. The report largely backs the allegations made by whistleblower ex-FBI agent Mike German (see September 2002 and August 2, 2004). It finds that FBI officials mishandled a terrorism investigation German was involved in, falsified documents in an effort to cover up agency mistakes, and retaliated against German. In one instance, someone altered dates on three FBI forms using correction fluid to conceal a violation of federal wiretap law. After German tried to complain directly to FBI Director Robert Mueller, other FBI agents distanced themselves from him. For instance, the head of the FBI undercover unit, Jorge Martinez, froze German out of teaching assignments and told another agent that German would “never work another undercover case.” (Lichtblau 12/3/2005) Notwithstanding, German is critical of the inspector general’s report. He says the authors of the report distorted some facts and failed to fully investigate whether the investigation he was working on was a genuine terrorist conspiracy. (Strohm 12/12/2005)




[edit on 21-12-2007 by ULTIMA1]



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 05:44 PM
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reply to post by Sublime620
 


So they didnt know why, but now that the thing blew up dont you think they might of figured out. Prob a lot sooner than you would have posted this thread., and I am sure one of them would have spilled their guts.....unless they did it and knew what they were doing.... obvious it is over your head



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 05:52 PM
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reply to post by birchtree
 



Some maybe, some maybe not. First, again, I have to point out in no way I am saying that there is definitely a conspiracy. I am only trying to put the point out there that no major whistleblowers doesn't imply no conspiracy. Now, on to your post.

I gotta disagree with you. I believe it's over your head. Some may not have figured out that they played an integral part in the attacks. Some may only think that they ignored intel because they were told to. That the system was flawed.

The important thing to realize is that no one except the key players would have had any idea until it was too late. At this point its a slippery slope to admission. At least two or three posts on this thread alone have been about whistleblowers and I doubt you stopped to even read them.

And that's my point. There is no quater for whistleblowers.



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 06:41 PM
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A great example:

Ex-Italian President 9/11 An Inside Job

This thread contains an article from PrisonPlanet about Francesco Cossiga. He, as I'm sure you are already aware, is the man who exposed Operation Gladio. I'll spare you the rest of the details, just read the article and more information on the man.

I suppose you could consider this man the most acclaimed expert on false flag operations. And yet, let me quote from the thread on this topic:


Originally posted by coven
/Rant ON

Soooo the ex-president of Italy is a neo-nazi Eh? I guess it fits in with their support of the 'national socialist' movement in Germany that CAUSED WWII.

Lets me just state for the record I will GLADLY take a board kick to put you NAZI's in your place... to blame everything on the MOSSAD and the "Zionists" is a sad sad excuse for your existence.


Wow, just wow.


Originally posted by coven
firstly I am on topic... you people need to READ THE ARTICLE... he states mossad and ZIONISTS were involved...

Man... Its good to know Israel can shut down our Air National Guard...

Specially over Washington.



Is he still allowed to post?


Originally posted by pavil
I'm sorry if I missed it, but what exactly was the PROOF that the former President of Italy supposedly has? All I heard out of him were accusations without hard proof backing his claims up. Hmmm, that sounds vaguely familar.....I wonder where I have come across that before? It wil come to me soon.

Till I see his proof, he is entitled to his opinon, that's all it is without evidence.



Originally posted by pavil

Originally posted by Jim_Kraken

We've already got enough proof from outside this man's statements, and his credibility and experience is relevant fields is high...I can't see any sound reason to NOT believe him.


I see..... So the actual proof of this man's comments means little. I thought we were supposed to deny ignorance here not embrace it. Taking someone on their word with no real support or proof of his statements hardly seems logical. Please give me one proven fact that supports his allegation.

Thank You,




Originally posted by BlueRaja
Perhaps it's not common knowledge within the intelligence community.



Originally posted by CaptainObvious
What makes him ANY different from any other American Hating Truther? He said it was an inside job. Where is the proof?

I was hoping there would be... Former Italian President Cossiga gives detailed information to show that the CIA was involved inthe 911 attacks. From what the article says in Prison Planet, he doen no such thing. All he states is what he thinks.


"[Bin Laden supposedly confessed] to the Qaeda September [attack] to the two towers in New York [claiming to be] the author of the attack of the 11, while all the [intelligence services] of America and Europe ... now know well that the disastrous attack has been planned and realized from the CIA American and the Mossad with the aid of the Zionist world in order to put under accusation the Arabic Countries and in order to induce the western powers to take part ... in Iraq [and] Afghanistan."


This is nothing more than finger pointing without back up. Typical Alex Jones Bull Sh*t.


I guess Captain Obvious wants a video tape of the conspirators in action. Don't bother actually using your brain or discrediting the man, just call it Bull Sh*t.


Originally posted by BlueRaja
It just doesn't make sense that if it happened, that it'd be common knowledge in the intel community. Is the CIA supposed to have told other intel agencies, "pssst, don't tell anyone, but we attacked ourselves- aren't we clever."


This man needs to watch a James Bond movie.



posted on Dec, 21 2007 @ 06:46 PM
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Originally posted by Skyfloating
What makes the guy credible and respected is his former position and the fact that he staged false flag attacks himself.

The use of the word "zionism" in the newspaper article was not very wise. I wonder why credible and respected public figures disgrace their credibility by using "loaded" words. Itrs stuff like this that allows the media to say "ah...the 9/11 Truthers are just a bunch of anti-semites". He could have left it at "It was an inside job". Is that so difficult? Do you have to aded racist ideology to that? Some people have no control over what they say. If he would have kept it at "inside job" his statement would have caused ripples in the entire media world by now.


Great line at the top. He answered his own question.


Originally posted by syrinx high priest
quick question for the conspiracy believers

if a head of state came out and said 9/11 was done by AQ, would you just belive it without challenging it ? Would you just accept it and say, "oh well, I guess I was wasting my time." ?

if anything, the conspiracy believers should realize being a head of state doesn't give you credibility in anything, it should actually give you reason to wonder what the agenda is.

is he trying to destablize the US ? Is he trying to take a shot at Isreal ?


No. Instead, the CT's would try to dig up information to prove him wrong instead of just saying "where's the proof?"


Originally posted by dk3000
Just because a person is the president of a country or former president does not give them credibility- cripes look at the Bush's.

I am a person who believes 9/11 was a red flag op and I always will believe this- and I dont need a former foreign president of a thoroughly corrupt government to tell me what I already know.

I definately believe that in time the truth will be revealed. I doubt the debunkers will be around by the time the big cat is let out of the bag.

We live in volatile and interesting times.



Sorry, that thread just really pissed me off. So much good discussion was lost with comments like these.

Oh, and most importantly, this is one outcome of someone becoming a whistleblower: Nothing. The news doesn't cover it and people just say "where's the proof?" and move on.

[edit on 21-12-2007 by Sublime620]



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