deezee: I totally see your point, as close as I can imagine it. When i hear/read things in the "Spiritual", i usually let my intuition guide me. for me, it is a profound "Knowing" i have or feel when hearing/reading something that might inspire positive growth. I mean, it just kinda like, pulls me in...not in an unconscious way...Oh No! i AM aware...

sometimes, if i pick up a book or run my eyes quickly over a paragraph on line, those words will nag at me...i find many new thoughts arise and i am inspired in the most unusual ways. i may "Try it on" always aware that what i am reading or hearing is NOT an IS...just another side, a different opinion, someone else's experience...and when "Trying it on" i am also conscious that the way it may fit me and my interpretation, will be vastly different from another's point of view or again, experience.

The positive i speak of is only for my thoughts, interpretations, actions and experiences as i am soooo aware that i cannot nor do i desire to control anyone else's thoughts, actions or experience....

Thank you for sharing your story...I truly appreciate it!!!

K...now for that smiley thingy...^___^

Originally posted by Shadowshocker163
Well, no offense, but I don't see how that relates to the situation here.

No offense taken. But i think you misunderstood me.

In everything i said, i tried to give the OP the benefit of a doubt, as much as i was capable of.

I even wrote "Of course i can only speak of what happened here..." (in my country in relation with the AC) which should proove this.


It's just that i noticed the similarities, or better yet, almost identical wording and content, between the AC and the OP's posts.


But how about we ask the Commander if he is from the Ashtar Command? I'm betting that he is, from the way he is writing.


Oh, and BTW: I fully understand your position, since i went through almost the same thing, and even defended them from negative people 12 years ago.


P.S. The AC leaders here did not ask for money up front either. That was way later, when a person joined the group and became totally addicted to their ideas. And yes, of course, it could have been that just this one person was bad, and the original AC isnt.

Also, i did mention in my first post in this thread, that i tend not to believe anything anymore, but consider every possibility, before i decide which one is more likely. Well not in these words.. I was talking about science and logic (theories), but it is also my philosophy now.

And of course i am biased, due to my personal experience with this group, and some old emotions must have resurfaced when i noticed it again. I would be the first to admit it.


The point is.. I stopped believing stuff simply because it felt good, and instead always consider all of the possibilities, as long as they make any sense. If they don't, however, then i discard them.

But if the OP is from the Ashtar Command, then why should i even try to believe him? They promissed many things over the years, and allways found an excuse, when nothing happened. So why should i consider the possibility this time?

[edit on 22-12-2007 by deezee]

Originally posted by Shadowshocker163
many of the things that Cmdraleon has said, have been related to a few personal experiences, so I am willing to stick around and see what happens as well as let somethings remain possibilities.

After reading your post again, first i want to add, that i think your point of view is very good. You don't just blindly believe random stuff, but give all the possibilities a chance.
That's almost exactly what i do. Of course, only to the point, where things stop making sense.

Secondly, i know what you mean, when you say that certain things he said sounded like very deep (and good and usefull) thoughts.

But this IS the nature, of this thing called "spirituality". Every once in a while, you stumble over a deep and profound truth. Especially if you read as many books as i did on the subject.

But then, when the amount of books starts getting larger, the profound truths start repeating themselves. And sometimes, they are only thrown in to make you feel it's all real, while they are really pushing a stupid belief system, and the good stuff is greatly outnumbered by all the other nonsense stuff.

Now don't get me wrong. I said SOMETIMES! Other times there are very good books, that don't require you to believe anything, but give you only the really profound thoughts in a good context. Unfortunatelly they are often outnumbered.

And it makes me feel bad, when people use the good stuff for the pushing of some beliefs. Especially if i know they are lying on purpose.

Of course, often, people really believe, what they say, even when it's nonsense, and in that case, i try my best, to understand them, since i used to do the same.


I hope you can understand my POV now.

[edit on 22-12-2007 by deezee]

Originally posted by Kaos Moon
for me, it is a profound "Knowing" i have or feel when hearing/reading something that might inspire positive growth. I mean, it just kinda like, pulls me in...not in an unconscious way...Oh No! i AM aware...

I know exactly what you mean...

My point is just (and i think you already understand this), that we should be selective, in what we believe. If it doesn't make sense, or if it contradicts itself... Well, let's just say i've seen what happens then, and not just in relation with the AC.


For me, the best possible feeling was, when i discovered, that just by using pure and objective logic, i can come to the same or even new deep profound conclusions and thoughts myself.

The hardest thing here is being objective. We usually allow ourselves to be guided by our emotions. But this is not the way to the truth. It can be severely misleading. Especially, since most people never ask themselves, where their emotions come from. They simply believe them.

Being objective is very hard and extremelly simple at the same time, once you figure it out. But then, the truth tends to appear almost magically.


P.S. I did get a little carried away in this thread myself. I tried to be objective, but some of what i said was emotional. But if this is the AC (and i think it is), then i have a lot of logical reasons not to believe it or even consider it all over again. Of course i still would, if something would make sense, but only untill it would stop.

[edit on 22-12-2007 by deezee]

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
Greetings Deezee,

Greetings, Commander!

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
I try to tell people use discernment always in what you see on video's read in books etc etc.

Its a healthy think to do this and I agree .

Ok, so you're asking people not to believe that you are a multidimensional alien.. Why are you saying you are, then?

Do you realize, that "...belief belief, belief, belief, but you shouldn't believe me..." is a pretty basic manipulation technique?

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
Whatever site and group online you had a bad experience with that can happen with anything including getting a bad teacher in school instead of a great teacher .

It wasn't online. It was in real life. The internet was not yet so widespread here 13 years ago.

Besides, shouldn't you as a higher being know what happened in YOUR NAME?

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
I myself will pay for things that cost something like a Conference or something
I went to his lecture and presentation and paid to get in and got alot out of it .

Oh, i don't have a problem with paying for something.

I would (and always have) gladly pay to learn something new, if it is good.

In fact, i would much rather PAY for something GOOD, than BELIEVE for the same old 5 profound thoughts i can find in any below average book on spirituality.

Why should i believe in some random belief system, if all i get in return, is even more beliefs to believe in?

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
Do you also find that you know things within that you do not need a book to findout?

Hmm.. Didn't i just say that in my previous post? Did you just turn my words around into a question form? Now why would you do that?

Didn't i also just mention this familiar process of belief assimilation, with the purpose to appear larger than it, in one of my previous posts?

Do you realize, that this is yet another basic manipulation technique? And not even a good one?

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
I am dedicated to the Ashtar Galactic Command as are many what are called Lightworkers on the Planet .

As i said before, i don't know you, so i am giving you all the benefit of a doubt, humanly possible.

But the possibilities for me are:
1. You are just using the AC belief system for some ulterior motives.
2. You really believe what you're saying.

I could add a #3 here, and say "You really ARE what you're saying, but i would have to allocate it suchh a small percentage of possibility, as to the possibility, that i'm a potato.


If i would have to guess, then i would say #2. I really do think, it's most likelly, that you actually believe what you're saying, simply because i've personally seen many people believe the same thing, and they did not have any ulterior motives, only their "leader" did. The others just believed him, and in turn helped him spread the beliefs even further.

And in this case, i don't really have a problem with you. I actually understand you. I understand how and why some people like to believe things like that.


My point is just, that all the "profound truths" should be given as just that, and not only randomly used, to make some beliefs more believable.

When someone has really usefull and profound thoughts and wants to share them, he doesn't need to pretend, he's an alien, to make them more beliavable. Or even use them, to make his alien origins more believable.


To sum it all up, i would MUCH rather give someone money, to learn something valuable, than give someone my beliefs, only to get more beliefs in return, randomly mixed with some "profound thoughts" picked up from random sources with the only purpose to make the beliefs more believable.

hey aleon i have a question:I see orbs like every other day..i was just wondering what they might be? thx

I TRY not to use the word "Believe" tho, through conditioning it does slip in at times ...it seems to be attached to a "BELIEF SYSTEM", bringing with it a whole dogmatic way of thought...I feel there is not one truth "Out there"...there may may not even be any "Truths Out There"...the whole language we've created is only part of "The Illusion" used to keep us on track, in control....

JUST MY WORDS...FEELINGS and OPINIONS...I would NEVER try to enroll someone in my way of thought... ^_~

Below is Webster's Dictionary Definition of the WORD "Believe"

intransitive verb

1 a: to have a firm religious faith b: to accept as true, genuine, or real deals we believe in>

2: to have a firm conviction as to the goodness, efficacy, or ability of something

3: to hold an opinion : think believe so>transitive verb1 a: to consider to be true or honest b: to accept the word or evidence of believe you> 2: to hold as an opinion : suppose believe it will rain soon>

Originally posted by Cmdraleon
Greetings all,

This ends my transmission

Blessings In The Light of The Most Radiant One Always,
CmdrAleon
[edit on 18-12-2007 by Cmdraleon]

I want some of what you're on!
I think that too much effort and energy is spent looking externally, in the (vain, in my opinion) hope that 'we' will be 'saved' by those great beoingsd in the sky.
Let's try to solve our earthly problems first.

PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ MY POST EVEN IF IT IS LENGTHY, I THINK IM DEFINITELY ONTO SOMETHING.

I think the question that no one has asked that lends itself to true
understand is a belief about space and time, you have touched on this a
couple of times here but never really went into much details. This is
the basis of my question, and I believe it will perhaps help me to
further broaden my understanding.

I am open to broadening my consciousness, it is one of the reasons that
I educate myself and try and expand my level of knowledge - knowledge
expansion is more important to me than leisure time. One thing that
frustrates me about human existence is that it ends, it is frustrating
that it will end and I will not know everything, this is very selfish
but I am only me and only I can feel and understand the way I am at our
current level of consciousness. What I understand you to be saying is
that the collective human consciousness will rise above the current
level and then due to that greater understanding everything we have
achieved in our lives in a material sense will no longer be worth
anything, our belief and almost instinct to collect and create wealth
will become irrelevant because the true wealth is a wealth of knowledge
(or so I believe). Am I on the right track here?

My limit for a greater understanding comes from the construct of life
that I cannot visualise or understand.

Can you confirm or deny for me that a higher level of consciousness
bypasses space and time completely and it is one of an understanding or
an integration with the energy of the universe?

I believe time, space and mass to be a limitation of physics which can
be explained in a mathematical sense, but this does not directly lead to
an understanding at a cosmic level - our existence, our cognitive
thought, our spirituality and the energy of the universe has not been
currently determined or explained by physics and therefore the current
restrictions set by physics are only physical barriers that need to be
broken in the same way gravity, flight and the concept of the sun, the
solar system were broken - the answer is more complex as our
understanding and knowledge broadens. I completely believe that before
human flight was created and believed people understood that it was
impossible, just like currently time travel and energy transfer or
creation are currently thought to be impossible. When this knowledge is
gained it will 'click' in our minds and it will be impossible to
understand the other way... we will just understand

Is the universe limitless?

You say you are on the second highest level of understanding, is their
any concept among your people about what the next step is and how to get
there?

These trivial questions that we ask about physics, energy and time are
all probably that, trivial to you - but I believe the disclosure of some
of this information will help to increase the consciousness of some...
namely me!

Can you explain the concept of time to me? Time is relative, yet humans
can only feel it as a constant... if time is a relative thing then it is
just the same as gravity, or the air that we breathe.

This also relates to how I feel about the dimensions... time is not a
constant and therefore it can be split, which creates the infinite
dimensions which is part of the infinite nature of the universe and
every time a different choice is made in an infinite number of
directives - is the consciousness that we live restricted to one path on
the dimensional universe or when we achieve a higher understanding and
consciousness can we transfer ourselves and our consciousness between
any of the variable dimensions that have been created from our being?

I believe that the only true constant is that of energy (light) which
cannot be broken - is it possible to reach the speed of light? I doubt
it is, but that's my current consciousness level. That said I believe
that we can travel great distances by 'folding' time onto itself and in
effect travelling faster than light if it was to move along a direct
path in this direction.

Do space, time and energy all relate somehow? I believe the key to
understanding time and its relation to all energy is how it relates to
the only real world constant and that is energy. The sub-atomic energy
that binds all matter - why can't we understand this, genes and dna are
made up of this sub atomic matter - is there anything smaller than this
that we don't currently know about?

I think that when the consciousness change occurs all of these pictures
will become clear, and if you can possibly answer any of these questions
for me it may help me to make the change or to further my
understanding... I believe it will be like switching on a light bulb in
my head but I can't grasp any of these differences because I keep
running into the roadblocks of the current Physiological understanding.
Maybe my yearning for the 'answer' is my problem from evolution because
the spiritual being within us is part of what I cannot understand.

It makes sense that you would know that 2012 is the time it happens,
because if my beliefs are correct then space and time will become
irrelevant when we evolve and that is simply the point in space time
that the human consciousness will evolve like a pencil makes a dot on a
time line but it's not a 2D space.

Can we ever visualise the fourth dimension correctly... currently the
only way to look at it is in 2D on a time line (look at our history it's
2D) but that is NOT how time works, its the next dimension along, I
cannot comprehend this but again this is like the light switch thing,
once we understand it will be impossible to understand how we didn't
'get it' before. I need to stop trying to 'visualise' the fourth
dimension because that is a restriction of 3D understanding. Again - a
restriction of my current knowledge and physical understanding. It'll
click eventually.

In the end I'm not sure if you will be able to answer any of my points
but I would like it if you can try.

Originally posted by d-dave-b
PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ MY POST EVEN IF IT IS LENGTHY, I THINK IM DEFINITELY ONTO SOMETHING.

I think the question that no one has asked that lends itself to true
understand is a belief about space and time, you have touched on this a
couple of times here but never really went into much details. This is
the basis of my question, and I believe it will perhaps help me to
further broaden my understanding.

I am open to broadening my consciousness, it is one of the reasons that
I educate myself and try and expand my level of knowledge - knowledge
expansion is more important to me than leisure time. One thing that
frustrates me about human existence is that it ends, it is frustrating
that it will end and I will not know everything, this is very selfish
but I am only me and only I can feel and understand the way I am at our
current level of consciousness. What I understand you to be saying is
that the collective human consciousness will rise above the current
level and then due to that greater understanding everything we have
achieved in our lives in a material sense will no longer be worth
anything, our belief and almost instinct to collect and create wealth
will become irrelevant because the true wealth is a wealth of knowledge
(or so I believe). Am I on the right track here?

My limit for a greater understanding comes from the construct of life
that I cannot visualise or understand.

Can you confirm or deny for me that a higher level of consciousness
bypasses space and time completely and it is one of an understanding or
an integration with the energy of the universe? Confirmed Yes



I believe time, space and mass to be a limitation of physics which can
be explained in a mathematical sense, but this does not directly lead to
an understanding at a cosmic level - our existence, our cognitive
thought, our spirituality and the energy of the universe has not been
currently determined or explained by physics and therefore the current
restrictions set by physics are only physical barriers that need to be
broken in the same way gravity, flight and the concept of the sun, the
solar system were broken - the answer is more complex as our
understanding and knowledge broadens. I completely believe that before
human flight was created and believed people understood that it was
impossible, just like currently time travel and energy transfer or
creation are currently thought to be impossible. When this knowledge is
gained it will 'click' in our minds and it will be impossible to
understand the other way... we will just understand

Is the universe limitless?

Yes it is limitless its endless expanding expanding and expanding endlessly exactly.

is that all i'm gonna get