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Economy Sinking Government Knows & Giving Bad Info

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posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:08 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


People have no right to have anything provided for them unless they literally cannot work and have absolutely no means to provide for themselves. Those people are the minority of the population. The vast majority can work - and do. Some work one job when they should work two, others work two jobs when they should work three. Still others lease a BMW instead of buying a camry, and others eat filet mignon when they should be eating ramen.

Life is about choices. They have every right to choose to do so, and I have every right to defend my tax dollars from being given to people instead of spending it on services that I can use.

What people fail to realize is that there cannot be wealth without poverty. There is no choice, that is how capitalism works. Someone is up at the top, and someone is at the bottom. If you want to provide for everyone then we have socialism, and then we will no longer be the richest country in the world. People have the right not to have their money stolen from them and given to someone else.

The current swing towards social programs provides more than enough opportunities. That people do not use them is unsurprising. After all, it is much easier to cash a check from Uncle Sam than actually do a free job retraining program and work for the money.

[edit on 12-1-2008 by LightinDarkness]




posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:09 PM
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I do want to make this clear though you would get that result from alot of people if you just GIVE them money and they dont have to work for it.



posted on Jan, 11 2008 @ 11:14 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 

Agree totally I defend the people who work hard and do the right things and still get f&*(%d by the system....and yes it happens light...but if you dont make an honest effort and dont work when u should or can you should get nothing. If you sit at home just to collect the welfare check then that is just wrong. But on the flip side and I dont agree with this but the people like that their mentality is well if I go get a job then I dont get welfare, foodstamps, and medical insurance because I make $10.00 an hour. But yet foot and health insurance and schooling is very expensive not to mention gas (to get back and forth to work) so why work when you can get all this free stuff and not have to stress about paying insurance, gas, and working. Once again I do NOT agree with this but this is their mentality



posted on Jan, 12 2008 @ 12:04 AM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


Please don't misunderstand me, I am in no way endorsing handouts at the expense of the working people. And I am fully aware that people buy things they don't need and can't afford. Keeping up with the Jones' is a financial tragedy, not a strategy.

What I am proposing is an end of the viscious cycle of poverty in this country that has bred ignorance and spreads crime like wildfire, at the expense of hard working citizens. I can even accept that there will be "poor" people in a capitalist society, so long as they are able to sustain food, shelter, clothing, and basic medical care. If a person is able to work, they must work. Even if it means public works projects until they are re-assimilated into the private sector.

The welfare system that is in place now is a farce. You have people being turned away in tattered clothes, while another person pulls up in a Lexus and wearing barnd new clothes with the tags still on them to get their check.



posted on Jan, 12 2008 @ 12:22 AM
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reply to post by mybigunit
 


I am glad we found something we agree on
I'm with you completely on the reparations and the Katrina issue.

I also agree that you can work hard, and life still screws you. However, it is not in my opinion the role of the government or society to protect you from life. It is also impossible to do - how would you decide who got treated unfairly over who is refusing to put any work into what they do? It could be very hard to tell, and only a few situations would be obvious. I do not trust my government enough to give them that much discretion to discern who is doing everything they can and still failing versus someone who is simply riding the system. As jack points out, the welfare system we have now creates comical scenes of people driving up in a lexus to get their welfare check.



posted on Jan, 13 2008 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


Yeah it is this issue that gets democrats the votes from blacks....They handing out welfare checks and foodstamps to the poor blacks...this is like giving a crack addict crack in a sense because it gives them no initiative for change. Places like New Orleans and Atlanta were prime examples but there are "ghettos" in every major city. Heres a check and oh if you want more kids we will give you more money and food stamps and if you quit having kids we will cut off your free money....so what happens and not only are they pounding out the kids the fathers leave the mothers and now you have 1 mother raising 5 to 7 kids....its a pathetic cycle and I as a white person am sick of getting the blame.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:01 PM
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Another example of grossly underrepoted figures by the govenment, but at least they are finally being forced to at least start admitting what we have all known for some time.

New inflation data explain middle-class squeeze



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:26 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


hey the truth is getting harder to deny isnt it Jack...you still have wackos out there saying we are not in a recession but its starting to come to light..I love how Bernanke goes on TV and say we arent in a recession (great government cover up) when all the big banks are finally saying we are...



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:33 PM
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reply to post by mybigunit
 


Of course the article says...dun dun dun...the data isn't lying and that it confirms economist predictions. It says exactly what was predicted. Not to mention BLS has predicting a recession for 2 years. Unfortunately for the media and the doomsday prophets, it won't be the "OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG STOCK MARKET CRASH WERE ALL GOING TO DIEEEEEE" that they would like to see. But, they can always hope!

I kind of find it amusing. People in the US are so used to living it up that they forget what goes up must come down. Once we get back into the growth version of the cycle I would hope consumers would learn...but they won't. Theyll spend like its going out of style and when the next cyclical recession hits, we'll be doing this all over again.

[edit on 17-1-2008 by LightinDarkness]



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:35 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


We aren't all going to die, just the poor people. Then the middle class will take their place.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:37 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


Well, whatever doomsday mass-economy breakdown vision of chaos and despair you want to believe in. Pick your flavor, everyone has their favorite. The media loves all of them though. Helps the ratings, you know.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 10:40 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


I like this one best...


This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper.

—T.S. Eliot, "The Hollow Men" (1925)


...the ol' frog in the pot on the stove.



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 11:07 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


Yay! Stock fire sale! I love it when all the emotional investors buy into the hype. Every recession its guaranteed to make the smart people lots of money while we short the market.
Lets hope for dow 1000!



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 11:26 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


If the DOW hits 1000, then there will be very few "smart" people left. The deeper the recession cuts, the richer you will have to be to stay "smart."

EDIT to add:

I found the perfect avatar for you...








[edit on 1/17/0808 by jackinthebox]



posted on Jan, 17 2008 @ 11:49 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


Well, I don't know about that. There would be a lot less stupid people selling at Dow 1000, so that would limit my ability to make money off the emotional sellers. But for now, there are droves of them selling off and panicking per the usual. They'll buy back in when we come around to our cyclical growth period, and I'll sell their stocks back to them for double the price.
It's the motto of the emotional investors who follow MSNBC like god: buy high, sell low!



posted on Jan, 18 2008 @ 07:02 AM
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Originally posted by LightinDarkness
reply to post by jackinthebox
 


Well, whatever doomsday mass-economy breakdown vision of chaos and despair you want to believe in. Pick your flavor, everyone has their favorite. The media loves all of them though. Helps the ratings, you know.


Yeah your right the media loves the doomsday it does help the ratings....but so do hurricanes doesnt mean hurricanes dont happen either?



posted on Jan, 18 2008 @ 07:06 AM
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I dont think the dow will hit 1000 but I wouldnt be surprised to see it hit 7k again. Also on a side not what do you think about the stimulus plan give families $250 to $650 OMG this is a f&(@)ing slap in the face. Give us no money and cut the interest rates damnit. When I say cut Im saying 1 point on the 30th and another .75 the next GET IT OVER WITH QUIT MESSING AROUND. Good try on the stimulus but $250 these days is 3 tanks of gas great thinking bush.



posted on Jan, 18 2008 @ 07:47 AM
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The morons in Washington called our congress and president believe that a stimulus package to put a band aid to the economy troubles is to:

More welfare checks,

More food stamps,

More tax credit up to 600 dollars for the poor, but it said nothing about,

Wealth builders, as in job making and bringing back industries,

Fixing the mess that is causing our economy to crash,

Outsourcing and unfair free trade.

If this how our morons in Washington think that they are going to fix the nation like this, Brace yourselves citizens because we are going to be heading the worst times this nation have ever faced in his humble history



posted on Jan, 18 2008 @ 07:53 AM
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reply to post by marg6043
 


I know and bush is trying to take the opportunity to make the tax cuts permanent while giving people $600 while basically giving the wealthy millions. I love it. I used to be a hardcore republican but when times are hard you see the true character of people and wow I am seeing some character. Fix all of the problems that I have listed on the first page of this post and that should help. I understand recession happen its a part of the cycle but the problem is that there are so many underlying problems that recession could turn worse much faster than everyone thinks.




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