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Captain Obvious in Quotation
Think of this - strike a match and quickly pass your finger through it. Did you get burned? No. Try the same thing with a piece of paper. Or grass.
The fuel blew AWAY from where the photog was standing at impact, towards the trees. Remember the 40 degree impact angle? It was angled towards the trees. That's why the grass and trees on that side were burnt in that direction. Simple for most to understand that.
The grass is not untouched. That's what you believe. I do not. Therefore, from my point of view, your q is invalid.
The wings shattered into small pieces upon impact. Only small scattered pieces remained. Or are you suggesting that one would find intact wings?
The fuel was atomized and formed the fireball, some spread into the trees, catching them on fire.
Lack of fire? Did I mention the trees? Do you see them in YOUR photos?
Remember the problems that they had with wreckage recovery? Or is that not a good enough example, because I can find more.
Originally posted by IvanZana
Truthers win again....lol pwned.
[edit on 9-1-2008 by IvanZana]
Flight 93: Evidence Summary: 10 Points
Transcript of Tom’s last calls to Deena
6:54 a.m. Fourth cell phone call to Tom to Deena
Tom: Hi. Anything new?
Tom: Where are the kids?
Deena: They’re fine. They’re sitting at the table having breakfast. They’re asking to talk to you.
Tom: Tell them I’ll talk to them later
Deena: I called your parents. They know your plane has been hijacked.
Tom: Oh…you shouldn’t have worried them. How are they doing?
Deena: They’re O.K.. Mary and Martha are with them.
Tom: Good. (a long quiet pause) We’re waiting until we’re over a rural area. We’re going to take back the airplane.
Deena: No! Sit down, be still, be quiet, and don’t draw attention to yourself! (The exact words taught to me by Delta Airlines Flight Attendant Training).
Tom: Deena! If they’re going to crash this plane into the ground, we’re going to have do something!
Deena: What about the authorities?
Tom: We can’t wait for the authorities. I don’t know what they could do anyway.
It’s up to us. I think we can do it.
Deena: What do you want me to do?
Tom: Pray, Deena, just pray.
Deena: (after a long pause) I love you.
Tom: Don’t worry, we’re going to do something.
He hung up
'I Promised I Wouldn't Hang Up'
Lisa Jefferson, the phone supervisor who took Todd Beamer's call on Flight 93, believes God called her for a purpose.
Interview by Wendy Schuman
Operator can't forget haunting cries from Flight 93
By WES SMITH, The Orlando Sentinel
Lisa D. Jefferson cannot silence the haunting cries, "the hollering and the screaming" that were the anguished background to her 13-minute conversation with United Flight 93 passenger Todd Beamer before the hijacked plane crashed in rural Pennsylvania.
The Westmoreland County 911 dispatcher who took a cell phone call from a frantic passenger aboard hijacked United Airlines Flight 93 says he was just doing his job when he tried to calm the man and obtain more information about what was happening aboard the jetliner.
John Shaw: Received a call from Flight 93
Wednesday, September 11, 2002
John Shaw still has dreams about the phone call he answered while working as a 911 dispatcher in Westmoreland County last Sept. 11.
AFTER THE ATTACKS: THE PENNSYLVANIA CRASH; Searchers Find Plane Cockpit Voice Recorder
Hundreds of searchers who climbed the hemlocks and combed the woods for weeks were able to find about 1,500 mostly scorched samples of human tissue totaling less than 600 pounds, or about 8 percent of the total.
You know. Those alleged phone calls you want me to explain on your "evidence". The responsibility is yours to validate not mine.
That's the last I heard from Todd Beamer," Jefferson said. "The line was still open, but it was silent."
For the next 15 minutes, Jefferson stayed on the line. As Verizon's operations staff told her that the plane had gone down. Source
Mrs. Lyles husband, Lorne, a police officer, received a phone call that morning. She was surprisingly calm, he said, considering the screaming he heard in the background.
"Just hearing my wife saying she loved us through all that chaos on that plane is just embedded in my heart forever," he said.
CeeCee grew up in Fort Pierce and raised her sons on her own until she married Lorne in May 2000 and later moved to Fort Myers. Emulating her mother and aunts, she never took welfare, instead working two or three jobs while volunteering at Restoration House, a Christian women's shelter that two of her aunts founded in Fort Pierce.
"CeeCee was a role model, showing women they could make their own way without leeching off the system," said her aunt, Mareya Schneider. "In the last few years, she really dedicated herself to the Lord and she would use Scripture to explain that if you don't work, you don't eat."
Arborist remembered with education fund: A fund to grow minds has been established in memory of a woman who dedicated her life to keep Honolulu's trees growing. The Outdoor Circle this week created the Christine Snyder Tree Education Fund to teach people about the importance and proper care of trees. Snyder, 32, died aboard United Airlines flight 93 when it was hijacked and crashed in Pennsylvania on Sept. 11. She was attending a forestry conference in Washington, D.C., and was on her way home. Colleagues said Snyder was a dedicated defender of Hawaii's green spaces and an articulate activist when she needed to be. The Aloha Arborists Association and the American Society of Landscape Architects are also supporting the fund.
Originally posted by OrionStars
What that states is that people, in the photos, were reported missing on or after 9/11/2001. That is all that can be done until human remains are validated and positively ID'd by consensus peer review.
There is no proof where people have gone. Hearsay, without corroborating peer review testing of remains and consensus, is not valid proof any alleged passengers were on any alleged Flight 93, or disappeared from alleged Flight 93,for which no positively ID'd parts have been peer reviewed and corroborated by peer consensus either.
On Sept. 13, Paul Sledzik, curator of anatomical collections at the National Museum of Health and Medicine of the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology (AFIP), was asked by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Service's Office of Emergency Preparedness to command the Region III Disaster Mortuary Operational Response Team (DMORT) in providing victim identification services for the UA Flight 93 crash. Sledzik has been team commander of Region III DMORT since 1997.
As part of the National Disaster Medical System, DMORT is composed of private citizens and federal employees who are asked to provide forensic, mortuary, and family support services following disasters. The teams (there are 10 throughout the nation) are made up of forensic scientists, medicolegal investigators, mortuary officers, logistics and administrative support personnel, and others.
In addition to Sledzik, Lenore Barbian, Ph.D., the assistant curator of anatomical collections at the museum and a DMORT team member, was also asked to respond. Barbian and Sledzik spent the next two weeks in Somerset, Pa. The main focus of their work was to support the local coroner in identifying the victims of the crash and working with the FBI collecting evidence to be used when the terrorists are brought to justice.
The DMORT team organized a morgue, set up the morgue operation, interviewed victim families, and collected antemortem and postmortem information. The morgue facility was located in the National Guard Armory outside Somerset, Pa. With the FBI as the lead agency in the investigation, access to the morgue was strictly controlled.
Sledzik sees the combined DMORT and AFIP response to such incidents as a great benefit to the families of those killed in disasters. As part of a package of federal resources, DMORT and AFIP have worked together in previous incidents, particularly in the area of DNA identification.
"In my estimation, the AFIP managed two of the three incidents following the Sept. 11 attacks: the Pentagon crash and the Somerset crash. My AFIP credentials opened more doors during the activation than my DMORT association. Medicolegal disaster responders respect the AFIP name," Sledzik said.
In fact, the Office of the Armed Forces Medical Examiner provided forensic pathology consultation for the Pennsylvania crash, and five staff members of the Armed Forces DNA Identification Laboratory collected DNA samples in the Somerset morgue.
Sledzik and Barbian, physical anthropologists on staff of the NMHM/AFIP, oversee a collection of human medical and pathological specimens. They provide forensic anthropology consultation to several local and federal agencies and teach an annual AFIP course in forensic anthropology.
"The methods of interpreting the biological aspects of the human skeleton are similar, whether you are looking at a Civil War soldier or a recent disaster victim," said Barbian.
Dr. Dennis Dirkmaat, a DMORT member and forensic anthropologist from Mercyhurst College in Erie, said the remains were "extremely fragmented" after the crash, in which the airliner hit the ground at hundreds of miles per hour.
Still, Dirkmaat said, DMORT workers were attempting "to document every piece of tissue," no matter how small. By walking or crawling over the crash site and by sifting dirt through mesh screens, DMORT workers hoped to recover tiny samples that, despite their size, could be analyzed and identified.
Once the remains were recovered, they were sent to a temporary morgue four miles away in a Pennsylvania National Guard armory in Friedens. There, more DMORT workers analyzed the remains utilizing equipment shipped from Dallas.
Fingerprint specialists examined tissue and dentists examined teeth, fillings or wire from dental braces that had been collected for comparison with X-rays and other records obtained from relatives of the crash victims. Anthropologists and X-ray technicians have done the same with bones, looking for evidence of healed fractures, past injuries or surgeries.
If remains still couldn't be identified, DMORT workers sent samples to the DNA laboratory in Maryland to be matched with the genetic markers of those who died.
That can be done by obtaining blood samples from relatives or by obtaining DNA from strands of hair left in combs, from saliva on toothbrushes or stamps, even from nearly invisible bits of blood or tissue or a razor blade.
Originally posted by OrionStars
reply to post by COOL HAND
You are telling me to make your case for you. I am not going to do that. That list is what you are using as "evidence". You have to explain how it works. It is not your opponent's responsibility to explain what you call "evidence" means.