Conspiracy against true spiritual potential

reply to post by TheGreySwordsman


That was amazing insight, Thank You TheGreySwordman, I am one with you and the wisdom you speak of.

Peace, light and love

I am not sure what is being discussed here via the first post. In which case, I would have to completely disagree then. If I read it correctly, I would have to say that it seems to be generalizations with the main thought being that there is a conspiracy against true spiritual potential and then stating that you do not know who is responsible.

I think that I do, but reserve the fact that I may also be wrong. This then leads to a world of deception because of judging other people, who ususally are equated to as being the wrong-doers and the evil ones. I think that it varys in the end, and the only generalization that I can come up with is that all people make good and bad decisions in the end. That no person is perfect although some think they are more perfect than others, which to me they can also not prove, as much as I can prove anything except what I think that they say.

The usual result to me is that -- they deceive us here in such and such a place (perhaps this Country called the USA since I am here) so we (whomever we is -- and that usually refers to having something that should come out in the toilet stool - your throne here on this Planet) will deceive them, either by citing people in this Country who to them are wrong and citing other people in this World as wrong, and never citing theirselves (him/her self) as wrong.

Be careful in what you hear for what you have is a brain which can really hear what it is that tends to make you wonder about all of this and all of this so-called Spirit.

Thus, this so-called conspiracy against true spirtual potential can not happen if you also know that another person can not truly deceive you in the end. Oh, they may deceive you for awhile, but usually that is the person wishing for something that may not be happening. Thus, most people put their own chains and balls around their own necks in the end.

To me, in my opinion then, this leads to all confrontal issues confronting humans called people on this Planet today. Thus, break out of the mass delusional cosmic consciousness these other people wish to invoke on people and know the difference.

For instance, first a child does not need a mother and a father because it is better than one parent or which guardian. No, a child needs real people first to know that there are real people in the world so the child can base that learning that all children are bound to do on his/her own regardless of what some other adults state. In fact even when people become adults and all through life, most people need real people who are not so much inclined to state that it should be this way (Creation vs. Evolution) but tend to look at the larger issue of why it should be both according to the Creator instead of one way or another.

Same way with religion or spirituality, it is neither the religion nor the spirituality, but the person given the preaching or lack of preaching that leads to the overall concept of religion being spirituality.

So when people are involved and state that it is people who make up the definitions of how any word should be defined, there may be another Truth -- that the words (like in this case "religion" and "spirituality") were not really defined by humans or people in the first place.

In other words, the definition of the words can not be changed to suit the whims of any particular person, and the person can only be as important as to how that person relates to the definition of the words being used for any purpose.

There seems to be this general trend then, that people deceive other people with these so-called leaders stating that this is the world nowadays.

Then they state that this is not what they are really doing by their Acts or Speech and that you should believe them when they state that you should be believe them. The conspiracy then can only be in that person at that time for that moment, and it can not be in another person as long as the other person knows that they only wish to confuse the issue by stating that to them they are helping someone else (namely you) because they intended to judge you first without really knowing you as a person.

Then some people state that there would be no definition for love if it was not that they were deceiving other people in the first place because they can not equate to the real definition of love or do not see that love can be many shades inside the absolute grandeur of "Love". They usually state that they do not have time for that because of this world, and will not think of it anymore concerning them, because again it is a circle and cycle that they gave to themselves which in my opinion only needed deception in the first place as the criteria given as a property they wished to invoke upon others stating once again that it is the other people who did this first.

I say stop the madness, and the insanity, and let no person assume that others were responsible first for the way that this world is, but again assume that his/her own person is the person responsible but again they will not respond to the fear that they give his/her self in the end.

Humans wish to play a deadly game on this Planet just to satisfy their own musings to not play the game of life. There are many reasons given, but my what a tangled web of deception that can be made upon such reasoning, as if there was a world to gain at the end. Sorry, but Spirituality would state that there is no world to gain, and again it was in another realm, a realm that can not be reached through any thought such as gaining in this world. Thus, to me there can be no deception, unless one wished to invoke a deception upon his/her self, and not really have the freedom to think about what is really going on. The way to not have this delusion increase is to not react to such meanderings anyway, and not to let it affect anyone. Will this make your life better? No, there is no guarrantee, but it will keep someone else from over-reacting to what can be preceived as hate and how the world wishes to relate today.

To people who only change their whims along the way then, the other people do not have to fall into such a so-called trap to have a life. It was inherent in the rules or the Law in the first place. It first only became a comparison so that again the vicious cycle could continue. Some may call that a conspiracy, others may just call it "Stupidity". Whatever word used still has a real definition regardless.

kosmicjack and Dark_Raven,

Just thankful I could add something meaningful to the discussion. I can hardly take credit for interpreting this message however. Others have said the same things.

Thanks again. check my threads, I write about this often.

Great post. Skyfloating, I personally think that you are right. I have said for quite some time that there is a conspiracy to keep man in spiritual darkness.. I have a theory as to who the culprits are, but this is not really the place to discuss that. Good thread.

JSR: where I get stuck at is.....where does thought originate?

Skyfloating: Thats the question of all ages, isnt it? Rather than constantly being told what to think, I too want to know more about thinking itself. I´ll give it a try:

As a temporary lazy-mans explanation thought would come from the "I", the Will of "I", the "eye of the I", the observer. Its source would be non-physical. The x-istence of thought in itself would be blatant evidence of a non-matter reality.

TheGreySwordsman: constantly labeling things that are not currently known as blasphemy or fantasy.

Skyfloating: Your post is really good. I read a lot of the atheism vs. christian posts and they lack style, class, creativity, , humor. The mediocrity of their statements just blows my mind. Its a relief to find some people who are at least half-sane here. If it were allowed I would just copy-paste your post in every lame stereotype thread there is.

AmoebaSized: I am not sure what is being discussed here...


Skyfloating: And I am not quite sure what you are saying with your post. Some pretty heady writing there. Could you express your point in easier words and shorter? Thank you.

Speaker of Truth: I have a theory as to who the culprits are, but this is not the place to discuss it...

Skyfloating: OH YES IT IS. Notice the word "conspiracy" in the title? Please spill the beans.

I actually think it is a complicated issue.

For me, it began during the Nicean Council of 325 A.D... However, it has expanded from the religious arena to the secular one and then back again..

If one takes a look at the inquisition, it is pretty obvious that the "church" has always had a vested interest in having people believe what it peddles, and to disregard other voices.

The secularization of the world hasn't helped the spiritual wellness of humanity either. "Bow before the materialistic god mammon." Materialists are so set against any speculation or belief in the spirit that one can't help but remain in the dark in regards to spirituality.

Like I said, it's complicated. There isn't one specific player in the issue but a combination of a couple of culprits.







[edit on 12-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

reply to post by Myrtales Instinct


The Devine Spirit of Oneness
en.wikipedia.org...

"All "spirits" connected, form a greater unity, the Spirit, which has both an identity separate from its elements plus a consciousness and intellect greater than its elements; an ultimate, unified, non-dual awareness or force of life combining or transcending all individual units of consciousness."

In my opinion, I am a Spiritual being here on earth having a human experiance, i have been given this opportunity to better my soul. We are all part of this Spirit, sent here to living together experiance together and grow together. This is the Spirit of Oneness, all interconnected.

Now in regards to religion and science, what man has created is separation. We are taught that we are individuals completely separate. This is not at all true to me. We together are one, once we can over come the separation and bond together in Love and Harmony, realizing that together we are one with god source.



[edit on 12-12-2007 by Dark_Raven]

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by Skyfloating

 

You are right the bible can never teach spirituality because it only teaches dependency while rejecting free thinkers.

Spirituality is something we learn and achieve by oneself.

But again what can you expect from a book written by men with the agenda of domination in mind.

How TRUE, how true. Thinking is prohibited especially if its outside the manuscript.

reply to post by SpeakerofTruth


I think by "one specific player" you mean the Vatican. Am I right?

I visited rome for the first time two weeks ago, and the place does indeed have an amazing authoritarian power about it.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
I think by "one specific player" you mean the Vatican. Am I right?

I visited rome for the first time two weeks ago, and the place does indeed have an amazing authoritarian power about it.

Well, they are part of it,yes. However, they are not the sole player... You might have misunderstood my post. I said that there ISN'T one specific player, there are really a couple, maybe even a few in the obfuscation of TRUE spirituality.

Some threads on ATS remind me of my ex-girlfriends father (christian) and his son (atheist & materialist). Everytime we went to visit there, they would start their endless and fruitless discussion on "there is a God", "there is no God", "there is a god", "there is no god", "there is a god", "there is no god", like some sickish record player gone monotomatic.

Theyd ruin the best Christmas get-togethers with it.

As their discussion had been going on for 30 years, which is the better part of a lifetime, I consider them both stark raving mad.

What spiritual schooling taught me that normal school didnt

The most important stuff I should have learned at school, but I had to visit all kinds of spirituality-based courses to learn:

* How to silence the mind to gain enormous states of clarity and lucidity

* How to focus to an extent that my mind could influence events

* How cause-effect relationships can ocassionally be reversed

* How masses of people are manipulated through desire-fear mechanisms

* How to use imagination as a tool of creativity and actualization far beyond any "ah, you´re only daydreaming"

* How to feel at ease in difficult situations

* How to generate appreciation for life

* How to communicate and lead groups of people when moderating/presenting live

* How to apply ritual to create new patterns of habit

* How to break routine patterns of mind and behavior

* How to allow guidance from higher energy sources than my own

* How to breathe properly as to allow for more energy during the day

* How to experience ecstasy in love and sex

* How to break free from the 9-to-5-job treadmill

and so forth and so on. So, I wont be visiting any church or lecture on atheism anytime soon.

where did you go to learn those techniques? one of the hardest abilities in today's society is to clear one's mind. it proves to be rather difficult even in my sleep.

reply to post by Obsurion


Focus on one thing for an hour. That will have your mind sharp and clear and your body feeling high as a kite. If thats two hard, then focus on one thing for 3 minutes before switching to something else, but do that for 30 to 60 minutes. This automatically clears the fears and scurries the worries because during that time your mind is no longer running on auto-pilot but under your will.

Originally posted by Obsurion
where did you go to learn those techniques? one of the hardest abilities in today's society is to clear one's mind. it proves to be rather difficult even in my sleep.

The reason it appears "difficult" is because of a sort of addiction or label-of-importance to the "outside world" instead of the inner world.

Not seeing "inner world" as cause of "outer world", people mostly dont give a **** about dreams, silence, meditation, breathing and care only about whats going on "out there".

Once you notice the effect the inner world has on the outer world though, you will eagerly spend time on the world of thought and emotion and beyond.

Personally I believe the people agreeing with the OP are living in a fantasy world. To not see that everything around you is a struggle, to ignore that of human suffering for your own enlightment... There is an apparent vice grip on spiritual freedom, but I believe it is as two sided as anything can get. Fighting and judging within our bubble is a constant, but it must be directed inwards to achieve any real significance or advancement. I take nothing too seriously, which I believe to be peace, in a sense... Even looking within and believing everything you think is dangerous, as I've learned from experience. My will is from within, but that which I learn to advance can only come from a source. I'm sure every spiritual guru here has been gifted from birth, right?

Originally posted by rationalgaze
Personally I believe the people agreeing with the OP are living in a fantasy world.

interesting. Another poster pointed out that our vote for self-determinism and awareness is labeled either "blasphemy" or "fantasy".

I take nothing too seriously, which I believe to be peace, in a sense... Even looking within and believing everything you think is dangerous, as I've learned from experience.

I agree with both points. You therefore may be mis-interpreting what I am saying.

I'm sure every spiritual guru here has been gifted from birth, right?

I tend to think that ANYONE can come up with answers. And I am highly skeptical of people who pose as gurus rather than telling someone that they themselves are the guru. But thats only my personal interpretation of spirituality.

Originally posted by rationalgaze
To not see that everything around you is a struggle, to ignore that of human suffering for your own enlightment... There is an apparent vice grip on spiritual freedom, but I believe it is as two sided as anything can get.

NO spiritual person will ignore the suffering of any human. Everything around us is a struggle because a person's intention is almost always overshadowed by negative thoughts. It is true the mind is powerful enough to manipulate events ONLY with the help of consciousness. In order to achieve/manipulate something one must pay attention to it, but its not instantaneous, it takes a considerable amount of POSiTIVE thinking. Positive thinking allows for attraction , therefore Negative thinking allows for repulsion. Hope that makes sense.

There's a conspiracy against spirituality all around us. Everything that wants to control us, make us dependent, or manipulate us is against it. For with true spirituality, we wouldn't allow ourselves to be slaves to anything. Not to a church, company, government, marketers, cultural influences, or most of all, fear.

reply to post by Kruel


Kruel, you're right.. That is why I said that the conspiracy is complex; sure, you can point your finger at a certain group, but then, you might as well point your finger at three or four groups along with the group you're already pointing at.



[edit on 12-12-2007 by SpeakerofTruth]

reply to post by Skyfloating

Well said my friend. Flagged and starred. A while back I made a thread conveying almost the exact same point as yours. Unfortunately, it sank quicker than the titanic, but if anyone is interested in my viewpoint, please take a quick read of it here.

But yes, I was once an atheist myself. ATS is full of deeply religious people and deeply atheist people - very few imbetween. And almost everything that atheists hate about religion is absent from our 3rd-party natural spirituality, so it's very important to let people know that just because they hate the major religions for their lies, dogma, cruelty, war and extremism, that this does not make atheism the only option.

Judeo-Christianity, through its suppression of knowledge, is the biggest evil in this world. There are grains of truth among the poison, and these grains of truth are the ones that were simply stolen from a spirituality so ancient that it was followed, peacefully, for tens of thousands of years before Judeo-Christianity reared its ugly head.