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Omaha mall shooting - Black Op?

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posted on Dec, 11 2007 @ 11:35 PM
When I first heard about the recent mall shooting in Omaha, Omaha Mall Shooting, I didn't think anything suspiscious. I figured "Another poor kid on serotonin reuptake inhibitors went nuts again." However, like some other violent shootings we know of, this one seems to have other suspiscious, coincidental details. Specifically two:

-On the same day, before the mall shooting, President Bush was in Omaha giving a speech that emphasized heavily on social mental health care

-On the same day, before the mall shooting, Homeland Security visited the exact same mall. The reason given, was to chat with the mall officials about the security of the mall.

ABC - Bush In Omaha w/Homeland Security

Notice the spin Charles Gibson, ABC news reporter, puts on the story!

He states:

Airports and sports arenas have tightened security considerably since 911, but malls have been reluctant to do so.

It seems to me like he is placing the blame on the people for not being willing to submit to increased mall security/surveillance/bag searching.

I asked myself the revealing question "Who gains from this massacre?", and the only entities I could think of were Homeland Security and the Bush
Administration. They gain more favor for their rights robbing, gun grabbing, surveillance society!!!

[edit on 11-12-2007 by Trauma]

[edit on 11-12-2007 by Trauma]

posted on Dec, 11 2007 @ 11:53 PM
Thats an interesting note, sort of like that man in Australia or Zealand or somewhere who was mentally disturbed, he killed 13 people with an Norinco .223 AK derivative at the hip with almost all head shots.

The incident indirectly resulted in an amendment to New Zealand's firearms regulations in 1992; this was essentially a tightening of gun control in the country.


posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 12:24 AM
Lord knows I think the PTB suck! And... there does seem to be a lot of 'lone gunmen' lately...

I try to have an open mind about all of this Illuminati theory because there definitely feels as if a method is being applied to society for some purpose - what, I don't know.

But sometimes I read blogs and sites on the internet and think - man these are some crazy, paranoid schizos! Like this one for instance:

Orange Alignment

I would LOVE for someone on ATS to make sense of this "Orange Alignment" theory. I searched on the web for a bit and can't come to any idea of what the hell this blog is talking about, except for some kind of map with a line drawn from Omaha through Colorado to San Fransisco.

Sorry OP, I don't know if this post helps or hurts your Black OP Theory, but I am wondering...

Sometimes the over-zealous, "connect-the-dots" mentality and crazy, over-the-top symbolism of a lot of Conspiracy Theory and Illuminati/Mason sites just blows my mind and makes me want to turn off my computer for good. Isn't there enough real garbage going on in the world without just making stuff up?

[edit on 12/12/07 by kosmicjack]

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 12:25 AM
reply to post by PontiacWarrior

Wow! I had not heard of that story. It seems very suspscious that only 3 days after the murders his house was burnt to the ground. It does not seem likely that locals would do that for retribution because they risk burning down their neighbours homes and destroying any evidence that could give clues to Gray's condition.

I'm sure the Virginia Tech shootings are still fresh in your mind. One man armed with dual pistols (a 9mm and a .22) killed 33 people. His shots were uncannily accurate according to police, who did not even take into account that he was wielding two guns at once!

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 12:50 AM
reply to post by kosmicjack

If you can't find any other information on this "Orange Alignment" than maybe the blogger made it up or is the first to notice the trend. I do believe in Occult trends/symbolism being hidden all around us, but I always need evidence. "Hidden in plain view" is the term I like to use.

But back to Omaha. I am a person who notices when the same trends occur during separate rare circumstances. Besides the incredibly obvious trend of people on serotonin reuptake inhibitors going insane, the trend I saw in this shooting was the Homeland Security agent who just happened to be checking things out before it happened.

Another trend of black ops is coincidence. For example, Bush just coincidently happened to be speaking in Omaha earlier that morning about growing mental health issues.

And one more black op trend, perhaps the cherry on top, is the media spin. (Not saying all media spins are part of black ops). In this case, the spin is claiming that malls have been reluctant to increase security and that is why this shooting took place.

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 01:27 AM
reply to post by Trauma

There's another very odd component to the media spin that I noticed...

As you may have heard, Jeanne Assam, a 42 year old armed, former Minneapolis cop, took out the killer in a church hallway,

but if you look for the current headlines, almost all of them say "Colorado Gunman Killed Self"

When I learned about Jeanne Assam in early articles, my first thought was "the best way to stop this from happening is to arm more citizens." Since yesterday, the headlines talking about Assam's taking him out have been replaced by those saying he killed himself, without mention of her. Eyewitnesses say she took him down. The official story is that although he was taken down by her, he killed himself in a last gasp action with a shot to his own head. I still think she'd deserve a mention, since she actually stopped the rampage.

The news articles themselves still mention Assam, but unless you read to any level of detail (do you think most people do?), a quick scan of the headlines would leave you thinking "another nutjob kills a bunch of people with a gun and then himself. Geez, maybe it is good that the Supreme Court have decided to clear up whether or not the 2nd ammendment really allows us unstable citizens to keep arms", not to mention "bearing" them. I was really skeptical about some of these seemingly random shooting sprees being black ops, but the media twist in this case seems to have a real agenda that is inconvenienced by the fact that a heroic citizen with a gun saved the day and cut this one short. Maybe people don't really crack this way without some external help.

Maybe rather than seeking to weaken citizenry by further reducing personal freedoms and requesting even more enforcement and security from the executive branch, we as citizens should take back our right and responsibility to protect ourselves by helping our loved ones, neighbors and friends learn to be comfortable with firearms.

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 01:43 AM
Well, this gets stranger and stranger. There is another thread discussing the eyewitness accounts that conflict with the actual shooter in the mall. Original reports saying the person had a military hair cut, reports of what sounded like multiple shooters, conflicting reports on the weapon used.... etc.

Now this, I had no idea that homeland security was in town earlier. Crazy

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 03:09 AM
reply to post by Karlhungis

Could you please link to that thread?

I have found conflicting news reports on the weapon used at the crime.
Some are reporting it was an SKS, and others are reporting an AK-47 that
he stole from his stepfather.



First of all, it would be interesting to find out WHO exactly this young man's stepfather is and what he does.

I also heard an audio tape on The Alex Jones Show of a woman calling 911 and you could clearly hear 16 shots fired semi-auto in the background. If anybody knows where I could find that please let me know.

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 03:24 AM

It is about half way down the first page. There is an eyewitness account that is summarized.

posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 03:55 AM
Wow. This totally blows the lid off of this shooting. It was 100% a black op. Moving headshots at 55 yards while moving yourself?? With an AK-47??? This just has black ops written all over it. They can literally have a soldier dressed in full fatigues and armed with an M16 walk into a mall and blast people, and then tell us it was a disgruntled 19 year old with an AK47.

posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 08:16 PM
reply to post by Trauma

Well if we Don't ACT or we just sit home, and reply to post, Things happen if you know people with problems don't keep Quiet, There are programs out there to help, even if its just to Talk, Sooo! if you can help someone DO IT. High School and College Students do them selfs an injustice, Direct someone to a program, and Don't be Quiet

posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 09:47 PM
reply to post by bone13

I am only trying to discuss the possibility of this shooting being a black op. I do not want to get into the politics of suicide and depressed/troubled people.

posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 10:19 PM
Seems like all shottings like this since the Columbine incident have all these weird connections.

What I'd like to know is how the kid hid the AK-47? In the images they released he's seen walking in wearing baggy clothes, but IMHO his clothes were not baggy enough to hide an AK-47 under. An AK-47 is a good sized gun.

You also have different reports of how he started the shooting. I saw on the news a couple days after it happened, the FBI animation of what he did and there was TWO different versions. One showed him walking in and going towards an escalator where he pulls the gun out and starts shooting. Another showed him walking in, goes towards the escalator and then enters an elevator. The elevators doors opened and suddenly he had the gun. Nowhere in the animation did it show him pull the gun out while being in the elevator. Even the reporter was asking why there was two different animations.

Look into Columbine and look at all the weird stuff surrounding it. Wayne Harris, the father of shooter Eric Harris, is a military guy. It's been proven he worked in the MK-ULTRA experiments (do I realy need to explain what that is for the ATS crowd?) and other things in his military career and still does military work to this day that's secretive.

A large NATO van was seen at Columbine that day. It was seen in the live footage that aired in the area at the time the shootings were going on. All kinds of people were asking why a NATO van is at a school shooting. It's not really surprising that when asked where all the live footage that was shot that day is now, the local news stations said "IT WAS NEVER RECORDED TO TAPE". Which can only be complete BS seeing how you can find a lot of on the internet now, but it's missing large chunks at key moments. I even remember seeing the van in the live footage. I remember I was getting ready to leave for work and saw it on the TV and I yelled out "WTF is NATO doing at a school shooting?" and my girlfriend at the time said "that is pretty odd" then I left for work. I've never been able to find video of that since then, but I know I saw that van and it was confirmed later on when others reported seeing it and questioning why it was there.

Then you have multiple reports of more than 2 gunmen. Reports of people on the roof throwing pipe bombs and shooting at people at the same time shotings are also going on inside the school. Reports of men in camoflauge clothing hiding in the soccer field shooting at students trying to get away (you might remember a group of teens all wearing camo gear being arrested outside the school that day). Multiple students reported that ATF agents (identified by the letters ATF on thier backs) were roaming through the school and randomly shooting into rooms. Multiple students reported the schools hallways being filled with bodies, yet the official count is only 11 not counting the killers. Reports from hospitals of secret service type agents being around the hospitals before the shootings began then these same hospitals later start getting multiple bodies and injured people coming in. These men that resembled secret service agents closing watching everything going on and a few reports of them threatening staff not to say a word.

Audio tapes were found in Eric Harris's home that feature Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold speaking in german with two unidentified individuals (reports of a tall, older man with blonde spiked hair running through the school shooting and shouting in german were made by multiple students). The content of these tapes were never released and were found in a basket on the dining room table. The two killers made a lot of video tapes before the shooting. They made a couple the night before that shows them preparing that have never been released to the public. People who have seen these tapes say it proves others were involved and the police know it. Everything written by Eric Harris involving the planning of the shooting was done on his fathers computer. Why did Eric Harris use his fathers computer to do all that when he had his own? Eric Harris's father is the one who showed Eric how to make pipe bombs, mortars and also napalm. This has been admitted by his father. Why would a father teach his son, who clearly had some mental problems, how to make all that stuff?

A few months after the Columbine incident, there was a shooting at a Subway restaurant. It was found out that bullets found at the scene match bullets found at Columbine that were listed as UNKNOWN ORIGIN in the balistic reports from the Columbine incident. The shooter/s from the Subway incident were never found. The local police department is fighting hard to keep a lot of evidence hidden away from Columbine and some they even admitted to destroying.

Something's weird about all these shootings in the last decade

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 02:49 AM
reply to post by nightmare_david

Excellent post my friend. I also remember hearing that they found over 100 bombs in the school, some weighing 100 lbs. which would be impossible for the two of them to have carried in that time frame.

This Omaha shooter reportedly lived with his step-father since he was 3 when his mother went insane. His step-father also owned the AK-47 that was supposedly used. I would really like to know who this guy's step-father is and who he works for.

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 08:29 AM
Dude.... speaking of Virginia Tech, that very same week, just two days after Virginia Tech, there was the Johnston Space Center hostage situation/shootings. My very first post on ATS was about the shooting, and there only seems to have been one other post about it on ATS. Of course, I was a new guy, and my thread was killed pretty fast.

The weird things about the Johnston Space Center shooting, in short summation:

The media reported about it live when it happened, and then went completely silent about the whole incident. Nobody remembers it when I mention it. People actually think I made it up!!! Why would I do that?
"Hey, did ya hear, there was a shooting at Johntson Space Center... Gotcha! Bye."

The employee had worked there for quite a while, was in his sixties, and was reported to be a "good employee" and "friendly". He reportedly "snapped" because they were going to fire him. Well, there ya go, another spoonfed excuse as to why perfectly normal people "snap", according to the idiot box.

the two details that stand out to me are thes:

The three (or was it two? I'm just jotting this down from memory...more info maybe I'll get soon) shooting victims were obviously on good terms with the shooter before lunch, as they were all seen sitting together eating at lunch.

The shooter had barricaded himself in a room, and once again, the "crazed shooter" takes his own life inside the barricaded room, conveniently just before agents were able to force open the door... but he had apparently taken that time to write a message onto a whiteboard. This message has never been made public.

Was it a suicide note? Doubt it. Why wouldn't they make a suicide note public? Remember Kurt Cobain? That was the main piece of evidence used to determine whether it was a "suicide".... even though these are two entirely different instances...

My theory was that the man had stumbled upon some sensetive information about the space program, had threatened to go public, and was fired after negotiations didn't work out (I think I had read somewhere also that he was going to be promoted a couple months prior, but then suddenly a couple moths later, he was getting fired?). Somehow, the colleagues of his in which he was seen eating with at lunch were in on whatever they were planning to do... but for some reason, I don't think a scientist at a sensetive Nasa tracking facility would have gotten past security measures with a gun. I think it was cold blooded murder because some sensetive material was being compromised by these three (or four) people, and since other employees were witness, and gunshots were heard as far as the nearby middleschool... they had to cover their tracks....and what better way than to make that "scientist" into yet another "crazed killer", conveniently just two days after the VTech shootings.

Does anyone remember this? Wasn't this a bit suspicious to anyone?

I personally immediately thought... "Hmmm, it's a "sattelite" tracking facility... possibly a rogue employee trying to oust the UFO phenomenon as real?"

But also I suspect it could have been a foreign spy monitoring American military sattelites and reporting them back to his country, and they just didn't want to alarm people about the possibility of spies infiltrating our security.....since the illusion has been that security is almost impenetrable since 9/11.

I haven't a good idea of what went on during that incident yet, as there's not much info on the internet about it.

Sorry, a bit off topic, but worth mentioning, I think.

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 12:18 PM
I do remember the story. It came and went very quickly, just as you describe, with minimal NASA or media reaction and virtually no real inquiry to or clarification of the official story. However, when the female astronaut had personal issues, off complex and didn't kill anybody the press was on it for months, questioning the entire astronaut program. Why the difference in the way the two stories were handled?

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 12:36 PM
Not to nitpick, but the Bush Administration isn't exactly anti-gun, so using this as a motivation to take away people's guns doesn't fit in with the rest. Remember, this is the president who allowed the Clinton Assault Weapons Ban to expire and decided not to extend it.

As for the head shots, it's not really that surprising. It was an enclosed area with short ranges between the shooter and the people he targeted. I have extensive experience with the AK, and it's not that hard to hit things at short ranges with it. It's an AK, and even the semi-auto variety that he had can put out a lot of lead in a hurry, so if he just aimed at head level and started pulling the trigger, it's almost inevitable some people would be hit in the head. Not to mention, professionals do not usually make head shots. You are taught to shoot for "center mass" (the middle of the torso where there are lots of organs). There is a thing called "failure to stop drills" in which you double tap (fire twice) to the target's center mass and then fire one round to the head. This is only done if the target does not stop when you initially hit him/her (such as if the target wears body armor). This is the only time you'd really see a professional fire for the head, outside of snipers.

The rest of it (Homeland Security, etc), if true is intriguing, but it is probably just a coincidence. Occum's Razor applies here.

Edit: Let's not forget that the AK-47 and the SKS (whatever he used) were both designed to be used by the most dirt-dumb Warsaw Pact conscript who probably had little interest in being a soldier, but was forced to be one. In other words, the thing is nearly idiot proof and can be learned quickly.

[edit on 14-12-2007 by Grozny07]

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 01:41 PM
reply to post by Grozny07

Actually that is incorrect about Bush and the assault weapons ban. He supported the ban and spoke openly of it during his campaign and the only reason it expired was because congress didn't present another one for him to sign. Bush and the assault weapons ban

I know it's easy to hit medium range targets with the AK-47, but when you AND the target are moving (these people were probably running as fast as possible with their heads down), it is very hard on semi-auto. This is 55 yards, slightly more than half of a football field. Then again he reportedly fired 38 shots and killed 9 people so he's not exactly a marksman.

I know Occam's Razor, but what I am trying to focus on here is how every one of these shootings has some coincidence that goes against huge odds. That is a trend.

I had not heard of the Johnston Space Centre shooting but thanks for the info. It always amazes me how the controlled media can still manage to slip things like that through the cracks every now and then.

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 02:36 PM
I hadn't heard about Bush being for the ban. That's actually very interesting. He always struck me as at least indifferent, if not pro-gun on those issues.

Can we confirm these coincidences as being totally factually, or are they third hand reports? In this area you have to be careful. Remember all the bizarre stories that came out about the World Trade Center? Reliable sources are key.

I'm not being disrespectful, but 38 shots and 9 dead do not point to any professional. On that one I can't be convinced
However, with the number of shots fired, I'd have to say it was definitely an AK. I know the media couldn't make up its mind between whether the weapon was an SKS or an AK, but the SKS takes 10 rounds only and is loaded by hand or with a 10 round stripper clip. It's not too fast to make a reload. The AK has 30 rounds per magazine, so he'd only have to reload once.

As for the NASA shootings, check out my thread about NASA SWAT in the miltary/government projects section to see how many security resources that agency has. Amazing that the shooter got into the complex with a weapon.

posted on Dec, 14 2007 @ 07:33 PM
reply to post by Grozny07

I think Bush just puts on the good ol' boy Texas republican image to fool people. When you look at his record it shows. Naturally I thought he was against the ban too until I read that article.

These coincidences are many times first-hand accounts that are ommitted from the police reports. Think of the 911 Commission report and how they conveniently left out many crucial firefighter's and first responder's accounts that bombs went off so that the Commission could weave their own story.

The SKS can be modified to accept an AK-47 clip. I do agree that 38 shots and only 9 dead, plus 5 injured, does not appear to be the work of any professional.

I have also been wondering why he killed himself after firing only 8 rounds out of his second clip, but there could be a million reasons.

Has anyone else heard reports of a second young adult being found at the scene hiding under a bench near the shooter and was being questioned? My father said he had seen this on Fox news the day of the shooting. He also said he heard them report that the shooter was wearing a black trench coat, which I think was mentioned in another thread.

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