Originally posted by Tetragrammaton
... the majority of masons here choose the forward and offensive victim tactic, when the argumentum ad hominem fails. They claim that they have always
been hunted game, and that (using ad hominem) the tinfoil loon is just picking on these pure hearted men with good souls, that does nothing but
sacrifice themselves, for the greater good of humanity.
First off, good thread. It's high time someone decided to focus on behaviors rather than parroted information and out-of-context Albert Pike quotes
to form their theories/opinions.
I don't know if I would go so far as to say we're "hunted game," but we do get alot of flak that is undeserved and unearned. I liken it to a
dog's behavior, so bear with my analogy.
There is this dog. It's a good, friendly dog that likes people and has a good disposition. He plays with the neighborhood kids, etc. Then a kid moves
into the neighborhood that hates dogs, and kicks the nice dog every time he sees it. As time goes on, other kids start kicking the dog, because the
first guy had to have a reason, right? Pretty soon this sweet-natured dog is going to be a little defensive. He'll still be nice to adults, but he
growls and snaps at kids, because the kids are the ones doing the kicking. As time goes on, the kicking continues to the point where the dog feels
threatened by all people and he will growl and bark at anyone who gets near him.
I'm not to the end of that little scenario yet, and I don't think any Masons here are, but a lot of us are keeping our eyes on the kids, and
growling and snapping when they come close.
What needs to be emphasized here is the fact that no matter what argument or factual evidence is presented, they will use this excuse to
ridicule the writer further.
Equally true is the fact that when we try to honestly answer a question or address a comment, no matter what sources we use or personal experiences we
draw upon to reply, it is always "tainted" in the eyes of our "adversaries" (for lack of a better term), simply because we are Masons
On the one hand, we are in the best position to provide information about Masonry, due to the fact that we are members; but on the other hand, we
can't be trusted because we are members, and we must
be hiding something, because everything is secret
. Either that, or they assume we
are complete idiots and try to tell us that we know nothing about our own fraternity... but they do.
It's a catch-22 and it is one of the more frustrating things I have dealt with.
"Of course you would say that, you're a Mason," is their bread and butter and it's worthless to even try arguing once that comment escapes the
keyboard. Sometimes we still try, and that is where the more heated and ad hominem
attacks come into play. It's a problem with letting our
opponents drag us into a slugfest when we should call a spade a spade and just chalk it up to talking to a brick wall.
Usually it only makes us look bad, because in the eyes of the masses, we are supposed to be held to a "higher standard" due to our virtuous and
morally-based fraternity; like when you become a Mason you are just automatically a saint or something. Well, that's not the way it is. We are just
people and we face the same problems and challenges and tempers that all men face.
2.3 Straw Man Tactic:
This is the masons last line of defence, when the two other tactics have failed they will use this.
They will normally resort to this in a subliminal way, either swaying the focus of the discussion or data in a irrelevant way, or just plain out hide
behind the fact that they as an organization do charity.
This is probably the most common thing I see from Masons here, and I don't even think they realize it half the time. Sometimes I have seen arguments
be stuck right in someone's proverbial mouth and then blasted right back out. It rarely matters, because in most cases, we (some of us) have been
doing this for so long that we can see what's coming and just get it out from the jump, and often we're right, and it works. Once the poster is
shown to be arguing for argument's sake, the thread peters out.
The problem is when it happens to people with genuine questions or concerns, due to the dog psychology presented above. Is it the dog's fault he's
been kicked so much? No. I'm not trying to say it's not our fault; we're not dogs, we are men and should
be better than that. At least,
that's what we're supposed to be doing as Masons -- building ourselves into better men. No one said it was going to be easy, and not all achieve the
success that some do. But so long as we are laboring, there will be those waiting to tear down our work.
Being able to keep the kickers from tearing down what we have built is the really challenging part and one that most are not adept at.
What we have here is a clear manoeuvre used by any guilty party, whether or not they actually are guilty, they clearly feel guilty.
About what? All this about logical fallacies and you have generalized that we all feel guilty for something, hence the behavior. That is ridiculous,
first of all. Second, your definition of "clear" and mine must have some nuances.
The ridiculing and subliminal arrogant attacks are undisputed, over and over again we see that the masons on this site is above the rules of
all other normal users. As we see it in the capitalistic western civilization.
Where? There have been several Masons banned from this board for less than you might think. Hell I was even banned myself
for over a year due
to an argument between myself and certain site staff at the time that the "conspiracy posts only" caveat was introduced to the forum.
And let's not bring "Capitalistic Western Civilization" into it; when you started this thread you said we wee talking about ATS Masons -- if we're
gonna play, let's play by the rules.
We clearly see a pattern here, masons defending masons, masons attacking any criticism or scepticism.
Of course we will defend one another. Of course we will attack ideas and "facts" that we believe/know to be untrue. How could you possibly expect us
not to? As far as criticism/skepticism, if it's legit, it is treated as such. If it's the same out-of-context quotes or standard anti-Masonic
rhetoric found on freemasonrywatch.org and sites of that kind, it is likely to be dismissed out of hand.
Unfortunately, some people post those things out of a sincere curiosity, and are berated and made to look stupid for believing it. This should not
happen and I'm sure I'm just as guilty of it as anyone else. It doesn't help, and only makes people feel bad, or worse, feel like we really are the
enemy. Sad, when you consider that a different response from us
could have made the difference.