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A Theory of Anti-Masons

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posted on Dec, 7 2007 @ 01:01 PM
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For some time, I have been pondering exactly why it is that there are people who spend vast amounts of time on this section of the forum bashing masonry. I do not talk of those who ask legitimate questions or pose theories with logic and reason (because we do have some threads like that), but I refer to the threads where these “anti-masons” create conspiracy theories which are either completely made up without evidence or have previously been proven to be wrong. Often, otherwise legitimate threads are hijacked by these anti-masons and devolve into endless posts that include any or all of the following tactics: making people freemasons who never were, quoting from selected Masonic authors who cannot speak for all of masonry, using completely biased sources that criticize masonry on the basis of simply incorrect facts, and/or ascribing extramasonic meanings to symbols without reason or logic.

Why do people do this? What could so compel people to forgo any type of logic or reason and spend their time bashing a fraternity?

At the individual level, it seems obvious that such people desperately want to understand the world they see around them. They see a world of wars, conflict, pain, and despair as advocated by popular media. It seems completely unreal that such a world could be the result of individual actors fulfilling their own will in a chaotic and unorganized manner. How could billions of individuals acting out of self interest cause all the things the media presents to us?

They ask themselves these questions and immediately conclude that there must be some group collusion occurring to bring the world to its current status. They ignore other rational and far more probable solutions, and immediately plow towards groups of myth and lore to explain the identity of these groups that they now believe must be shaping our world. To place the ills of the world on a single group requires several characteristics: it must be large, international in scope, and be old enough that its symbols and practices can be easily twisted and mischaracterized when taken out of context of time and intended meaning. Freemasonry is both large, international, and now old enough (either by history or by lore) to be easily twisted and mischaracterized since its practices can only be properly viewed in context of its originating culture and time.

“Ah-ha!” the anti-mason goes, having found the solution that helps explain their world and draw lines of good and evil. “This must be it. THEY are the cause of all the problems.”

In doing this, these anti-masons make themselves believe they now have some sort of enlightenment, because they have somehow figured out what billions of other people cannot see. They believe they have found some secret answer, and because with knowledge comes power, this makes them believe that they now have some sort of “real” power in a world they otherwise cannot control.

Finally, by doing all of this, the anti-masons comfort themselves by turning their world into black and white, into a war of good and evil. By eliminating the grey that actually characterizes our world, the anti-masons make their world simpler and more comprehendible – and incapable of understanding the complexities of the fraternity they hate without reason or logic.




posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 05:14 AM
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Well said.

UnfortunatelyIMHO the likelyhood of all using logic and reason is about
the same as some one producing a live Unicorn. I also believe that there
is a third equally hard to find element that must be present. Common Sense.

Finding all three together is like chasing Faeries. It is entertaining.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:21 AM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


It's just an irrational thought process that is set off by the "secrecy" of the fraternity. Time after time, you can comb through the conspiracy theories involving Freemasonry and all the claims are completely unsubstantiated. Some of them are just tangent thoughts of unstable runaway imaginations. There are certain "conspiracy masters" who further perpetuate the cycle of mistrust towards Masons, in my eyes, for personal benefit. I get the feeling they probably don't believe the things they're saying, though others manifest these wild theories and believe them to the point of paranoia. As an American, we should have nothing but the utmost respect for Freemasonry, as it was an important part of the founding of this country. If we didn't have Freemasonry, we wouldn't be talking about fighting oppression, but would merely be oppressed.

You guys have nothing but respect from me.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:24 AM
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Good post

Addresses a lot of what I've seen since recently joining here. Masons don't deserve the continual bashing and from my experience they do a lot of good within their communities.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:45 AM
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You might want to look at this source which characterizes anti-masonry into the following categories:


"Religious Intolerants"

This is where MOST of the anti-masonic info comes from. It used to be the catholic church condeming masonry because it acknowledged all religions while catholosism wanted to be THE religion. Today this has shifted and you have most of the anti-masonic material coming from the evangelical bible belt and fundamentalists who not only see masonry as "satanic" but anything other than their specific group.

"Hate Groups"

The second source are people who are simply emotionally enraged and project that rage toward any given group. Since they do not know what freemasonry is it is easy to use that as a scapegoat. This type of source is often connected to neo-nazi type paranoia where all jews, freemasons etc. are put into one big conspiracy-pot.

"Self-Servers"

These are the type who have decided to make a buck off the ignorance of readers. To gain money or attention they will make any claim.

"Conspiracy Theorists"

This is by far the most pleasant of anti-masons. They have the tendency to fill in the blanks of unknown with imagination. Many ATSers are of this specific type, seeing the world through coloured glasses. As I have seen you (OP) attack this type ocassionally, I would recommend to you to go softer with them. While their "connecting the dots with imagination" style is often naive and completely untrue (as in respect to freemasonry), that method does sometimes uncover hidden information.







[edit on 8-12-2007 by Skyfloating]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 08:52 AM
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Excellent points made by everyone. Especially the point that most of these people don't probably even believe what they are typing - that's something I had not though about, but thinking about it - it is so true.

I also find it odd that so many of these anti-masons attack from a rabid religious group perspective. This is probably where I've seen the most "foaming at the mouth" anti-masons, almost to the point of shameless abandon of logic and reason. It is especially interesting because while masonry is not religious in nature, it certainly has a noticeable and identifiable christian tradition in its ritual. Sometimes I think these most rabid anti-masons are scared that the fraternity is going to "steal" some of the glamour of christianity away from the church. It is of course non-sense that such would occur, yet it seems like the only way of explaining the insanity I often see from them.

As far as me attacking the conspiracy theorists, I do not do so intentionally. I have no problem with theories that are indeed founded in some sort of logic and reason. I do believe if we are going to "fill in the gaps" with imaginative thinking we must at least justify why those gaps must be filled with masonry instead of some other group that is commonly used in such theories. I will, however, try to be more gentle.

Finally, I have found that the anti-masons can almost always be identified by their type of posting, which I have called "hit and run posting." What they seem to do is go google "mason conspiracy theories" and take the top hits, claim them as truth, and post them. Then, me and others go through the claims and debunk them one by one. The original poster - completely ignoring everything that has been said - goes back to google to find yet more irrational conspiracy theory. We then respond again, debunking it line by line. This seems to be the defining characteristic of the anti-masons.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 11:37 AM
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I offer this thread as a classical example of what this post talks about. Observe how the original question is at least theoretically interesting and appears to have no immediate agenda. Debate and discussion ensues. At some point near the end of the thread, a rabid anti-mason derails the topic and begins to bring out the tried and true anti-mason theories which have all been proven before TO BE WRONG. He then begins to hit and run with his posts, when everyone points out that his theories are not only wrong - but they have been covered by the board before.

A classic example of rabid anti-masons in action.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 11:49 AM
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I think it's a case of no knowledge of Masonry,notice how people react to something they know nothing about,act out in fear or possibly anger,I come from a strong religious family and we are ,and were Mason's



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 12:12 PM
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honestly i think you guys should just get over it. welcome to this wonderful 'conspiracy' forum, please do not be alarmed if people see evil lurking around YOUR corner, nor if they fail to see the logic you offer them. people's understanding of the world, their world, is framed within their own personal context. it is the accumulation of inborn and learned traits. because someone sees something as evil does not mean that you must try to change their mind, as you have all probably noticed, it simply does not work.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by Animal
honestly i think you guys should just get over it. welcome to this wonderful 'conspiracy' forum, please do not be alarmed if people see evil lurking around YOUR corner, nor if they fail to see the logic you offer them.


Ah, yes, observe the classical anti-mason argument when all else fails: "this is a conspiracy forum." What the anti-mason fails to acknowledge is that conspiracy is not synonymous with "rabid, crazy, theories without proof or logic." But by failing to acknowledge this, the anti-mason can feel secure in proposing just such theories.


Originally posted by Animal understanding of the world, their world, is framed within their own personal context. it is the accumulation of inborn and learned traits. because someone sees something as evil does not mean that you must try to change their mind, as you have all probably noticed, it simply does not work.


Also see that the anti-mason makes use of the classical list of logical fallacies that he must utilize in order to bring comfort to his world: this time, the relativist fallacy. By using logical fallacies to explain his world, the anti-mason - as we see here - is helping to justify a system of theories that have no reason or logic. What is most interesting is that we see the anti-masons admitting that they are incapable of changing their mind - confirming that the anti-mason simply seeks to justify his own irrational system of belief.

Fascinating. Further study is needed - please reply more, anti-masons.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 12:40 PM
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I can live like a mason with the world as my lodge.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 12:48 PM
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Actually there have been times where I enjoyed this craziness as it made masonry look more interesting than it is. In this sense negative publicity is also publicity and better than now publicity. Some may disagree, but no publicity at all could just be the worst alternative.

The Art of disinformation is to make something so interesting, compelling and through in a few very true pieces, so that a reader buys into a whole book. The source of these peoples "knowledge" are books written in such a style. I used to read plenty of them and get all intrigued by the "mystery" I was "priveleged to know".

The paranoia can grow to an extent that YOU (OP) are seen as a co-conspirator or evil.

The excitement of "uncovering mystery" is much higher than looking up "logical fallacy" in the dictionary.

If you look at the history of the "secret societies" board, you will notice that the discussion mason vs. non-mason has been going on quite a long time, with similar realizations as we make in this thread. Many new generations of masons vs. anti-masons will grow up to post yet further messages pro and con. But as the age of information progresses it will be more and more difficult to uphold this nonsense.

Of course we can never rule out the possibility that within freemasonry another group hides, waiting to recruit the elite - as conspiracy theorists would have it. I doubt that this is the case for several reasons explained in other threads...but it cant be ruled out.

The motto of the conspiracy-theorist could be "The best kept secrets are those you cant find evidence too!".



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:02 PM
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It seems to me that many of the antimasons are the same people who on one hand, insist on a rigid, literal interpretation of the Constitution, while on the other, condemn the founding fathers for being Masons and ultimately Satanists from some of the viewpoints I've read. Well, one can not have it both ways, imo.

I think that we generally have the Masons to thank for bringing the Enlightenment to its fullest fruition, not to mention the enormous philanthropy in which the organization has been engaged year after year.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:04 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


i enjoyed the little fantasy you wove for us there lightindarkness, it was fun to listen to the story you created for you and your friends enjoyment.

when you become interested in talking about reality drop me a line, i look forward to having a discussion with you.


edit: please look back over all my posts regarding masons...the only thing i dont like about masons, generally, is the people. your rude, condescending, arrogant attitude is exactly what i am talking about. almost every time i have posted in a mason thread i mention i have nothing against masons, yet the fact that i hold views contrary to those of you and yours i am dubbed the "Anti-mason, i am not anti mason i am anti-jerk.



[edit on 8-12-2007 by Animal]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:05 PM
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reply to post by johnlocke
 


nothing quite like the enlightenment to make the world a btter place...

“These values rooted in the western enlightenment, and include an eagerness to apply scientific, technological methods to increase material production as well as a desire for institutions and cultural transformation that embody values right out of Max Weber—efficiency, frugality, orderliness, diligence, punctuality, and above all, rationality in decision making liberated from tradition, custom, and group allegiances” (Bruce Rich, 201).

[edit on 8-12-2007 by Animal]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:14 PM
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Originally posted by LightinDarkness

Originally posted by Animal
honestly i think you guys should just get over it. welcome to this wonderful 'conspiracy' forum, please do not be alarmed if people see evil lurking around YOUR corner, nor if they fail to see the logic you offer them.


Ah, yes, observe the classical anti-mason argument when all else fails: "this is a conspiracy forum." What the anti-mason fails to acknowledge is that conspiracy is not synonymous with "rabid, crazy, theories without proof or logic." But by failing to acknowledge this, the anti-mason can feel secure in proposing just such theories.


I seldom, actually I think this is the first time that I will be agreeing with Animal, he's right. This is NOT a Masonic forum, it's a conspiracy site. This being the Secret Societies forum. You are going to get anti-Masonic threads because of the visibility(ironic word don't you think) that Masonry has.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:27 PM
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reply to post by intrepid
 


Did you read my comment? I mean, actually read it? Where did I say that this is a masonic conspiracy forum? Anywhere? Nope. This thread is about the number of anti-masons in this forum - its so heavily slanted that if you counted the posts (and the fact that the forum picture has a square and compass) you'd find that a vast amount of posts are made about masonry. That it is a "secret societies" forum doesn't actually matter, as it is highly populated with anti-masons like animal.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by Animali enjoyed the little fantasy you wove for us there lightindarkness, it was fun to listen to the story you created for you and your friends enjoyment.


Ah, the rabid anti-mason comes out yet again. Notice that he does not address any of the points that I brought up, he completely ignores them and moves on to more rabid use of logical fallacies and insults. Classical hit and run posting.


Originally posted by Animal you become interested in talking about reality drop me a line, i look forward to having a discussion with you

edit: please look back over all my posts regarding masons...the only thing i dont like about masons, generally, is the people. your rude, condescending, arrogant attitude is exactly what i am talking about. almost every time i have posted in a mason thread i mention i have nothing against masons, yet the fact that i hold views contrary to those of you and yours i am dubbed the "Anti-mason, i am not anti mason i am anti-jerk.


See even more logical fallacies, this time ad hominem and red herring fallacies. Strange that someone who is so condescending and arrogant dislikes those characteristics - he does not even read his own post.

Keep it up.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:30 PM
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reply to post by LightinDarkness
 


Yes, I read it but this thread looks like "How dare they come here and say things against us poor Masons?" Well, it's a conspiracy site, you're going to get that. Nature of the beast.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 01:32 PM
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Reply to LightinDarkness:

Well, a large chunk of contemporary world-conspiracy-theory just happens to deal with freemasonry. And as this is a consipiracy-forum...


Could you think of any other secret society other than freemasonry and skull & bones, that could be subject of this forum?

I dont think so.



[edit on 8-12-2007 by Skyfloating]



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