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Bush: 'My Opinion Hasn't Changed' Towards Iran

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posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 01:39 PM
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reply to post by Keyhole
 


Nope......lets get this straight, Bush is not the decider. Bush is a puppet spokes person for the decider. And when I say the decider I am not talking about the Bush Administration or Congress.




posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 01:41 PM
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Listen, here is the thing about these NIE reports. They are not fact.

Almost all of the intelligence gathered for these reports is confidential and not available for public release. The "intelligence" that actually makes it in these reports is extremely low level and in most cases outdated. I can almost guarantee you that we will see an announcement within a few weeks that says upon further review the "full report" reveals something different than we see here.

How many times have we seen that press conference, "upon reviewing the full report, we found that…" It's nothing new.

President Bush has every right to be skeptical about this report. I would be too. No matter what this intelligence says, there is also evidence and intelligence that completely contradicts it.

Isn't it also funny how when these reports are released and say that Iran IS working on nukes, they are dismissed as wrong and unreliable, but as soon as they say something like this, everyone jumps all over them as gospel?



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 01:49 PM
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Originally posted by Keyhole
Well, looks like Bush is staying in character, no matter what information he is given that is against what HE believes is true, he is just going to keep saying what HE believes is true and to hell with the rest of the world.


Surely you don't imagine Bush ever believed Iran (or Iraq) was any kind of threat. His "crusade" for war has nothing to do with "threats" and everything to do with money from contracts, and power



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 03:16 PM
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Well, the question of who's in charge both in Washinton and Tehran is still open, political leaders that bloviate or career technocrats that pursue thier own agendas. Or the powers that lurk behind both sides.
All this "Bush is a raging drunk/idiot/puppet" stuff is kind of funny to read, however. I had no idea how many trained psychologists posted here; sounds more like simple hatred than reasoned denial of ignorance to me.
By the way, what do you suppose the Iranians are doing with those 3,000 centerfuges they claim to have running?



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by Mr Gunter
Trade 'nukes' for Islam.

Then you have the answer (IMHO).

This train ain't stopping until the Christian soldiers walk in Tehran.

Or Bush leaves office.


I'm not sure when Bush is due to leave office (I'm English, it's a bad excuse for being ill-informed but it's the only one i have) But I think the plan is to install some troops into Iran before the next president arrives.

Remember Bush saying that he was "sprinting to the finish line?" I think that alludes to some action on Iran. Either because #1 Bush's popularity now means nothing, he can't get a third term in office so he doesn't need to BE popular with the people anymore. #2 The next president who is going to be installed, and i use that word deliberately, installed not elected, will take a hit to his popularity if he is the one to send the boys into Iran, better to have Bush to do it first. Once the next president has secured his second term in office, he can begin doing what he likes.

Having said all that, it's getting to the point where the rumbles about Iran are going to have to get louder if they want to get boots on the ground before Bush is out of the whitehouse, because all I see so far is repetition and rhetoric. Time is ticking on, and armies and supplies and such take a while to mobilize.

[edit on 5-12-2007 by unnamedninja]



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 07:23 PM
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Bush is crazy, It is his insistance on sanctions back in 2003/2004 that caused this mess in the first place . The Iranians in 2003 came to an agreement with 3 european states , France, Germany and the UK to renounce any aspirations to a nuclear weapon, pledge and sign ratification of the Additional Protocol and "voluntarily to suspend all uranium enrichment and reprocessing activities as defined by the IAEA".

Which you can read here :

www.iaea.org...

All Iran wanted in return was ..

"cooperate with Iran to promote security and stability in the region, including the establishment of a zone free from weapons of mass destruction in the Middle East in accordance with the objectives of the United Nations".

But then the US decides they want a piece of the diplomacy pie , Bush was against security in the ME (as in Iran's proposal) , he wanted Iran dragged up before the UN and sanctions imposed to achieve the aim, of course the europeans bending to washingtons will as always backed off and so the deal to suspend uranium enrichment fell through .

But of course, Bush wants to impose sanctions, he wants any excuse to get a nation like Iran under UN sanctions to weaken it, to bring it under the economical/political auspices of the USA . Far more profitable than a WMD free zone as the Iranians wanted .

Edit to add link of the Embassy of France joint Statement of 2003 :

www.info-france-usa.org...

( How it could have gone without the intervention of president Bush and his sanctions )



[edit on 5-12-2007 by Gun Totin Gerbil]



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 07:55 PM
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reply to post by nyk537
 


I agree with all of you, Bush's logic seems well nonexistant, i do not want war overseas, we have enough problems at home, but nyk537 you are very right about the retraction of early statements, that they were conducted too quickly or whatever, but one possibility i have been thinking about and have read some material on is the fact that maybe right now they are not building "the bomb", no construction of any sort, but instead enriching uranium to weapons grade covertly, working on dozens of warheads but not building the bomb. when the time comes in 10 perhaps 15 years iran will begin construction of not the bomb but instead maybe 50 -100 bombs, but just a thought, a theory perhaps, but i'm not sympathizing with iran here but i think they are stuck inbetween a rock and a hard place with the rest of the world, and Bush's sanctions and sabre rattling definately isnt helping



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 11:25 PM
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I'm not sure how credible this story is, but thought I'd throw it in here:

US intel possibly duped by Iran



A highly controversial, 150 page National Intelligence Estimate (NIE) on Iran’s nuclear programs was coordinated and written by former State Department political and intelligence analysts — not by more seasoned members of the U.S. intelligence community, Newsmax has learned.

Its most dramatic conclusion — that Iran shut down its nuclear weapons program in 2003 in response to international pressure — is based on a single, unvetted source who provided information to a foreign intelligence service and has not been interviewed directly by the United States.

Newsmax sources in Tehran believe that Washington has fallen for “a deliberate disinformation campaign” cooked up by the Revolutionary Guards, who laundered fake information and fed it to the United States through Revolutionary Guards intelligence officers posing as senior diplomats in Europe.


I find it so hard to decide who to believe when it comes to all of this. I don't trust any of the sources (gov't, MSM, etc.) anymore.



posted on Dec, 5 2007 @ 11:37 PM
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That would be an article by one Kenneth R. Timmerman
Who also gave us this startling revelation in 2004 :


Saddam's WMD Have Been Found; The United States has already located many of Iraq's weapons, but the public wouldn't know it based on the silence with which Bush critics are greeting this success

New evidence out of Iraq suggests that the U.S. effort to track down Saddam Hussein's missing weapons of mass destruction (WMD) is having better success than is being reported. Key assertions by the intelligence community that were widely judged in the media and by critics of President George W. Bush as having been false are turning out to have been true after all. But this stunning news has received little attention from the major media, and the president's critics continue to insist that "no weapons" have been found.

In virtually every case chemical, biological, nuclear and ballistic missiles the United States has found the weapons and the programs that the Iraqi dictator successfully concealed for 12 years from U.N. weapons inspectors.



'New evidence out of Iraq' , our 'newsmax sources in Tehran ' . Does he think these entities know better than US intelligence departments, why aren't they on the payroll ?, who needs the CIA anymore with Timmerman and his 'sources' around.

So you can believe him if you want , I'm not going to thou.

[edit on 6-12-2007 by Gun Totin Gerbil]

Mod Edit: Quoting/Plagiarism – Please Review This Link.

Mod Edit: External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 12/6/2007 by Gools]



posted on Dec, 6 2007 @ 08:03 AM
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Annoys the hell out of me that even IF iran intends a nuclear weapons program, that they would have to pursue this covertly anyway. US has plenty of nukes and no room to preach. And dont give me that rubbish about rogue states and nukes, Iran is nothing close to a rogue state.

Start2 was a load of rubbish, did more harm than good because it probably made people think America and Russia actually gave half a care about decommissioning nukes. When in fact you only need a couple to cause a lot of damage, so whether you have 5 or 500 it makes no difference. And even if they were all dismantled, American and Russia have the means to make plenty more if they need them. But not the Iranians. I'm sorry Iran, even though we're facing an oil shortage crisis, you're going to have to power your country with treadmills and goats or something, no nuclear reactors for you!

This is nothing about nukes and it makes me sick, it's just about oil prices.



posted on Dec, 6 2007 @ 10:44 AM
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Of course not... bush minor is pathologically incapable of admitting he's ever made a mistake. My father, may he rest in peace, was the exact same way. He always had to be right even if everyone else knew he was wrong.



posted on Dec, 6 2007 @ 02:52 PM
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Mod Edit: Quoting/Plagiarism – Please Review This Link.

Mod Edit: External Source Tags – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 12/6/2007 by Gools]

Removed it all, I know the [ ex ] command now thanks to your edit, thanks )

On the subject of Plagiarism thou , how about this :


BREAKING: State Department official Iraq update is really compilation of plagiarized major media articles

New York Times, 11/16/07:
Prime Minister Nuri Kamal al-Maliki of Iraq has approved the trial of two Shiite former officials who are accused of killing and kidnapping hundreds of Sunnis, according to American advisers to the Iraqi judicial system.

The case, which could come to trial as early as this month, would be the first that involved bringing to trial such high-ranking Shiites for sectarian crimes.

An Iraqi judge ruled last month that there was sufficient evidence to try the two former officials, who held senior positions in the Health Ministry. But there had been concern that the ministry might try to block the case by invoking a section of the Iraqi criminal law that proscribes the prosecution of officials who are executing their official duties.

The approval to hold a trial was provided in a memo issued earlier this week by the acting health minister. Mr. Maliki has formally endorsed the decision, American officials said.

State Dept Iraq Weekly Status Report, 11/21/07 (page 4, 25):
According to American advisers to the Iraqi judicial system, Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki has approved the trial of two former Shiite officials who are accused of killing and kidnapping hundreds of Sunnis.

o The case, which could come to trial as early as this month, would be the first that involved bringing to trial such high-ranking Shiites for sectarian crimes.

o An Iraqi judge ruled last month that there was sufficient evidence to try the two former officials, who held senior positions in the Ministry of Health (MoH), but there had been concern that the MoH might try to block the case by invoking a section of the Iraqi criminal law that proscribes the prosecution of officials who are executing their official duties.

o The approval to hold a trial was provided in a memo issued earlier this week by the acting minister in the MoH. PM Maliki has formally endorsed the decision.


Lots more at : www.americablog.com...

[edit on 6-12-2007 by Gun Totin Gerbil]

[edit on 12/7/2007 by Gools]



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