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Lear expertice needed!(or anyone else)

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posted on Dec, 9 2007 @ 02:58 AM
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Originally posted by buddhasystem

Zorgon, would you care to corroborate on Russian launches from Melville Island, or is your "research" unworthy of posting, in the end?

Zorgon, I'm totally curious about the ongoing massive Russian launched from Melville. Do you have data or you made it up?


Oh I guess I made it up from Quotes of the Australian government...



Russia Approves New Australian Launch Project
Sydney - March 26, 2001



Asia Pacific Space Centre Pty. Ltd. is an Australian company created in 1995 for the purpose of developing and operating a commercial space launch services enterprise. The Aurora launch vehicle is a Russian designed and manufactured launch vehicle capable of delivering payloads to both low earth and geosynchronous transfer orbits.

"Aurora offers very low development risk by relying on the heritage and flight experience of programs such as Molniya, Soyuz, Energia and Proton'. Through the use of reliable Russian technology, aggressive marketing and a total commitment to customer requirements, APSC will provide an attractive alternative to existing launch service providers. This will be an exciting opportunity for satellite operators", stated Mr. Kwon.

The first commercial launch is planned for the last quarter of 2003. APSC is currently negotiating with a number of potential major satellite users, with the aim of providing the best quality service available that is both efficient and cost-effective.

Launch opportunities are available starting at the end of 2003. After introduction, manufacturing and launch rates are projected to ramp up to as many as 15 launches per year by 2006.


Space Daily


But hey you can't believe everything you read




posted on Dec, 9 2007 @ 05:52 AM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


Check outside your window, we're parked on the street.

Van says 'Flowers By Iris'

Other Van says 'Can't Initiate Anythng' (without getting caught)

Another Van (around the corner, but poised to strike) just reads, 'MiB'.

Cheers, hope you got a chuckle...



posted on Dec, 9 2007 @ 07:25 AM
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Zorgon,

Re: Space Command

Like I said earlier, I have been working strictly in AFSPC my whole AF career, and have been to all 13 bases in the command at one point or another. Im not saying that what you are talking about doesnt exist, but I am saying that you have not really shown anything that proves it, IMO. Everything that I have seen in Space Command deals either with nukes or satellites. Thats it.

I have known one person who got selected to become an astronaut. They were a space officer, and one they got approved, they went to NASA. Ive met thousands of people, seen hundreds of different jobs, and none of them had anything to do with a secret space program. Something like that would be pretty hard to hide in the circles of people I deal with everyday. Either every single person does a great job of keeping their mouths shut and lying, or it doesnt exist....im not sure which.

In AFSPC today, people in Space jobs wear "Space Wings" as their occupational badge. They are like pilot wings, but with a more "Star Treky" feel to them, and noone I know who wears these wings has ever been to space. That doesnt really prove anything, just an interesting aside.



posted on Dec, 9 2007 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by PokeyJoe Im not saying that what you are talking about doesn't exist, but I am saying that you have not really shown anything that proves it, IMO.


Nor am I likely to be able to show any proof unless someone gives me something I can actually post
So in essence we are at an impasse as far as proof is concerned...

I do appreciate your stopping in to help sort this out though. Your info on the networks was very helpful It led me to "Spook University"

This places uses "Think of it as Yahoo! for spies." Thats actually funny..
www.govexec.com...

And the Marines have a lot of info on it too...
www.marcorsyscom.usmc.mil...



But let me ask you a question hypothetically speaking..

IF there were secret space stations and astronaut corps... and you knew about them, would you be able to tell me?

So looking at this from your perspective... again hypothetically speaking... what would you consider acceptable proof that I could post publicly that would not result in 'visits' from those nice 'visitors' that talk with a monotone, have no humor, and use black as the preferred aesthetic appeal in apparel.



In AFSPC today, people in Space jobs wear "Space Wings" as their occupational badge.


Ah! Smart move that way if you see someone wearing 'space wings' you would not be able to tell if they actually flew or not... kinda defeats the purpose of 'wings' in my opinion. I mean when I see a person wearing regular wings, or proudly displaying them in a frame, my logical first question is where they flew...





They are like pilot wings, but with a more "Star Treky" feel to them, and no one I know who wears these wings has ever been to space. That doesnt really prove anything, just an interesting aside.


So please correct me if I misread this... are you saying no past or current Astronaut has Space Command wings? or are you saying you don't personally know any
And is it not silly to issue those 'wings' to ground staff... and not to those who actually went into space?

As to the "Star Treky" feel ...

That is no surprise






I can see the resemblance



Also in Stargate SG1 according to AFSPC the badge on the Prometheus is the "Real Deal"

The show is sponsored by the Department of the Air Force, the Department of Defence AND Space Command...

That's a whole lot of 'official support'


They even gave Lt Col O'Neill (Richard Anderson) one of those sets of wings...

Richard Dean Anderson was made an honorary brigadier general by the Air Force chief of staff.





[edit on 9-12-2007 by zorgon]



posted on Dec, 10 2007 @ 06:25 AM
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I have not read all the threads here on this forum, so I apologize if my question has been discussed.

I would like to know how all the "hundreds of secret space flights each year" are financed?

Thanks



posted on Dec, 10 2007 @ 06:32 AM
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Ok, well as far as the space wings goes, I dont know if I can give you a good explanation of why they do that. All that I know, is in my previous job, there were maybe a hundred people who got them, who I can say with out a shadow of a doubt did not go anywhere near space. They were program managers for different phases of the ICBM weapons system.

I did recently meet on real life astronaut, and she was wearing the space wings....

In the end, who really knows. We could argue in circle until we die, and its not going to do us any good.

One question though, if I really did know something like that existed, why would I come on here and waste my time at all.....to spread disinformation?



posted on Dec, 11 2007 @ 01:28 PM
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Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Zorgon, would you care to corroborate on Russian launches from Melville Island, or is your "research" unworthy of posting, in the end?

Zorgon, I'm totally curious about the ongoing massive Russian launched from Melville. Do you have data or you made it up?


Oh I guess I made it up from Quotes of the Australian government...
But hey you can't believe everything you read


Zorgon, you didn't post any references to actual launches. The company's web site has the "latest news" dating back to 2001. There is no info on launches from either the company ot the Aussie govt. So you knownlingly posted essentially false info. Thanks.



posted on Dec, 11 2007 @ 09:07 PM
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Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by buddhasystem

Zorgon, would you care to corroborate on Russian launches from Melville Island, or is your "research" unworthy of posting, in the end?

Zorgon, I'm totally curious about the ongoing massive Russian launched from Melville. Do you have data or you made it up?


Oh I guess I made it up from Quotes of the Australian government...


No, you just completely misunderstood the quotes from the Australian government and even after the errors have been pointed out you still cling to the quotes as if they are proof.

But, please, tell us all why a "secret" launch programme operating from a restricted access area off Australia's northern coast (or even from the Gulf/Cape country) would be advertising itself on the net as a commercial operation...



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 12:30 AM
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Is A Comet!! Is a Rocket!! No its an NRO classified satellite launch caught dumping fuel by an amateur astronomer

EXTRA: See the fuel dump on video captured by Kevin Fetter of Ontario, Canada.
Video (Windows media .wmv format)


NOT A COMET: Last night , sky watchers from England to Florida to Canada witnessed a new exploding comet--or so it seemed. "It looked like Comet Holmes!" says Alvaro Garay of Casselberry, Florida. Chris Schierer of Cazenovia, New York, saw the same thing and "wondered how such a bright naked-eye comet could have been missed." He snapped this picture using a Canon 20D:

A pair of objects streaking through the cloud suggested "a satellite explosion or fuel dump." The latter is correct. This cloud mimicking Comet 17P/Holmes is fuel dumped from the upper stage of an Atlas rocket that launched a classified satellite into orbit for the National Reconnaissance Office on Dec. 10th. The event created a splendid display for about 50 minutes and then faded into the night.


Space Weather

So "if there were secret launches someone would see them..."

Well they do and did and recorded it and the only fuss made about it is the spectacular images of the fuel dump that looked like a comet...

ergo no one cares what or why it was launched


[edit on 12-12-2007 by zorgon]



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 03:14 AM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


All good cheer, Z!

Hip Hip, Cheerio and what what! (nudge, nudge, wink, wink and all that!)

'tis the season...give and gift, live and ... let gifts come. Come one, come all!!!!

Stay safe and Happy for the Holidays...in fact, stay safe and Happy for every day, blast it! Bah! Humbug!

In a more serious (Sirius?) tone...keep digging, bring up the good stuff. Just know, you can take a break this time of year.

Put your feet up, watch a few DVDs...enjoy. I think it's time we all just relax. I know I will.........

Cheers.



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 10:45 AM
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No one here is going to argue that they don't launch "secret" satellites, there are dozens of them up there. But pointing to that as evidence of the tremendous amount of support your proposed manned secret space force would require is not going to do you much good and you understand why.

Case in point, why didn't they launch this from one of your super secret launch sites?



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 11:33 AM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


zorgon,
Is this a whole thread on seeing the secret launch dump fuel?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

BP



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by Enthralled Fan
I would like to know how all the "hundreds of secret space flights each year" are financed?
Thanks


By the 3.5 TRILLION dollars missing from the Pentagon coffers that was revealed on Sept 1oth... the day before you know what... If you want the links U2U me...

Though the topic of this thread is kind open and this IS related

Just google where in the Pentagon the investigators and the records were housed




Originally posted by weedwhacker
Put your feet up, watch a few DVDs...enjoy.


I just did "Thunderbolts of the Gods" very 'illuminating'



posted on Dec, 12 2007 @ 09:18 PM
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Originally posted by PokeyJoe
One question though, if I really did know something like that existed, why would I come on here and waste my time at all.....to spread disinformation?


Hmmm so far I have not seen you post disinfo... Lets review a few points...

You pointed me to JWICS, confirmed what I said about SIPRNET


You made this statement..
"Im not saying that what you are talking about doesn't exist, but the things you are posting on here do not illustrate that,"

Seems about right... Your not denying it just telling me I haven't posted any satisfying proof... yet


I do see one small inconsistancy though...
"and noone I know who wears these wings has ever been to space."

Which you cleared up now...
"I did recently meet on real life astronaut, and she was wearing the space wings...."



If you have any further questions about the networks and security I will answer as well as I am able....so far as to not get myself into trouble.


Well I don't think I have any other questions relating to the networks and security at the moment... and I surely would not want to get you in trouble... I might have other questions about Space Command in the future if that's okay...



Im not sure if there is anything above that, but JWICS deals with Top Secret....


There is... I mentioned it before... the "Global" I suppose that would make it "Above Top Secret"

Global Information Grid (GIG)
www.nsa.gov...




Like I said earlier, I have been working strictly in AFSPC my whole AF career


Yes and I have taken you at your word on that...
Although your appearance right after I mention SIPRNET is extremely coincidental...





[edit on 12-12-2007 by zorgon]



posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 11:04 AM
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I have never heard anything about the "global" that you talk about. The only global that I know is the Global Address Book on my Outlook that lets me look up peoples email addresses.

I dont think that the NSA page you linked to is talking about the global network or whatever it is. The link is talking about having a real time way to provide information to and from the battlefield and for people who support that. I dont think that is an "above top secret" network in the same vein as SIPR and JWICS. This seems to be a running theme with things that you post. You have a theory or idea or something, and then find something with the same word in it on a governement website, so that must be it.

I guess I made a mistake talking about the Space Wings thing....Im human, it does happen every once and a blue moon.

Oh, and as far as me posting right after you mentioned the SIPRnet or whatever, I dunno....I browse this site everyday. I cant even get to ATS on the SIPRNET, nor would I even try.

No offense, but I think that you think you are a lot more informed than you really are.....but hell, maybe I dont know anything either.



posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 12:14 PM
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It certainly seems to me this Information Assurance system is in place to protect the warfighter info that different agencies need to have.

Here is their description:

IA Defense-in-Depth Implementation



To ensure a consistent "Defense-in-Depth" implementation across component systems of the GIG, IA architectural concepts must ultimately be translated into specific architecture guidance, IA standards and protocols, technical requirements, and policy. This applies to existing, emerging, and future system development efforts such as the Joint Tactical Radio System (JTRS), Warfighter Information Network-Tactical (WIN-T), GIG Bandwidth Expansion (GIG-BE), Intelligence Community System for Information Sharing (ICSIS), Transformational Communications (TC), and other programs supporting the GIG vision.


More on this here: www.nsa.gov...



posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 12:26 PM
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Originally posted by PokeyJoe You have a theory or idea or something, and then find something with the same word in it on a governement website, so that must be it.


Hmmm interesting comment... so if I find something on a government website that 'appears' to back my 'theory' its not valid to mention it?



No offense, but I think that you think you are a lot more informed than you really are.....but hell, maybe I dont know anything either.


Well I think I know that I am more informed than most, but as has been mentioned to me "on a scale of 1 to 100 you may be at 2.5" John thinks its more like 1.5



posted on Dec, 13 2007 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts
No one here is going to argue that they don't launch "secret" satellites, there are dozens of them up there. But pointing to that as evidence of the tremendous amount of support your proposed manned secret space force would require is not going to do you much good and you understand why.


Certainly... and as soon as I get the data on the rest you will be the first to know.. Actually we have some... I think though a new thread would be best...

Its certainly halfway there... the not so secret secret astronauts


Coming soon to a thread near here...



Case in point, why didn't they launch this from one of your super secret launch sites?


There was no need to as you say no one doubts (nor cares much) about secret satellites or what's on those launches they see...



posted on Dec, 17 2007 @ 02:32 PM
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Quick summary of this page:

a) Zorgon failed to provide any evidence of launches carried out routinely from Melville Island, Australia

b) a picture of fuel dump from a rocket has nothing to do with the alleged secrete space station supposedly launched (not) from Melville

Zero substance so far, Zorgon.




[edit on 17-12-2007 by buddhasystem]



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