America and the Middle East.

As much as I'd hate for bombings or outright war to break out, I do think there is something bigger going on than just stopping Iran from developing nuclear weapons.

I believe America knows the situation is dire as far as resources go. It consumes more (name natural resource here) than any country on the planet and in order to grow, it must consume more and more each year. But just like America, China, Russia and other developing nations are also on the same merry-go-round.

I think the whole issue of Iran developing nuclear weapons is an excuse, and the real issue is future economic dominance, of which the U.S has held all the aces for many years. Times are changing and America is faced with some hard choices about its future. The golden years of abundant resources are over, and with it the vast amounts of monetary gain to be had.

To whom ever controls the remaining resources will in essence control future growth, not only of their own country, but more importantly, other competitive countries.
This is the real reason America is flexing is muscles abroad. In order to maintain its dominance, it must control firstly its own growth, and most importantly the growth of other nations.

War is not about another country having nuclear weapons - War is about power.
There are many "undesirable" nations whom possess nuclear weapons. North Korea to name one. Yet North Korea (at the present) doesn't possess any real threat to Americas financial power hold. The Middle East is where the money is, as it holds the last remaining black pools of power.

Iran's leaders, like all leaders, will sing a popular tune if it meets the needs of the people. This is why they make comments like turning Israel to glass, or whatever it takes to please the masses. It doesn't mean they intend to actually nuke Israel at all, its politics, nothing more. Popularity is everything in politics.

Iran know full well what the real issue is, and they must build with haste to secure nuclear weapons for their own survival. Their sovereignty as a nation is at stake if they fail.
The wake up call for them was Iraq. Just over the border, they watched as America moved in without any resistance from conventional weaponry. Had Iraq had nuclear weapons, maybe the invasion would not have occurred at all. Iran is left with little choice if it wants to remain independent, a sovereign nation unto itself, with its own beliefs and political systems.

The choices for America are just as brutal. In order to grow it must consume, and as fate would have it, the race is on for its own economic survival.
We the people will be fed a whole bunch of tasty treats as the reasons why it is necessary to overthrow leaders and conquer nations. But at the end of the day its about wealth/power.

Its really hard not to be suckered in by media reports .... "he said this" - "he said that" - "they have weapons of mass destruction pointed at us and our allies"
Its even harder when attacked (real or not) to ignore the lies and see what are the real issues when it comes to war.

reply to post by Burginthorn


Hello Burginthorn,
You are so right with your way of thinking what the future has in store for America.

For along time now, 20 yrs, I have been living in Egypt and up until the Iraq war I enjoyed a true life fileed with prestiege and the Egyptians really made me fill as special as a man can be with respect and basically the higher step of authority.

I have been living and working for many years starting way back in the 1984 because of of the Camp David Accords, They received 1.22 bil a year and Isreal received 1.26 bil and everyone was happy.

I went under the American corporations military defense programs for modernizing Egypts weapons programs and it was an honor to be treated with such descent respect it was hard to give up.

I started working in the reverse engineeriing of their foreign weapons systems. We basically had to analized each system and come up with a way as to develop systems to combat them, counter tactics and in around about way it was considered Skunkworks projects but this was never mentioned, you just knew it. We served for Defense Corps and I was able to work into three different projects throughout my years, because of my specialty experiences, They made me feel like a king for my efforts.

Things changed after the Iraq war and I found myself feeling like a bastard stepchild and even my American companies made a separation with me, now they dont give me the time of day, I was dedicated to the projects. In fact one of the leading fortune 500 corp would not be there if it wasnt for me doing what I did in the first place for them as a favor.

Now I feel as though I have been black listed and in reality I did nothing wrong, oh well.

I returned recently from that land after all these years and find myself as like an outcast here in America which I dont deserve but there is nothing I can do about it, maybe apply as a bag boy at a grocery store.

Well to get back to the story, Egypt which is a friend to America will be going through real sh-- in the near future, why?

Camp David accords was set up to make peace with Isreal and for over 30 yrs we have paid to better the Egyptians, but one of the prerequisits for Egypt is to set up a true Democracy, We now are watching Iraq in action and we know the only way of solving this violence will be to split the waring factions by partitioning Iraq 3 ways, you'll see.

Now Egypt has a very old President Mubarak whom has done great things for Egypt with American money but if he sets up a true democratic system then the Moslem Brotherhood will take over and they will be the moral majority, who do you think is in control of the brotherhood, IRAN.

So all we are doing in Iraq is just going to go down the drain and then when Egypt has to set up Democracy because of all of our insistance over the past 30 years, then what do we do dealing with Iran for everything. The elite will have to excommunicate and leave the country and so what happens to our friends the Egyptians, the shaft. We will be out.

Then Isreal will really have only one friend in the land Turkey who wants to be in the EU Community, bummer if they are not excepted, what then for the US and even Europe. Continues troubles in all those lands, mass anarchy will take place and for sure WW3 there is no avoidance. Now if Pres Mubarak is allowed to place his Son in power then we and Europe will stand a chance to stay in the area, but this is not Democracy this is Dictatorship, right.

America pushed democracy down all of their throahts for so many years and has paid for it dearly in all of those countries of the region just to end up being a waste of tax payers money for the past 30 years, I wonder how much we have spent for this as well as our hero Soldiers serving all over the Middle east and the other areas, what now and the future
gwhint

Might be a valid opinion, except for some pesky facts... America hasnt taken any land or controlling interest in the Middle East or anywhere else that America has fought a War. There are Oceans of Oil under and around land America already owns, and plenty of resources, no need to "take over" anywhere else and America HASNT.... If you think Irans president is blowing smoke to win a "Popularity Contest" among his people , and not stateing his true intentions of seeing Isreal "Wiped off the Map" or the " Death of America", You are delusional.

I do not know about this 'wipe off the map' speech. Apparantly he did not say it, but that is the way they talk, in apocalyptic religious rhetoric when talking about an adversary. It is like an american saying 'i will kick your ass'. If they both did exactly as they said there would not be much of a world left , and of any survivors, all would have bruised asses.

It is a good post , star and a flag. I think USA is unusual in that it attempts to extend empire under a pretext of humanitarism and altruism, free trade and spreading democracy. I think this is mainly to anaesthesize the US public. It is course after the same thing every other empire before it have aspired to, the gain of power wealth and resources .

It could be that the American liberals in the 90's unwittingly aided empire under concealment of altruism by advocating such things as the intervention in Bosnia and Kosovo to halt ethnic cleansing without any international sanction, then this policy later hijacked and extended by the bush administration.







[edit on 1-12-2007 by Gun Totin Gerbil]

Hey Guntotin, it's maybe alittle different when a common person say's " I'll kick your azz" and a president of a country says he wants your DEATH??? Ya Think??? ...Man the "Hate America First Cult" is going to drive me from this site....

reply to post by Burginthorn


well written..

The wake up call for them was Iraq. Just over the border, they watched as America moved in without any resistance from conventional weaponry.

Very true.

The choices for America are just as brutal. In order to grow it must consume, and as fate would have it, the race is on for its own economic survival.

I don't think the USA will crash and burn as easy as some people presume. We have many allies and economic ties. What we need to do is get a handle of the border and totally rework the education system (which doesn't make any sense). We are done with our growth spurt. We need to hone our population, not grow it.

reply to post by Burginthorn


You talk current history, go back to the 1920,s thru the 1950's when colonies were colonies The UK, France, Spain, Etc. Than oil was found.

reply to post by Gun Totin Gerbil


The Lesson of WWII has not been learned , Some say Total 60 Million+ and yes some Millions OF one race or the Other. They Also say That the germans kept good records, ON their IBM's True, do your HOMEWORK, they assigned numbers to the types of deaths.