Stop the M.A.D.D.ness!!!

That's a great idea Insite. Maybe MADD could lobby for just such legislation. If anyone thinks that can't be done just look at what the anti- tobacco lobby has done. Try to have a smoke in a public building.

Originally posted by RANT
That would be IDEAL for you and I, but not MADD or the government, both of which rely on DUI arrests for funding. It's a sad cycle. The cops COULD do that, but don't. They wait down the street. Actually, I've heard they can arrest you walking to your car if your keys are in your hand and you are intoxicated. So in this pro-prosecution environment, even your example would not work. It's all about money now. They don't want to stop drunk driving; they want to PUNISH it.

You beat me to it.

In my area, the write a chalk line on all of the tires in the parking lots of bars and then wait down the road and end up following those cars until they have the slightest reason to pull them over (or just make up one). I know people that have been caught this way.

There are plenty of things that make people's reaction time slower.

Cell phones

Eating

Putting on Makeup

Drugs -duh and I know there are laws on that

Being tired

Stress

Anger

I got a ticket cause I blew a 1.5 on the angerometer

After all these years of education and enforcement and there is still 17,000 drunk driving related fatalities? No wonder I know so many people who's families have been dropped to their knees over the death of a child or spouse because of a drunk driver.

I have a news flash for you, the war on stupidity isn't over. And it'll never be won, either. You'll never get the drunk driver crowd to care more about your children's lives than their selfish desire to get drunk at the bar and then hurl 2 tons of machinery down the narrow slab of asphalt.

good, just one more group of pissed of suburban women trying to "save the world"

im not sure if anyone mentioned this yet or not, but accidents occuring due to intoxication are much less frequent in countries with lower alchohol drinking ages. its because you know what alchohol is going to do to your body and mind and are used to it before you start driving. most kids that wait till its legal go out on their 21st birthday and totally piss their lives away because they have no idea how much they can actually take. not im not suggesting we replace milk and ovaltine with jack daniels, but its a pretty funny thought huh?

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
After all these years of education and enforcement and there is still 17,000 drunk driving related fatalities? No wonder I know so many people who's families have been dropped to their knees over the death of a child or spouse because of a drunk driver.

I have a news flash for you, the war on stupidity isn't over. And it'll never be won, either. You'll never get the drunk driver crowd to care more about your children's lives than their selfish desire to get drunk at the bar and then hurl 2 tons of machinery down the narrow slab of asphalt.

Entirely my point TC. What could be done with vigilent prosecution was done 10 years ago when they got the death rate down 43%. The one's who commit violent drinking and driving crimes now are truly CRIMINALS and can be prosecuted for murder as such. The repeat offenders are truly sociopaths and can be prosecuted as such. The laws in place are tough and uniformly punitive. You can't buy your way out. You can't avoid rehabilitation. And I'm not talking about people who wreck now. I'm talking about the millions of road block 0.9's out there that MADD targets as POTENTIAL killers.

Remember innoncent until proven guilty? Now you're guilty before committing the crime. Again though, no one in this thread appears to me to be pro-drunk driving, or even for repealing any of the 2,300 laws MADD has gotten passed.

I, along with some others, am just saying ENOUGH already. You're 100% correct in that you'll never STOP drunk driving, short of prohibition. I'm not willing to wait and bring this needed opposition to MADD up when they stump for prohibiton. I think a 0.5 BAC or increased beer taxes is too far. I don't agree in "lifetime" DUI's or special markings (as Bob88 pointed out) where you have to carry a special plate or license for life just because you hit a road block in youth. People talk about facism alot on this board where it doesn't exist.

MADD supported drunk driving uber prosecution is getting damn close.

[Edited on 6-2-2004 by RANT]

You think it would be a good idea to stick a cop by all the bars and check the drivers before they enter thier cars???? are you insane???? you have any idea how much money and man power that take??? You know how many bars are in my area compared to the amount of police????? personaly,I prefer the police to be looking for criminals not doing sobriety check points...its an insult and a waste of time.People are such scared little sheep..needing somebody to protect them at all costs regargless of any damage it does to those who are innocent.If you kill somebody if your drinking and driving..guess what..your gonna get charged with a crime so all this extra stuff is pure garbage and insulting to the american way of life.If This m.a.d.d. bs is doing about as much good as the war on drugs..save a few...hurt millions!![not to mention all your rights being stripped away by "scared little sheep"]

[Edited on 6-2-2004 by McGotti]

Here's your chance to do something about it. Will you just continue to complain ineffectually until it's you or a loved one behind bars for a year or more after violating some technicality post road block, or are you willing to take a stand? I wrote tha ACLU and will continue to do so. Write them yourself at aclu.org or chose your own avenue to fight back for the CONSTITUTION.

If you disagree, such is your right. I suggest you send MORE money to MADD.

Example letter for the brave of heart...

Attention ACLU:

Please give some thoughtful consideration to a growing and powerful lobbying organization in America that has recently renewed it's mandate for ever increasing vigilance against our beloved Constitution: Mothers Against Drunk Drivers (MADD).

The almost entirely UNCHALLENGED organiztion brags partial responsibility for 2,300 new laws over the past two decades that many have argued violate the rights of citizens to such invasions of PRIVACY and DUE PROCESS. However, you should know that a NEW 8 point plan issued by MADD indicates they aren't done yet with an intention to lower the BAC limit for some to 0.5, to monitor judges, to increase beer taxes and to lobby for increased road blocks. www.madd.com...

Please rise to the challenge, unpopular as it may be, to offer some sanity of balance to this lobbying powerhourse. I include a recent citizen alert to some of MADD's intentions as well as a short history of some of their more impactful contributions to our judicial system.

Thank you for your attention. I look forward to hearing from you on this issue.
###

(attachment)

Well? Who's with me?

Hold on there, on the check points, now. They are unconstitutional and violate the basic idea of a peace officer not making contact without reasonable suspicion of a crime being commited. Travelling on the road at 2300hrs is not reasonable suspicion. I don't care if they stop every fifth car, every car or whatever, they are crossing the line.
Look, a drunk can't help but drive like a drunk. I used to look forward to 2nd and 3rd shift weekends, it was kind of like hunting. There's no need of check points if the cops would be more concerned about things besides the stupid radar.

MADD has done alot of good in increasing the awareness and educational programs for the young. While I'm no big fan of piles and piles of laws, I am a fan of education and awareness, and they have helped in changing the old mindset of looking the other way when Otis drove through town.

prohibition would cause more gangs and more violence just like the drug war has. And what would happen when bars go out of business?
Is this really war on small business?
Or do increased roadblocks and bar closing amount to more travel restriction?

of course the money is reason enough in itself. Has anyone started a petition yet?

We're not looking to prohibit alcohol, but to find a way to cut down on the drunk drivers. Better than roadblocks was an idea that Insite had. Check the last post on one page 1.

Originally posted by insite

Originally posted by intrepid
I understand what you are saying, and no you can't totally stop foolish people from doing it. But do all you can. Here's an idea, put a cop at the exit to a bar. If you blow over they tell you to park it and find another way home. Now that would stop a lot, but does nothing for someone drinking at home, however it would be a BIG improvement.

Intrepid that's an excellent idea. I'm already brainstorming some additions to it. How 'bout we let the bouncers do it. They're already standing there, already being paid. And if they let anyone who's driving out, when that person is stopped for a high BAC then they can fine the bar, like how liquor stores get fined for selling to minors.

Ya i addressed this idea....with the statement.."ARE YOU INSANE???!!!"

Do you live in a rural area???or maybe a large city??? putting a cop outside bars to check BAC's of drivers before they enter their car sounds good but is 100% impossible!It would take the same amount of money that this "war on terrorism" is costing..BILLIONS!.. there are probably 6 -20 bars in a 5 miles radiuos around my location...put a cop there all night every night or maybe just friday and saturday and i would say rapists robbers and car thieves will have a lot better chance of getting away since all the police are protecting america by sitting outside bars all night looking for a couple drunks....Im not trying to be rude at all but that idea is simply impossible and not an option.

Anybody wanna join me in D.A.M.M? Drunks Against Mad Mothers.

Gotti, I'll let you pick this one. Would you rather spend money fighting a war half way around the world or save people from drunk drivers? I suggest you read the whole thread.

Originally posted by McGotti

Originally posted by insite
Intrepid that's an excellent idea. I'm already brainstorming some additions to it. How 'bout we let the bouncers do it. They're already standing there, already being paid. And if they let anyone who's driving out, when that person is stopped for a high BAC then they can fine the bar, like how liquor stores get fined for selling to minors.

Ya i addressed this idea....with the statement.."ARE YOU INSANE???!!!"

Do you live in a rural area???or maybe a large city??? putting a cop outside bars to check BAC's of drivers before they enter their car sounds good but is 100% impossible!It would take the same amount of money that this "war on terrorism" is costing..BILLIONS!.. there are probably 6 -20 bars in a 5 miles radiuos around my location...put a cop there all night every night or maybe just friday and saturday and i would say rapists robbers and car thieves will have a lot better chance of getting away since all the police are protecting america by sitting outside bars all night looking for a couple drunks....Im not trying to be rude at all but that idea is simply impossible and not an option.

Here in State College, Pennsylvania we have 200 bars in a town of 70,000. Hired, at each of those 200+ bars are at least two bouncers. What are the bouncers doing except checking ID? They may as well be breathilizing people who plan on driving home and calling them cabs if they don't pass.

I hear hooked on phonics is great at combatting illiteracy, READ.

lol thx for the suggestion but I already read the whole thread thx...I like how you give me 2 whole choices thx buddy but actually both are insane wastes of money and that money could be spent making peoples lives better...anything besides wars,drugs wars,and wars on drunk drivers...how about we stop spending all the money on wars??? maybe then people would stop drinking so much huh?? a little happiness goes a long way towards stopping self destrutive behaviour..huh?? make any sense to anyone?? how bout people like you stop imposing your unconstitutional laws upon good americans..

ok now a choice for you....be a real american..be brave..stand up for what america is supposed to be!!!! road blocks and random searches are ..well actaully should be illegal..I want to protect my children aswell,thats why im against these groups pushing their selfish agenda upon my self and other innocent americans..road blocks and sobriety checks sound more like nazi germany...not the "land of the free..home of the brave" america!



[Edited on 6-2-2004 by McGotti]

Don't forget Sesame Street. So are you saying you are giving up on helping society, or are you just at school and you don't want to miss your time to party?

Originally posted by insite

Originally posted by McGotti

Originally posted by insite
Intrepid that's an excellent idea. I'm already brainstorming some additions to it. How 'bout we let the bouncers do it. They're already standing there, already being paid. And if they let anyone who's driving out, when that person is stopped for a high BAC then they can fine the bar, like how liquor stores get fined for selling to minors.

Ya i addressed this idea....with the statement.."ARE YOU INSANE???!!!"

Do you live in a rural area???or maybe a large city??? putting a cop outside bars to check BAC's of drivers before they enter their car sounds good but is 100% impossible!It would take the same amount of money that this "war on terrorism" is costing..BILLIONS!.. there are probably 6 -20 bars in a 5 miles radiuos around my location...put a cop there all night every night or maybe just friday and saturday and i would say rapists robbers and car thieves will have a lot better chance of getting away since all the police are protecting america by sitting outside bars all night looking for a couple drunks....Im not trying to be rude at all but that idea is simply impossible and not an option.

Here in State College, Pennsylvania we have 200 bars in a town of 70,000. Hired, at each of those 200+ bars are at least two bouncers. What are the bouncers doing except checking ID? They may as well be breathilizing people who plan on driving home and calling them cabs if they don't pass.

I hear hooked on phonics is great at combatting illiteracy, READ.

ya nice with the insults..figures you need to insult because your points are ridiculous !

Bouncers have no authority!!!!!!!!!! they cant stop anybody from doing anything!! unless they are in thier building and still they can get their ass sued off for crossing the line which happens alot. you realy want bouncers with the authority to tell you whether or not you can use your vehicle..oh please...what next..give them some arrest powers aswell..why not let them arrest speeders and give them hand guns aswell!! yeah.. america home of the free!!!

[Edited on 6-2-2004 by McGotti]

Intrepid and I were just trying to reach a compromise. Instead of wasting money paying cops to set up roadblocks and random searches, you get someone who is already being paid at a private establishment to do the checking.

*EDIT: Yeah calling someone insane is the most gracious of compliments.

[Edited on 2-6-2004 by insite]

Gotti, I didn't insult you in any way with the exeption of actually making you think. Sorry to take you away from the frat party. But those of us that came before you, if you happen to run over one of my kids, don't wait for trial.