It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Bible-ish Question: How many "fallen angels"...

page: 1
2
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Nov, 27 2007 @ 08:38 PM
link   
Is there any record or speculative data concerning just how many "sons of god" fell victim to the charms of the "daughters of men". Or decided to oppose "God" for other reasons? How about the unholy hybrid offspring, the "Nephilim"? I know they probably didn't participate in the census, being half-demon giants and all, but has there ever been speculation on the actual numbers. And please don't just say "legions" or "many"




posted on Nov, 27 2007 @ 09:49 PM
link   
reply to post by Teratoma
 


The believe the bible says a third of the angels fell. As far as I know the exact number is not known .


While the Scriptures give no definite figures, we are told that the number of angels is very great (Daniel 7:10; Matthew 26:53; Hebrews 12:22). It appears that all angels were created at one time. No new angels are being added to the number. Angels are not subject to death or any form of extinction; therefore they do not decrease in number.It seems reasonable to conclude that there are at least as many spirit beings in existence as there will have been human beings in all their history on earth.Author: Dr. Paul Eymann.

source

[edit on 27-11-2007 by highfreq]



posted on Nov, 27 2007 @ 11:18 PM
link   
I know you are looking for a precise answer to this question and while there isn't one any of us could conceivably give you, perhaps this will give you a bit of insight on the scope of it. According to the Talmud, that each and every blade of grass has its own angel telling it to grow, and this is presumably after the third were kicked out of heaven.



posted on Nov, 27 2007 @ 11:23 PM
link   
I'd ask a really studied Kabbalist about it, but I don't have any guarantee what he or she would tell you would be true.



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 01:11 AM
link   
In the books attributed to Enoch, which can be found all over the net - he says the number is 200.

These are the "Watchers."



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 01:36 AM
link   
In regards to the nephilim, there were like 200 angels who descended and took wives who begot the nephilim. Source: book of enoch, the fall of the watchers.



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 08:58 AM
link   
And you can scratch a few dozen off of that 200. they are hard to kill but its been done every now and then



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 01:40 PM
link   
I know no one will be able to provide a definite answer. I'm just curious about numbers or claims that may have turned up in different sources, speculation, etc.

So, 200 couldn't control themselves and had to swoop down on our chicks. Can we assume that was the only time an "angel" ever defected? (Other than the big "S") Have there been any before or since?

Every blade of grass? I realize this is metaphoric, but if a 3rd of that number was evil demonic entities, I think we'd be seeing a WHOLE LOT more paranormal activity. Just my opinion.

And they can be killed? By humans I'm assuming. Care to elaborate?



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 02:43 PM
link   
The big "S" could possibly be Satanael who was considered the Prince of the Watchers/Grigori. The name is found in the Slavonic Book of Enoch. In a different version of Enoch, the name is given as Semjaza.

Personally, I don't know what to make of these Angels leaving their first estate. Did they just lust and not love? In all my readings I haven't ran across any love stories that try to justify their actions.

And it could have been just a test. Eve and then Adam were tested. Look at the mess Sarah caused the world. Instead of waiting on the Lord to come through - she pushed her servant on her husband, produced a son, then became jelous of the child when she bore her own son. And to this day the world suffers from her decisions.

Everything is a test and very few have the patience of a Saint to leave everything up to him.



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 04:27 PM
link   
reply to post by Teratoma
 


Assuming the Satanic Rebellion theory is correct (and it may well not be, there are more than a few well-renowned theologians who stake their careers on a belief that Satan is not a fallen angel and never has been), Satan led a third of the angels in rebellion against God, this third lost, was expelled from heaven, and became demons.

[edit on 28-11-2007 by Jim_Kraken]



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 05:07 PM
link   

Originally posted by Jim_Kraken
reply to post by Teratoma
 

...Satan lead a third of the angels in rebellion against God, this third lost, was expelled from heaven, and became demons.


My reason for asking has less to do with seeking "truth" than just trying to find out what theories are out there. I'm interested in what the various earthly faiths think about the subject. I don't know what the data could be used for, but something has introduced this question to my consciousness, so I ask.

I've heard other theories about Satan's origins as well, can you paraphrase a few of them, or point me in the right direction?

[edit on 11/28/2007 by Teratoma]



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 08:35 PM
link   
reply to post by Teratoma
 


They can be killed if they make the mistake of manifesting here in the flesh because a well trained human can change reality itself and break the rules in this world to kill them. when god created us in his image he gave us the same powers he has to a lesser degree its just that they run on belief so its very hard to undo the conditioning by the time people find out about it. meditation is one way people can directly remove the crap from their minds but its a slow process for many. also i believe it wasn't lusting after our women that was the problem it was the crossbreeding that offended god



posted on Nov, 28 2007 @ 08:48 PM
link   
Materializing in the flesh? I couldn't tell you where, but isn't there a scripture that explains that after the flood, God forbade the fallen angels to ever take a human form? This fits into a theory of mine, but I'm saving that for another thread. It has to do with the 'fallen angels' finding a way to circumvent that law. It sounds like you believe they've successfully done so already. Your thoughts?



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 01:17 AM
link   
for every aggressive crazed possession theres a dozen more calm smart ones that just blend right in. i hate to say this but it appears from recent studies that the story of the apple and the tree is used to program a guilt complex into people and to cover up the truth. it seems god gave the earth over to adam and then satan tricked adam into giving the earth over to him for some 'forbidden knowledge' which means our creator simply isn't helping us because he has chosen to respect his own rules


EDIT you know whats funny? i was realized i was a man of science before i decided to uncover the secrets of this world and the mere scientific FACTS i discovered on my way make it impossible to ignore that theres alot of truth to the bible even if it turns out angels were simply aliens that 'came from the heavens'. i recently discovered why symbols in magic work (symbols are used in the underlying levels of all things to shape energy, see sacred geometry) so i wouldn't be surprised if theres a logical reason for all occult things and we simply don't understand much of it as a species yet

[edit on 29-11-2007 by HuntaXX]



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 09:19 AM
link   

Originally posted by Teratoma
Is there any record or speculative data concerning just how many "sons of god" fell victim to the charms of the "daughters of men". Or decided to oppose "God" for other reasons? How about the unholy hybrid offspring, the "Nephilim"? I know they probably didn't participate in the census, being half-demon giants and all, but has there ever been speculation on the actual numbers. And please don't just say "legions" or "many"


According to the Book of Enoch, there were 200 of these fallen angels.

See "Fallen Angels and the Origin of Evil" by Elizabeth Claire Prophet.



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 11:07 AM
link   

Originally posted by sir_chancealot

According to the Book of Enoch, there were 200 of these fallen angels.

See "Fallen Angels and the Origin of Evil" by Elizabeth Claire Prophet.


Please don't take this as being confrontational, but did you read the rest of the thread? I only ask because there are two other posts, back to back and almost a half hour apart that contain that info. This thread isn't even over a page long yet but it looks like all you did was read the first post and hit reply.

I do appreciate your input, thanks for the reference.

So, the consensus seems to be that a third of the angels rebelled, and that was 200. I can do math, so that means that there were 600 angels in heaven before?

Any speculation as to just how busy those Watchers got? How many Nephilim were born? Did they have "souls"?



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 11:12 AM
link   
all this talk about 200 reminded me of something you may find interesting. numbers seem to be used as a secret code for the bible to tell informed people 'in the loop' what parts are real and which parts have been edited



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 11:35 AM
link   
That is interesting. You bring up a lot of points and I'm rather inclined to agree with your stance on most of what you've said. I want to share some theories I have that you might find interesting, but I'd like a little more feedback on this subject first. My main theory involves succubi/incubi, the "greys" - and circumventing the divine law of 'materialization'. I suppose I'll post another thread about it soon, but I was hoping to hear more on this first.



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 08:32 PM
link   
Sounds interesting. maybe send me a U2U when you have the time to share it
im always happy to hear new theories no matter how out there and share any information i may have with honest people looking for the truth.



posted on Nov, 29 2007 @ 10:45 PM
link   
I am no biblical scholar but weren't there two groups of angels who fell? First there were the angels who fell with Satan. Satan tricks Adam and Eve, etc... years go by. Then the Nephilim began taking wives of the daughters of man further down the road.

I forgot who asked if there were ever any other defectors. I vaguely recall reading that Gabriel was once banished, but after 28 days was allowed back in. If I remember right, he didn't carry out one of gods orders to the t.

As far as offspring between the nephilim and the humans, I would imagine their were plenty of them. After all, wasn't Noah and his family spared because they were pure? Pure of untainted genes perhaps?




top topics



 
2
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join