[There originally was a $100 reward for the winner of this challenge, but I was told it was against the TAC here at ATS, I then offered all my ATS
point to the winner, I haven’t heard back if this could be done or not but, If at all possible they are all on the line.]
Can anyone here who can show that the texts concerning ancient ‘gods’ actually say the things ‘Zeitgeist The
’ claims that they do.
All you have to do is take the various claims (that I will list below) concerning the similarities of Christ and other ancient gods that Zeitgeist
makes, match them up to the text where it is claimed, and provide the specific quote and/or a link to the source, for example:
Claim made by Zeitgeist:
Horus was born on December 25th.
- Here you might put the title of the text or glyph that is mentioned, and the chapter and verse if applicable.
- Here quote what is literally said or why it is implied.
- Here you would provide a link to it, if applicable.
Here is a link to a good website where you can find copies of many of the ancient texts where some of these claims would be found.
You could, of course, also use texts any other place you find them, as long as they can be
There are only two reasonable ground rules.
Obviously, you would want to make sure the texts you quote from are valid, in that they are reasonably demonstrable to have been written before the
time of Christ, only because the attempt by Zeitgeist is to show that the biblical story was ‘borrowed’ from earlier myths. However, obviously,
in the case of the texts concerning Mithras who was said to live after Jesus, they would be written after 33(35)CE.
The other ground rule is the case of subjectivity. For instance, with a claim like “virgin birth,” it can be subjective to how one views the
events. In the case of Horus, for example, one would argue that the artificial phallus created by Isis in the consummation of Horus would constitute
a virgin birth. I will reluctantly concede that type of subjective argument to you. However, for example, if the god in question is said to be not
the first product of the union of his parents then it would be, by definition, not a virgin birth unless you can otherwise show some loophole being
overlooked. Basically, what I’m saying is I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt, as long as you’re not trying to make 2+2=97.
The makers of Zeitgeist offer a list of sources for the claims they make, but they fail to list a single original text, besides the Bible, in defense
of them. So, it probably wont help you much, but it is available here
. As you can see, Zeitgeist
chooses, instead, to quote modern writers, of which the primary one seems to be Gerald Massey
and then, of course, Acharya S.
Acharya is also thanked
being the ‘consultant’ for this section of the movie. You may consider contacting her
in hopes that
she may point you to where she attained the information she provided to Zeitgeist. Her books are notoriously absent of many references to her claims,
so you may have to contact her directly to find out.
Obviously, I am doing this because I am confident, after my own study, that it cannot be done, but I am very willing to pay up, and I’m sure that
the members of this forum will be able to see if the person who attempts this challenge has succeeded or not. I will depend on them (you) to help
determine if someone does do it.
The following are the claims of Zeitgeist word for word:
Horus was born on December 25th
Born of the virgin
His birth was accompanied by a star in the east
Three kings followed to locate and adorn the new-born savior
At the age of 12, he was a prodigal child teacher
And at the age of 30, he was baptized and thus began his ministry
Horus had 12 disciples
Performed miracles such as healing the sick and walking on water
Horus was known by many gestural names such as The Truth, The Light, God's Anointed Son, The Good Shepherd, The Lamb of God,
After being betrayed by Typhon,
Horus was crucified,
Buried for 3 days and
Born of the virgin
On December 25th,
Placed in a tomb
And after 3 days, was resurrected.
Born of the virgin
With a star in the east signaling his coming
Performed miracles with his disciples
And upon his death was resurrected.
Born of a virgin
On December 25th
He had 12 disciples
And performed miracles
And upon his death was buried for 3 days
And thus resurrected
He was also referred to as "The Truth," "The Light"
Interestingly, the sacred day of worship of Mithra was Sunday.
Born on December 25th (I just wanted to see someone try this one)
Let me be very clear, I’m not looking for what people SAY it says in the ancient literature. There is an abundance of that available. I want to
know where these people are getting their information because I can find no historical record of these claims myself.
But, more importantly I hope you will find that this “Christ-myther” scenario is the exact dogma of the ancient mystery schools and many secret
societies – you know, the groups more or less behind the problems in parts 2
of Zeitgeist. They seem to encourage the belief system Zeitgeist is pushing, even though its primarily based on
initiated writers like Plutarch
and Massey and NOT on the actual writings or records of historical
Egypt or any other.
To put it simply, the same groups trying to control us are also shoving their dogma down our throats and telling us the exact opposite of what is
happening, i.e that the ‘bad guys’ are trying to make us be Christians in order to control the population. Then, they point to the Catholic
church as some kind of supposed representative of Christianity, even though they are obviously just a continuation of the pantheistic Roman empire,
and the entity that has killed the most people who simply believed in Jesus. In addition, we don’t seem to be applying the evaluation processes to
this information that we would to similar info
[edit on 27-11-2007 by Amenti]