i wonder why

i wonder why we dont see the miracles and magic the bible talks about.
like angels, demons, talking trees, the sea cut in half, the dead of innocent children at the hands of god, super pleague,and of course magical people like jesus. [+ any other miracle and magic the bible talks about]

any christians, or whatever have a good explanation>?



[edit on 27-11-2007 by Drzava]

[edit on 27-11-2007 by Drzava]

It sure would make believing in God a lot easier wouldn't it?

Because you aren't looking in the right places. read here about the devil making a personal appearance. enjoy!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by jedimiller


interessting, thx for the explanation
but satan is an very old excuse, used by every christian.
do u have any more beleivevable explanations?

U HAVE TO UNDERSTAND BEHIND THE LOGIC behind the satan explanation.
if i dont beleive in god, then i dont beleive in satan, that makes satan an useless explanation.



[edit on 27-11-2007 by Drzava]

reply to post by Drzava


When Christ came, many asked Him for miracles. They sought a sign from Him, but when He'd perform a miracle, the people still did not believe. Some even said, after seeing such, that He was in league with Satan. It is not signs and wonders that bring people to believe in God.

Something to keep in mind, too, is that the Bible spans about 4,000 years. Yes, Moses parted the red sea by God's command, Elijah called fire down on a mountain, and a donkey had words with Balasm, but that wasn't the norm. Those were exceptional incidents that made it into the Bible.

At the same time, Christ did say that these works He did we (disciples of Christ) would do and greater. There are many miracles documented by various churches, but many, because the churches openly admit they believe in God, are dismissed because they're biased. It's ridiculous circular logic, in my opinion, but there it is.

It really does seem, though, that today, compared with Biblical times and even a few hundred years ago, miracles, signs and wonders are significantly lacking. It's interesting to not that for about 400 years before Christ was born, no prophet was in Israel (which was unusual), and miracles, signs and wonders were not taking place. It was like the calm before the storm to draw even more attention to the Prince of Peace's coming.

It does appear, at least in my understanding of scripture, that miracles, signs and wonders are going to increase in time in the West, if it still stands. Already miracles take place that are spoken of by missionaries in South America, Africa and India all the time. Here in the west, though, they're not taking place. I believe that's in the process of changing, though. God's hand is moving, and many are moving from their worship of Science as an impersonal god to recognizing there seems to be something more. Time will tell if this model will soon be changing!

reply to post by Drzava

wondering why we do not normally see biblical miracles?-----------let us know when you find the true church of G-D that Messiah commissioned His apostles to start.its so small right now and so scattered that its almost invisible.i suspect that we will have to wait for the two witnesses to be in confrontation with the beast and false prophet in jerusalem(revelation 11) before miracles like the 10 plagues to free the israelites from egyptian slavery are seen again.

read about the girl in my sig...

I myself have seen miracles in my life, and my family as well. Hes still working but the world is so faithless today.

peace.

Miracles do happen today. They are never heard of because anyone outside the faith would not believe you if you told them anyway. I have prayed for and seen miracles happen. I have been there when others have prayed and miracles have happened. I live in the UK and God is doing wonderful things all the time.
I have had a few conversations with people here on ats on the subject but they don't believe you, they put it down to something else. If people don't believe in God, they won't believe in miracles.
If you find the right church and they are ministering in the gifts of the spirit, you will see miracles with your own eyes.
Cheers.

reply to post by jon1


i've actually asked you this before

DOCUMENT THEM
if they happen all the time, take the time to document them

come back and make these claims when you've documented a dozen or so "miracles" thoroughly

reply to post by madnessinmysoul


Why? When God does these things, as Christians we just thank him and move on. It's about being humble and grateful, It's not about boasting or trying to prove anything.
Anyway, what would documenting do, People didn't even believe Jesus never mind some unknown Christian that no one has heard of. every so often these sort of things come out in the media but does it change anyones life? No. they think it is some kind of trick or something.
Anyway, you have read a few of my posts about this subject and i have told you many facts but it changes nothing. you know that my wife had miracle healings and there are many people who could testify to that. (whether you believe me or not doesn't matter). The only way to have proof of this sort of thing is to see for yourself what God is doing.
The problem is that being an athiest won't get you to the places where these things are happening.
Christians are not into trying to prove God. We are told to spread the word and that is all we can do. It is then up to the individual what he wants to do with that information. If people want to deny God then that is up to them and no matter what i say about miracles or otherwise it's not going to change anything.
I would talk to anyone who wants to know more, but ATS is not the place to do it. There are to many people lurking in the background waiting to ridicule anything i say. sign of the times i suppose.
Cheers
John

reply to post by jon1


here's an answer for why, because i'm about to ask you nicely.

please document the miracles.

i don't KNOW that any of your miracles happened, i KNOW you claimed a miracle happened, i KNOW you didn't look into any alternatives, and i KNOW that there's no evidence to back up your claims.

if you proved your miracles happened and were truly miracles, i'd believe in some sort of interventionist deity, maybe even yours.
don't you believe in saving people's souls?
you would save millions of atheist souls if you could truly prove your claims.

isn't that a good enough reason to do it?

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by jon1

 

here's an answer for why, because i'm about to ask you nicely.

please document the miracles.

i don't KNOW that any of your miracles happened, i KNOW you claimed a miracle happened, i KNOW you didn't look into any alternatives, and i KNOW that there's no evidence to back up your claims.

if you proved your miracles happened and were truly miracles, i'd believe in some sort of interventionist deity, maybe even yours.
don't you believe in saving people's souls?
you would save millions of atheist souls if you could truly prove your claims.

isn't that a good enough reason to do it?

Sounds like the perfect reason to do it, the problem is, miracles are not a weekly event. It's not a case of " which miracle should i record today". Collectively, throughout the world they are in abundance but pop down to your local church and ask how many miracles they have had this year. I can't give you figures but i bet less than 50% are using the gifts of the spirit in that way. A lot of very sincere Christians don't even believe that God heals today. I know because i have talked to them. Even some ministers don't believe in healing miracles.

As for me recording them, Due to the fact that i have moved twice in the last four years and i will be moving again within the next six months at the latest means that I am not part of any ministry team at the moment. Although i hope to be soon.

I really do wish that I could prove Gods existance but if no one else in history has done it i doubt that little old me is going to. As i have said before. the only way to have any proof is to personally get involved and seek God yourself.

The best i can do is just tell my story and if people want to Follow up on that, Great. If not, at least they know enough to make their own minds up.

I could supply names and phone numbers of people who have been witness to these events but does that prove anything? No.

jon.

[edit on 5-12-2007 by jon1]

One thing that I did years ago, was I saw a woman I knew on the way into church, and she had(probably) first degree burns on her hands.
Not too bad, but she said they had hurt all day.
I prayed for her in Jesus' name and with faith.
She looked at me amazed and said that it didn't hurt anymore. I know many christians who can 'talk' the fire out of people.