BTS.talk: Being English, not British

PODcast:

Being Enlish, not British

Following an ATS Chat with Queen of Chat, Minnie, decided to talk about being English first.






length: 04:17
file: btstpod_2671.mp3
size: 0k
feed: btst
status: live (at time of posting)

[edit on 25-11-2007 by Freedom ERP]

To me...

You guys are either...English, Irish, Welsh or Scotch...

Please forgive me if I've excluded other territories thru my own ignorance of where they should be "classified"

Peace

Seems that I managed to save the podcast file in sure a way that it was not saved properly. User error. I will re-record and working with management on how to re-load a podcast.

PODcast:

Being Enlish, not British (reply 1)

A complete podcast this time with sound as managed to save the last one with out my fair tones






length: 04:39
file: btstpod_2723.mp3
size: 4362k
feed:
status: live (at time of posting)

Really liked your Podcast.. just going to add my pounds worth of opinions/views.

The british or "Britons" being the name given probably by the romans now meaning the Anicent ancestors of british isles "Pictish/Celts",the british and English are different in prefrence. The English or once "Angles" from Germany are not british however now part of united kingdom.

Now this is where it gets tricky,, I am Cornish and Secondly British, My mother is Cornish however my Father is English and there is confusion on weather my Ancestors on my dads side orginally come from scotland..

Cornwall once known as West Wales and now more commonly known As "kernow" is a Extraterrortial part of England though The Cornish along with the Welsh and scotish and Irish were habitants of the british isles before the English settlers, cornwall has its own language and Celtic traditions much like wales and scotland.

However,, Though people like to think of the united kingdom as being a free country it is not in my opinioin, as cornwall and the cornish as a race are not free and are restricted under English rule.

Its True to say that not all Englishmen are racist, nether are the scots or welsh.. but for those who are no Racist only have to look at the Smaller Races that inhabit the country to see that Racism has been around a long long time and it comes part and parcel of Humanities dark side of war and domination over other countries..

Hi There.

Having been born and bred in the North-West of England, I am Lancastrian English, which basically means English. However, the blood in my veins is thoroughly Celtic, as my ancestry is a third English, a third Scottish, and a third Irish. Father was English (now deceased), mother is Irish(maternal), Scottish (paternal). Thus, within UK borders I am English, beyond UK borders I am British, and that I feel is probably the more accurate way to perceive me in regards to nationality.

However, I do not soley identify myself as English, although Englishness has been the main influence in my life, but bubbling just below this Englishness are the Celtic influences which underpin my Englishness caricature and lean it more towards Britishness. The Scottish, Irish, and Welsh influences play a vital and important role in shaping that Britishness, and although each separate identity has its own branch on the tree, it is the whole tree one must fully appreciate, for it is the whole tree that is perceived internationally. The British character has been shaped by all historical UK identities, and thus, in a contemporary context, all whom are born in the UK are British with a particular character flavour induced by a ancestry leading back to one of the tree's branches.

Of course, this is a very generalistic perception of things, and does not take into account the influences from the wider cosmopolitan side of Britain, because these smaller cosmopolitan influences have not been around long enough to dilute the main influences.

reply to post by Freedom ERP


Minnie is not the Queen of Chat.

Asala is.

Minnie will have to find another title!

And to add something constructive. Although you Brits are North Irish, Welsh, Scots, I still (and so do many others) call you all English. Has nothing to do with thinking everyone is actually English, just that England is the most promenint of the four nations, thus Britain is put with Britain and by associations the other 3 nations are English as well. Hope that makes sense.

[edit on 12/31/2007 by Rockpuck]

And yet another edit to add .. if the exchange rate would not rape my pockets to go to Ireland, Britain I would go and see the cultures for my self, but seeing as $2 makes one pound and no doubt a meal in London will put me back considerably I don't see this happening anytime soon. So you all will remain English in my book.

[edit on 12/31/2007 by Rockpuck]

As the UK is well into the process of being subsumed into a federal european superstate I think the question is null and void.

Not English, not British, just European.

Good point. It is sad that when pointed out to Europeans that their new EU is just like America pre-civil war .. they get mad. Well it is, and given time international boundaries will become myths from the past with one corrupt federalized government with complete disregard to national or ethnic heritage. And they went into the system willingly.

“As the UK is well into the process of being subsumed into a federal european superstate I think the question is null and void.

Not English, not British, just European.”

I think you underestimate your enemy. I am British first, English second and Western third. Being European is a circumstance that comes in fourth under protest. My thoughts about Europe are not isolated either.

I noticed in Holland last week that British cars aren’t carrying the EU stars on the left of their plates and the Euro is still a currency I need to convert. All these things make me happy.

Britain has no place under the control of a European Super State and the bull about preventing another war in Europe is obsolete. Britain will bin these idiots from the Labour party in two years. The mood is against Brown and he is the exact opposite to Blair. From natural PR guy to anonymous bean counter, labour can’t win next time.

I’ve lived and worked in three European countries in the last ten years, from a building site in France to an American army base at 30 and I assure you Europe will never be a replacement for the US. The Super State will never happen because our differences are too large and our histories too long.

I too am English, first and foremost, British secondly, and have no desire to become part of the EU Fiasco. The EU is largely illegal and most people do not want any part of it, it has been organised by politicians for politicians and their wealthy masters, and has nothing whatsoever to do with the Common People. As many as 80% in England are against it, according to many polls.
My claim to being English is based on having descended from Angles, Jutes and Saxons who arrived here at the end of the Roman Occupation.
Within The British Isles, are the English,Scots, Irish and Welsh, after some fifteen hundred years of fighting each other, we are finally friends, and stand together. We do,however, retain our cultural differences and respect each other, but it took 1500 years.

It's important to know the difference between territories, but who really cares about all of that beside those, who rule over us?

My mother is from Scotland and is a quarter Irish and 3 quarters Scottish and my father is 1/4 Scottish the rest being English from Northumberland and Cornwall. Therefore also having been brought up in England, I am English when in the UK and British when abroad.

I do seem to remember a recent programme on tv whereby they tested the DNA of thousands of individuals throughout the UK. The results where that a surprising amount of English people had Celtic ancestors and that the influx of Angles, Saxons and Jutes did not have as large an influence except perhaps in the way of the English Language but not genetically as many people have thought.

i think to say im one half this, quarter that and basically naming all the possible associations of your genetic ancestry is nonsense, obviously there are countless variations the further back you go so why bother, you are what you feel you are, i'm an Englishman i was born in england, i grew up in england i am English sod what my ancestors were, the term British to me is just a political one to be used on a political level i dont think my self British thats just the name of the corporation i pay my taxes too. and to the person who says i just call you all English regardless, thats fine from now on i think ill just call all Americans , Mexicans because my arrogance makes me ignorant but you see i like tequila and they make the good stuff so seeing how they are more prominent in the tequila stakes from now on you are all Mexicans

To an extent unless you have a dna test the further back you go you can only guess at your ancestry. However, many people particularly the Irish and Scots make a great issue of defining themselves as being Scots or Irish and don't want to be classified as English or British. Although I think I remember reading somewhere that in the 1800 it was common to call people who came from the uk as being English but that has now gone out of fashion.

One might say its a storm in a teacup as to whether anyone is English, Scottish, Welsh, Irish or Brisith but you just need to have a look around the world at old tribal rivalries to see that it takes hundreds of years before people are prepared to forgive and forget. So while the differences may not be important to some to others they define who they are and as such can cause enough racial tensions to cause wars etc. You just need to look at the issues with the Scottish and English parliaments and the breakaway from the uk possition, which seems a bit strange considering that Scotland and England and Wales will still be part of the EU.

i clas my self british becuse im half english ( granfather and grandmother enlglish)
quarter welsh( 1 grandfather welsh)
and a quarter scottish( 1 gandmother)

i make sure i know my history from all corners or my breeding per say.

so i do class my self as british not english

Originally posted by Rockpuck
And to add something constructive. Although you Brits are North Irish, Welsh, Scots, I still (and so do many others) call you all English. Has nothing to do with thinking everyone is actually English, just that England is the most promenint of the four nations, thus Britain is put with Britain and by associations the other 3 nations are English as well. Hope that makes sense.

I understand why you arrived at that logic, but it's no more correct than someone referring to all Americans as 'Californians' because California is by far the most populous US state and has the highest GDP of all fifty states. That's the best analogy I can come up with as to the difference between England and Britain, using American terminology. Now I must confess I'm not sure as to what extent there is a rivalry or 'nationalism' between the States that make up the USA (I'm almost certain it's there, however - even some threads here on ATS have advocated breaking up the United States), but I could confidently guess that I'd be pretty unpopular

As for me, I class myself as British. Although I haven't done any extensive digging into my family roots (only from the early 20th century), the only non-English relative I have was a great grandfather (who was Welsh). Nevertheless, Englishness just isn't important to me at all. Whether at home or abroad I always class myself as British. I live in England, but visit Scotland and Wales when I get an excuse to go (haven't been to Northern Ireland, but intend to go) and the United Kingdom is such a wonderful and varied place that I just can't choose!

The whole is the sum of its parts, as they say, and there could be no British without the English, Scottish, (Northern) Irish and Welsh... but nevertheless I think these four components make up a fantastic nation, one of which I am proud to be a part of.

[edit on 1/1/08 by Ste2652]

But you guys DO do that.

You call us Yanks. A Yank is someone who live in New England, New York and perhaps maybe Pennsylvania. A small portion of America, but no one cares about that, we are still called Yanks. Oddly even people from the south are called Yanks by Europeans and Ausies.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Well, actually, there could be an argument made there, about the difference between Yankee and Yank.

The popular usage of Yank actually comes from WW2, when the Yanks were overdressed, overpaid and over here These days rhyming slang has reduced you to being either tins or septics (as in tin tanks or...).

I would point out that in all good B-grade fiction Americans are referred to by "Latinos" as either Yanqui or Norte Americanos...(which is of no actual use in countering your argument ).

Maybe we do it because there are only Aussies in Australia (well, Tasmanians as well ).

Even some Aussies (a hell of a lot of them, actually) think England is synonomous with Great Britain or UK and that Pom refers to all the people thereof. This is mostly because the Scots and Irish cricket teams don't regularly tour to Australia, but the England and Wales Cricket Board does send a team, known as England and referred to as the Poms.

To the poster who defined the nationalities of the Brits...not bad, except for the Scotch...a little bit like Kennedy's donuts...