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Is ATS becoming Increasingly Anti-Christian?

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posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 04:01 AM
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To SpeakerOfTruth

Hi There, First I want to tell you that i'm moslem

The person (or groups) that say " Allah Akbar " isn't moslem, my religion never teach the follower to kill innocent people. Maybe you're right, they're the "extremist", but they're not islam. Or maybe is the anti-Muslim, they want to make world see that islam is terrorrist, So please , Do not claim muslim is terrorrist, but "THEY" are the terrorrist

thx, for mispell, i'm sorry coz i'm indonesian (#1 COUNTRY WITH MOST MOSLEM CITIZEN)




posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 05:20 AM
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Originally posted by Camar
Really? Which ones? Who was the equal to the Christos? Who else was spoken of by the prophets for hundreds of years prior to His birth? Who else was described in detail before He was ever born... his life, ministry, death?


...well, not jesus.
equivalents to jesus?
how about the guy they based him off of, mithras
12 apostles, similar miracles, miraculous birth, heavenly parentage, similar teachings
300 years earlier



The life and teachings of the Christ, mythological?


seemingly.



Friend, you obviously have no real historical evidence to back you up.


oh, then we're equal in that regard. you have no evidence to show that the life of jesus was anything but a myth.



You are merely regurgitating spurious information you have been fed.


nah, it's called people knowing how to do research



Probably by some college professor.


seems like someone has a ridiculous anti-intellegencia bias.



It wouldn't surprise me if at some point in your life you actually believed in Jesus, the Christ......but someone, I don't really know who, ruined it for you.


yeah, being free from delusions is so horrible..
i'm ruined because i accept reality at face value



Come on, lets go toe to toe. Give me one of your POVs and I will send one back. Ready? Lets go, I am waiting and ready.


here's my point of view.
your religion is horrid. look in your holy book and it commands death for disobedient children and homosexuals, genocide for the people of canaan, and oppression of women.

it suppressed the advance of science in europe throughout the dark ages
and it's really just nonsense.
it's completely rooted in everything BUT fact.

there's a small portion of a POV



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 06:14 AM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


I honestly didn't mean to offend anyone with my statement about it being a form of mind control, but my views aren't of some insanely small portion. Corruption runs deep and spreads further than you might care to think. I don't read many religious forums so I don't know what's acceptable to believe.

Also, I didn't think this thread would really be noticed or get anywhere. I understand Speaker is a well known poster, but the topic is known to induce flames.



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 11:28 AM
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Modern religion is mind control pure and simple and by modern I mean the last 1500 years. We expect children to believe in fantasy and fairy tales I dont expect adults to do the same.. The people who think they need religion are just lacking something else in their lives and seek to find solace in this mind controlled crap that is spewed out as if it is all truths and facts, well its not.

Whatever religion was supposed to be its not what we have today and those hopeless fools who feel the need for it should be treated for mental health conditions because thats what happens to anyone else who claims such nonsense as truths.



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 01:04 PM
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reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 


Okay dude whatever, I concede, you win. There you happy. All I'm doing is attempting to lift the veil, if you (and all the others) want to remain ignorant to reality, be my guest, I tried to help. You can lead a horse to water, right? Anyway, your a good person from what I can tell and you do a good job defending what you believe. But honestly I cant waste my time on this thread anymore, I have much more important things to worry about right now than the religious views of others (see the effexor thread in my sig).

You have earned my respect. Please take no hard feelings from my posts here, and I apologize for the "comprehension" attack, I was out of line there. I had been at work for about 14hrs at that point and was a little grumpy.

Just do yourself a favor: Dont follow or believe in anything blindly/without question. I too was a very hard core christian for most of my life, but when I noticed certain things and decided to question the religion as a whole, I found enough to override my fear of Hell and lead me to what I consider to be a path of enlightenment. From what I've found religion is like government, its all fine and dandy until you question it for yourself and see the truth.

Just keep this in mind: If its the all perfect religion you think it is, then you should have no problem delving in and looking at it from other angles. I dont know about you but when I devote myself to something I learn as much as I can about it. That means looking at it from different perspectives, the pro and the con.

Dont bother replying to this post as, like I mentioned before, I have much more important issues to focus on at the moment (which sucks because I LOVE debating religion!). If you want to contact me see one of my threads or U2U me.

Seek the truth...



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 02:33 PM
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madnessinmysoul:

...well, not jesus.
equivalents to jesus?
how about the guy they based him off of, mithras
12 apostles, similar miracles, miraculous birth, heavenly parentage, similar teachings
300 years earlier

You might want to do a little research. While there is some evidence for worship of Mithras as early as the middle of the second centuy BC, it was considered a cult by the much more popular Zoroastrians. The more common Mithraic mystery religion was practiced mostly by Roman soldiers in the first through 4th century AD. Mithras certainly was not a model for Jesus.
Mithras didn't have 12 disciples, the 12 signs of the zodiac were common themes in worship of Mithras.
Mithras sprang from a rock, I suppose that could be a miraculous birth.
Mithras wasn't sacrificed, he sacrificed a bull.
I know it's popular these days, again, to say that Jesus was a copy of other, earlier figures, but it just ain't so.

I was going to refute each of your statements, but I decided that since you have difficulty believing Jesus even existed I would be wasting my breath. I don't think you'll see the facts, only the popular Christian bashing misinformation. Using Old Testament history to try to discredit Christianity makes no sense. All of these arguments against Jesus are OLD. None of this is new. Just rehashed, over and over.

The Faith brought by Jesus has little to do with the evil done in his name.


[edit on 22/11/07 by Camar]



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 03:39 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
"Using Logic and critical thinking, I can prove the existence of GOD."


I don't see how that is right. Until it is proven that is.

However, I think alot of people make threads like this, because they know there are going to be alot of responses back, so that means more points. Because religion is a heated topic to work with. There is always going to be someone to flame it.



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 04:33 PM
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reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 


Christianity claims to rule the world in peace, as is why I am one. Those who force it know not the very words of the one they call their messiah.

something along the lines of this from the Bible is what they should remember:

"If you go to a town and are treated unfairly or abused, clean your feet and leave"

Basically, stop whoring master race theocracy as a counter to another's master race theocracy.

[edit on 22-11-2007 by Gorman91]


Ah, once again madnessinmysoul gives us his very small view point that Jesus never existed despite the fact that he had a church following him before any Western Church was envisioned, the supposed "beginners" of Jesus' story to his view point.

Oy, the ignorance.

I guess the Indian Orthodox Church somehow poped up with the imagination of Jesus in 52AD, despite it being viewed as some crazy group from Israel. Even though they have no connections to the Eastern/Western mainstream, they somehow got established a mere 20 years after Jesus.

What about the Assyrian Church of the East? I suppose The Pope somehow implanted the though of Christ in it's followers in some time vortex so that it "looked" like it founded as the Western church was.

Ironic how those who are abused and abandoned by the Church are those who prove it's roots.

[edit on 22-11-2007 by Gorman91]



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 08:59 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
Deesell, I will have to agree with you. Too many think that being a Christian is a matter of practicing a religion, when in fact, I'd argue it's not. It is more about the way a person lives his/her life...

If I wanted to argue with you, I'd nit pick and say that being a Christian is not how you live your life, but the relationship you have with Jesus Christ, which will affect how you live your life.

My relationship with Jesus (through prayer and Bible reading) is a whole lot better than my relationship with an uncle that I haven't seen or talked to since Thanksgiving, 1972.

[edit on 22-11-2007 by CharlesMartel]



posted on Nov, 22 2007 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by goldengrain
I think some religious people try to interject their religion into legislation for we, who may not share those beliefs.

I also believe that there is no idea that is exempt from by logical thought.

If a person has a religion, it is HIS religion, not mine. He chose to follow a teaching. If others find it unappealing or inconsistant or just false, it should be their right to say so.

Offering one block of thinking an exemption from scrutiny gives it an unfair advantage over competing ideas and is just wrong.

To many people religious thought is just that, thought. If some others consider it sacred they should not expect others to, as well.

No, to me not being able to attack religious belief is censorship. And I am not an athiest.

What is a religion other than a human's view of how to relate to God/gods/creation/etc.? All legislation is an attempt to impose a view {or views} of the world on others! Or to provide for taxes to fund said view{s}.



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 12:19 AM
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Why do you notice frequent and misplaced anti-Christian posts?
One possible (and likely) reason -

The Mainstream scientific community (which 30 years ago was primarily materialistic/naturalistic) has come 180 degrees. In the face of scientific discovery, these conclusions are finding increasing support:
There is a creator (see: cosmology)
Life forms are too complex to permit Darwinian evolution (see: microbiology)
Man is more than the sum of his parts (see: biology, psychology)

With Darwinism debunked, and the fingerprints of God being found everywhere we look, staunch atheistic scientists are becoming more and more desperate to explain away these conclusions....

Could it be the same thing with the atheists on this board?



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 12:21 AM
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And to CharlesMartel and others,

no true Christian is going to impose his beliefs on you by legislation. The ones who rob us of freedoms and rights are power-hungry individuals. Bush talks like he's a believer, but his actions prove otherwise, get what I'm saying?



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 01:13 AM
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you talk as being christan is a good thing LMAO.
the christans should go kill more african adults and raise more children in christs teachings cause its gods word right.

thnk god im not a crazy christan



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 05:35 AM
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Hi all,

I just came across this thread and I can’t help but wonder if this is another so called anti-Christian thread?

Link

Either way it is a good read



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 01:12 PM
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indeed, this is a danger for christianity.
but what does bother more to me, is of more ´theological´reasons.
aliens are said to have been´inventing´ Christ, what means, there is no Christ at all.



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 01:27 PM
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Jesus was not christian, he was a Christ, a level of Spiritual attainment he said we can do likewise, he was an example of our true reality. The Catholic Church created a religion called Chrisitan to silence the true message Jesus brought to us about ourselves and where true power lies.
Few if any on earth are truley Christic.

We use language to control, for Nazi's the word was Jew, for us it is Al Queda. We use our labels of Jew, Isreal, Nazi, Chrisitan, etc. to control outcomes or sway oppinions. Psuedo Socialist party one or Psuedo Socilist part two, does not matter, our election is nothing more then an insider trade. So we use labels to alighn people with and control thought and outcome. Attacks on Chrisitian labels is against the people speaking and their actions, not against the truth as it stands on its own.

It is the same with the label Jew, if you speak against someone with this label, you are accused of anti-semitism. Get rid of labels and make each human accountable for their own actions and words. Equally if you say something stand on it or don't say it.



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 01:40 PM
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Originally posted by Isaiah 24:21
You should be thankful for the King James Bible that freed you from the iron hand of Rome.


I was never in Rome and frankly it was Christianity that plummeted Europe into the dark ages, then they realized how dumb and backwards they were and used Rome's infrastructure and political ideologies of 500 years ago to become civilized again. And sorry to burst your bubble, but yes, there are atheists, like myself who do not believe in gods or unicorns or leprechauns.

Also, don't see why people try to pretend that the Catholic church is not Christian, probably since it predates most Christian denominations by centuries ?

[edit on 23-11-2007 by laiguana]



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
GeeGee, I'd argue that any form of ideolgy whether it be political or religious is a form of brainwashing. However, I think intent is the real question here. Can you argue that the intentions of someone like, say, Stalin were positive? I don't think you can legitimately make such a claim.


Oh of course not. But what he said was "atheists don't realize they're brainwashed", but he doesn't take into consideration that Christianity is/can be a form of brainwashing as well.



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 04:15 PM
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I choose not to believe in an 'imaginary friend'. There is no credible evidence that JC ever existed. If he did, he is not the Messiah.

When I stopped believing in Santa, I started questioning JC.

Now, if the New Testiment were taken by itself, with Paul's hatred discarded, it might be a good religion to follow, especially in today's troubling times.

Christ said we are all sons of god (like him?).
He said to turn the other cheek rather than hit back - something our 'Christian' President chooses to ignore.
Love our enemies, ditto.
But he also said that god provides for the sparrows without their having to toil. I guess he is in favor of the welfare system and a universal, one payor health care system, as well.

If one did not have to believe in a literal Christ, even I might enjoy being a Christian. Some kind and loving things are attributed to him.

I was reared as a fundie Christian. It took many years and much inner turmoil and soul searching for me to shake loose of the brainwashing, and I resent that having been done to me and consider it a terrible thing to take advantage of young minds in such a manner.

I determined only to follow the dictates of the world as I experienced it. But I also picked up a book on comparative religion. The idea was, knowing that my own religion was corrupt, could I say they ALL were? I tried to keep an open mind.

I joined no other religion, but

enough has happened personally to me, over time, to convince me that we survive death and that we pre-existed our current lives. I also believe that there are elements in religions that nourish a healthy outlook on life and that aid one in overcoming the dark spots in life that we all go through. It is valuable for a society to make a regular habit of looking at things from an ethical and moral standpoint.

So, although I believe the dogma and doctrine of religions are crap (yes CRAP), the mystical part - the part that sometimes makes a person feel that all is harmoneous and working together for some unknowable ultimate good - that thing I take to be real.

It seems to me that the more orthodox of any religon tend to be the most mystical, and the religions which are the most ecumenical, like Unitarians, are the least. So, if a person feels that there is 'something' to faith and is led by a need to know the unknowable, he is often stuck with the more dogmatic religons. This is why, in these faiths (I think) one often finds some of the best examples of spirituality, but they also often preach crap to a person.





[edit on 23-11-2007 by goldengrain]



posted on Nov, 23 2007 @ 04:20 PM
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Originally posted by spiritwomyn
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Few if any on earth are truley Christic.



I am inclined to say that you are absolutely correct.





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