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Iraq war is a betrayal of American democracy

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posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 12:51 AM
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Iraq war is a betrayal of American democracy
November 11, 2007
By MATT HOWARD


In 2003 I illegally invaded the sovereign nation of Iraq with 1st Tank battalion 1st Marine Division. My commander in chief unleashed the world's fiercest fighting force upon the country and people of Iraq, and now those of us used and betrayed by him are demanding justice.

Four and a half years after our opening "shock and awe" Bush's lies are known throughout the world, and yet he continues to act with impunity. Four and a half years later the Bush regime has unleashed a hell upon the country of Iraq that only those who have been there can truly understand.



Four and a half years later we as soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines are done. We are done being told under threat of court martial to run over children that get in the way of our speeding convoys.

We are done raiding and destroying the homes of innocent Iraqis on a nightly basis.

We are done abusing and torturing prisoners.

We are done being hired thugs for the 160,000 contractors and US corporate interests in Iraq.

We are done being poisoned by depleted uranium, the unspoken Agent Orange of this war.

We are done coming home broken, from two, three, four tours of duty – only to find our commander in chief has actually tried to CUT funding to the Department of Veterans Affairs. To find our doctors being told to diagnose us with pre-existing personality disorders instead of post traumatic stress syndrome.

We are done killing for lies.



The Vietnam War ended when soldiers put down their weapons and refused to fight; when pilots dropped their bombs in the ocean.

We are re-educating the public to let them know that the power ultimately lies with the people.




And we will not continue to be silenced by the mainstream media. Top generals and bottom privates are all speaking in unison now. We know the truth about the slaughter of upwards of one million Iraqis. Why is no one listening? We will not stand by as this regime tricks the country into thinking that if you oppose the war you do not support the troops. We ARE the troops and we have never felt support from this administration. Stop mindlessly supporting the troops. Start demanding that we come home – and maybe think about apologizing to us when we get back.



I enjoy reading about former marines/soliders who return from Iraq and publically ridicule this government and its actions.

Why is it so hard for the American people to take action and stop this haneous slaughter?

Why does the American media portray the death of a solider as a big deal?
Why does the government use the deaths for justification?

We launched a WAR On a nation, we are killing people.
They are rightly going to kill us back.

This war will not end because every death is labeled a terrorist attack, which is exactly the reason we are there for.

What will come first?

Killing every single iraqi thus meaning no more terrorist attacks on troops
OR
People wake up and remove this war criminal from power.

Americas society depends on the later, but i fear stupidity of its society will result in the former!

existentialistcowboy.blogspot.com...




posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 12:56 AM
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They kill everybody in Iraq???

Damn, I guess every person in Iraq must be the terrorists, then...



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 02:03 AM
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i wonder what the civilian to terrorist death ratio is ..?



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 05:03 PM
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If Matt Howard feels he's a war criminal, he can save us the trial and hang his own self... hey Agit8dchop do you also enjoy reading about popping Allah vests and the carnage they cause??? Pffft a few brain burns expess their "feeling's" and it's THE TRUTH ??? hehehe what a Gamoke....



posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:46 PM
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I love all the smart a55 comments from the new people!
:O)

Because it shows immaturity,

you dont seem to understand we are occupying a country.
so long as we occupy their country, there will be people resisting us.
Iraqi's have the right to resist us, its the god given right we seem to use as a reason to stay.

They arent resisting us, or killing us for fun...

they are attacking us, and killing us, because we are attacking htem, and killing them.

Did they come to America and start bombing and killing Americans?
No,
We want half way around the world, devestated their lands, killed their people and setup occupation.

Of course they are going to kill us. your quite dumb if you think they arent going to, or if you think they are in the wrong for doing so.

It seems the American leader is counting on his citizens being stupid, because he's using that as justification to stay.

'' urrr, iraqi's are killing Americans, so we need to stay to reduce the violence ''

what you dont hear is

'' iraqi's only starting killing us once we invaded and occupied, they are justified in doing this ''

So for all you people who take this article as a joke, it just shows the demise of American society.

And people wonder WHY the world HATES western society.

[edit on 19-11-2007 by Agit8dChop]



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:02 AM
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Someones date of joining ATS has no bearing on maturity, knowledge, or understanding of any subject, and your comments shows your arrogance Pffft. I fully understand that we are in a War for the survival of the American way of life...if you dont care for freedom and the right's you enjoy off the backs and blood of Americans...Leave, get out and good ridence to you...



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:10 AM
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reply to post by Oneshot1
 



I always love the answer to this question, Let me ask you this, if our nation was invaded by a superpower with all the best military might in the world behind a lie of liberation would you allow the invading force kill you children, families, destroy your home and incarcerate your friends? or . . . will you join the resistance and by any means necessarily fight the invaders to take back your country?.

Guess what I rather die fighting an invader than giving away my nation and see my fellow citizens die under a false ideology of fighting terror and liberation.

So what would you do.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 07:06 AM
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I would join the insurgents and try to kill Americans, or help in some other way, like raising funds or smuggling weapons for the rebels..it's every citizens patriotic duty.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 03:58 PM
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Marg6043....what 'super power' and what "Liberation" could you possibly be talking about??? Your question is made up of non-starter factoids, and shows your agenda of the "Hate America First Cult". We are being invaded right now by Mexico/SA, maybe you and PKSPEAKER can die fighting them...Ya know,, To help preserve the American way of life and all...



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 05:22 PM
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Obviously if you can not answer my question then you are lost on what a patriot no matter from what country it comes will do to protect their nation from foreign invasion.

Our nation the USA is invading another nation right now in case you have not notice before or happen to chose to ignore.

Every thing that our nation represent has turned into ca ca, dodo by the elected for the people officials in the white house on our name.

It is a betrayal of the American democracy what is going on in Iraq

Wake up and smell the corruption in our corporate ruled government.

Again what will you do if our nation get invaded by a foreign nation with military power?



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 05:51 PM
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As an FSME for this board, I can give applause for relevant posts advancing the topic. Too bad I can't give out "Boos" as well.

Agit8edChop. I agree with 99% of what ya said. I have a question though. It applies to this, of which I hear a lot but, never hear a good suggestion to address it.



Why is it so hard for the American people to take action and stop this haneous slaughter?


That's it. My only question. WHAT do we do? "Take action"? In what form? There are things going on all over pertaining to this. Jeez, this summer, every time I drove my daughter to day camp, I saw a group of people in front of the post offices collecting signatures to impeach Cheney. There were always people out there listening and signing, but, is Cheney being impeached? Not yet. I hear a lot of "Do something about it", yet, no real suggestions of what.
Now, before ya yell at me, I support the troops, not the war. The war is a sham IMO, to gain ground on energy sources. And I hear what you're saying.

@ marg,
Good posts.

Cuhail



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 07:35 PM
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No problem Cuhail, Boo away....There isnt another nation that could/would attack America so the question is moot and silly...Hmmm...very interesting that you fail to mention the years of attacks against America, and our "Kumbaya" response to them. We seem to have most of them all wrapped up in a sand-box right now though huh?...The normal everyday citizen of Iraq are not the one's we are fighting, it's the folk's that will dance in the streets when another 9/11 type attack occurs in your hometown, the folk's that can/will/and do strap on explosive vest's garnished with steel and pop them in crowds of women and kids, the same folk's that will see you, your childeren, and America DEAD and BURNING....Now if you feel ANY sympathy for folk's that have bought the delayed wrath of America upon themselves, dont be surprised or shocked when someone say's "Your full of s***"...



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 07:45 PM
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Thats where your wrong, you might be looking for those people but they are nowhere to be found..the 9/11 attackers came from Saudi Arabia, 1 from Egypt and 1 from Lebanon .. people who would commit a terror atack in the USA can come from any country, or in Timothy McVeighs case, from America itself.. when America stumbles into a country in Iraq-guided there by a corrupt political and financial agenda of a few profeteers-then America ends up fighting nationalists who are simply trying to liberate their country from an oppresive occupier who insists on dominating their political and economic system..

by your logic, when Timothy McVeigh attacks, then the US should bomb Nebraska because there "might be white people there who sort of think that way"



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 08:01 PM
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reply to post by Oneshot1
 



You sound convinced I was refering to you....interesting.




There isnt another nation that could/would attack America so the question is moot and silly...


Is that addressed to me? I urge you to point out in my post where I said that.



very interesting that you fail to mention the years of attacks against America, and our "Kumbaya" response to them.

Funny, so did you. Can you name them all please? For the good of the thread and your stance.

As for the rest of your little tirade there. The American soldiers that are in the battle are NOT targeting civilians and I DARE you to find a US Vet who fought in Iraq and now posts here with all of us that DID indiscriminately fire on civvies on purpose. I'll find all of the ones who HELD their fire so as NOT to mow down the civilians inbetween their target and themselves. You see, as an American, we are taught to think more of our adversaries and challenge their beliefs, not to kill them out of spite.
I, personally, was taught to turn the other cheek. Well, once at least. You seem to feel that we should kill 'em all, then sort out the crazies.

So yeah, you've convinced me to throw a "Boo" out there. I will however say thank you for standing up and offering to be the thread Jamoche. Every thread needs at least one.
Thanks for posting.

Cuhail



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 08:15 PM
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I do not understand the anti-country retreat from Iraqi crowd. We are not fighting and killing Iraqi citizens. We are fighting terrorists and out of country insurgents. The terrorist groups are of several nationalities. These terrorist groups have been allowed to operate and recruit for far to long which is why they have become the problem they are now.

I don't think any one knows for sure why they want to kill us but they do. Terrorists started this, and you know for damn sure that Saddam gave them support. In fact I think it is well documented that he was paying families of suicide bombers, as well as funding terrorist groups. The bleeding left should be glad we took him out just for human right violations alone.

The war on terror has to happen. We have to engage them where ever they are, they must not be allowed to regroup or obtain nuclear or other weapons of mass destruction.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 08:35 PM
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Wether for or against the war, the fact is that it was launched illegally. President Bush is quite literally guilty of war crimes, and he is not the only one. The invasion did not sustain the required UN votes. Iraq did not attack us, did not have the means to attack us, nor was it complicit in any plot to carry out attacks on us. The Nuremburg trials were carried out "so that this can never happen again." But it has. The United States has attacked, invaded, and occupied a sovereign nation without provocation. Just carrying out orders is no excuse either. Bush is not the only one who is guilty. Many Nazis were convicted of war crimes, simply for following orders. These are facts and cannot be disputed without degenerating into rhetoric and propoganda.

On the other hand...

We are on the brink of terrible global calamity. The oil is running out...fast. The global economy has already begun to collapse. This time the Great Depression will look like we only forgot our milk money. The terrible truth is that the war in Iraq is being deliberately strung out, to prevent its oil from reaching the market place. Think of it as a huge reserve depot. To drive up the profits? Perhaps in the short term, but the bigger picture is far more startling. The United States is going to need those reserves to fuel our tanks, planes and missiles, if we are going to win the Big One. The powder keg is set, and the fuse has been lit....



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 08:44 PM
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reply to post by wsamplet
 


We are fighting both foreign-fighters on Jihad, and domestic Iraqis who want us out. This proves that the war created more enemies than we had before the US invaded Iraq. It was only the hardcore religious fanatics that had the motivation to actually attack us. Now a humble Baghdad baker or Taji Taxi driver is willing and eager to kill Americans.



posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 08:58 PM
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Originally posted by Cuhail
reply to post by Oneshot1
 

... The American soldiers that are in the battle are NOT targeting civilians and I DARE you to find a US Vet who fought in Iraq and now posts here with all of us that DID indiscriminately fire on civvies on purpose. I'll find all of the ones who HELD their fire so as NOT to mow down the civilians inbetween their target and themselves. You see, as an American, we are taught to think more of our adversaries and challenge their beliefs, not to kill them out of spite.
I, personally, was taught to turn the other cheek. Well, once at least. You seem to feel that we should kill 'em all, then sort out the crazies.


I hate to say it, but "oneshot1" may have been over there. I know that many of the sort have been.

I have also seen extensive footage of American soldiers firing on unarmed Iraqis. I was not over there though, so I don't pretend to know how widespread the problem actually is. You have to consider though, that most soldiers and Marines sign up so they can kill people, not for banner waving.

Also, a person very close to me did two tours. That person was ordered not to stop under any conditions while on a convoy, and did in fact run over two children with a very big truck. He also witnessed a dog walk into the street in front of a convoy and realized too late that the dog was rigged as an IED. War is Hell (and managed Chaos.)



posted on Nov, 21 2007 @ 01:22 AM
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Originally posted by jackinthebox

... The American soldiers that are in the battle are NOT targeting civilians and I DARE you to find a US Vet who fought in Iraq and now posts here with all of us that DID indiscriminately fire on civvies on purpose. I'll find all of the ones who HELD their fire so as NOT to mow down the civilians inbetween their target and themselves. You see, as an American, we are taught to think more of our adversaries and challenge their beliefs, not to kill them out of spite.

I, personally, was taught to turn the other cheek. Well, once at least. You seem to feel that we should kill 'em all, then sort out the crazies.


1. They arent going to come home and publically parade the fact they killed civilians.
2. No one said they were deliberatley TARGETTING civilians.
3. Hundreds of thousands of civilians have been killed.
4. Some what a million are refugee's fleeing

All beacuse we lied about our reasons to steal their oil and occupy their land.

There were never any WMD's, and the government never actually believed there would be.
That means that every single death that has ANY bearing on the invasion to today, is a direct result of the USA's use of violent action.

The US government, would NEVER, EVER of sent 150,000+ military men and women, charging . first into an active chemical and biological war.

So, to sum up.

Our illegial war, has resulted in hundres of thousands of deaths.
Millions homeless and fleeing..
Wether we dropped that bomb by mistake, or missed our intended target,
brothers, sisters, mothers, fathers, grandparents, friends, cousins, lovers have been killed, because of our deceipt and greed.


Kill them out of spite?
..... that would be the lesser of two evils, compared to what we're doing, I believe!



posted on Nov, 21 2007 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by wsamplet
I don't think any one knows for sure why they want to kill us but they do. Terrorists started this, and you know for damn sure that Saddam gave them support. In fact I think it is well documented that he was paying families of suicide bombers, as well as funding terrorist groups. The bleeding left should be glad we took him out just for human right violations alone.
The war on terror has to happen. We have to engage them where ever they are, they must not be allowed to regroup or obtain nuclear or other weapons of mass destruction.



I can tell you why they want to kill you...
Its quite simple.

1. Becasue you support Israel onconditionally, when its obvious Israel are in the wrong in 99% of the actions they take.
2. Because you invaded Iraq based on lies, which is resulting in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of muslims... and yet you seem to blame THEM!
3. Because your leader lies, which results in further blood shed.
4. Because Americans citizens fail to remove the criminals resulting in the deaths of muslims

Should I go on ?

SAddam gave them support?

When was the last Iraqi convicted for killing Americans in America?
When did Iraq assist Alqaeda?
Arent we assisting terrorists in Iran, and Iraq also? ( funding the sunni's )
Arent we cosy with the Saudi's, even though 911 hijackers came from there, and they are ALSO backing the sunni's?

So, arent we too, technically terrorists?

The only difference, is we're terrorists on the offensive.
Iraqi's are terrorists for fighting occupation.
Who's in the right?

If the WAR on terror was legit, we'd of sent the 150,000 into afghan to get osama immediately.
We wouldnt of let his family fly out.
We wouldnt back the Israeli's
We wouldnt of invaded Iraq
We wouldnt be backing the Saudi's
and we wouldnt be committing just as much terrorism as your supposid terrorists.




[edit on 21-11-2007 by Agit8dChop]




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