CONS: The Katrina Incident: Media Manipulation Masks Government Malfeasance.

Does anybody else wonder whether the government's delay in responding to Katrina was the result of a psychological operations project to study the mass psychology of an American city being destroyed? A "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity?"



[edit on 18-11-2007 by America Jones]

The scope of this disaster was tremendous. The government response was adequate. At some point, people are expected to help themselves rather than relying on the government to fix everything for them. If any part of the government failed, it was the local governments.
After hearing about people who spent their checks issued from the federal government on tattoos, LCD TVs, and basicly squaundering the assistance when it was meant to help them get on their feet again, I'm pretty immune to all the whining about how "the government failed" to assist victims of Katrina. The government tries to help in housing, and people whine about how they have "forlmaldyhide" in them (I don't think the government even had to do this when tents would have sufficed).
When Katrina happened, my city was willing to assist and we had enough money given by the people of Des Moines to bring residents displaced by Katrina. There were enough volunteers to take in 600 families of four, with additional temporary housing for another 1500. Guess how many residents of New Orleans took advantage of this totally FREE ride? The answer==> 38
After this bit of news (which was quietly brushed aside by our local paper), people around my place of employment, and even a local radio show, joked (however, it was later found out that it was the truth) that when the people of Iowa presented this offer, it included the offer of finding them jobs to help these victims get on their feet. I guess that stipulation made it not such a "free" offer after all.
I frequently deal with truck drivers and construction companies with my job. One driver brought me back pictures of the humanitarian effort which he took part in while down there (and no, its not the same pictures I've seen circulated on the internet). His pictures, with him in it, showed a clean-up effort of a city block in New Orleans. It showed a house being demolished and debris clean-up by a major Iowa construction company and some volunteer employees working while some local residents sat on a lawn and porch across the street in lawn chairs. The driver said this was pretty telling of what went on down there, at least in the areas he'd seen.
Meanwhile, in California, with the wildfires recently, how could the government possibly win? If they had done more with these victims, then it would have become a "race" issue. With the same people, if the government had done even less, then the government is uncaring and did nothing to learn from the disaster "Katrina".
This country is becoming "soft". If people aren't willing to help themselves out of a bind rather than relying on your government, then these people are weakening themselves. Its no wonder Uncle Sam can't win. They don't want to be referred to as "sheeple" and yet they act like a flock of lost sheep. Its time to put on your "big people" clothes!

Excuse me folks,
How many of you bloggers were there? You think because you think you have some information, you can talk about Katrina? Who was there?
What? Are you relying on the crap that was put out by most of the media?
They weren't there. Only a few were there and I met those folks, I drove around, and walked, and crawled around with those guys. We slept in the zinc warehouse and ate MREs. I took pix with them, I looked at the destruction with some really brave news folks. With water lapping at their feet, Tim and Jennifer from KDRV Medford, were broadcasting from Canal Street while I stood by with my M16.

I was there. I saw what happened. I saw the local law, I saw the local “officials”, I saw the lack of professionalism in the folks who were “in charge”. It took the military to come in and take control of relief efforts to make things work.
(After Rita, which we stayed around for, the EOC had to use our folks (OREGON NATIONAL GUARD) just to keep track of their Emergency personnel!)

Local Law was a joke. I watched as they sat in their air conditioned vehicles and let the National Guard (from Oregon) man the checkpoints, route the traffic, keep control......The Mayor of N.O. and the Gov of LA were…..well…… out to lunch. The Mayor had his HQ in one of the huge hotels on Canal St. Of course he had power, and food, and access to the outside world. You know, most of Canal St was under water, except downtown. I was in a HUM-V as we worked our way through town from the west, past abandoned FDNO vehicles. (We checked to see if they were occupied.)
I listened to and watched the Mayor, I listened to and watched the Gov. I have pix. I saw, I watched, I recorded.
I was there.

xenya :
“one of the greatest disasters to occur in modern times.”
Compared to what?
“The political action, or inaction, by the government is viewed by a wide array of people (italics mine) as a chief failure of current executive power.”
Do you mean Federal?

Skywatcher:
THE FEDERAL GOVT DID NOT DROP THE BALL. THE STATE AND CITY GOV’T DID.
Even before the storm hit, Blanco refused Fed assistance. Nagin thought he was on top of it. I have pix of hundreds of busses under water. They could have been used to ferry folks out of the city to higher ground. He said, “Well, we didn’t have drivers.” Right. A teenage boy grabbed a bus and drove folks out…..I believe he was arrested, or at least detained, for “stealing” that bus and rescuing those folks.

NGC2736:
CONSPIRACY? GIVE ME A BREAK. Do you have some kind of special information?

America Jones:
” the government's delay in responding to Katrina”
Has anyone noticed that N.O. was the first “natural disaster” to be the responsibility of the Federal Govt? now…. I am not a big fan of the Fed Gov’t, but since when is it not the State that is responsible for what happens within its borders? The Fed Gov’t only steps in when FORMALLY REQUESTED by the State, in this case Louisiana.
However, in this case, the people, the media, and seemingly everyone else, were crying for the Fed Gov’t before the storm ever hit. Please recall that the storm was not an unusual or super strong storm. It hit land as a Cat 3. The majority of the damage was from the failure of the levies.
A large portion of the human tragedy, and I mean the people who were stuck in town, was the result of the Mayor not using all of the resources at his command. I heard his excuses. BullSh*t.

CreeWolf:
Good. I think you see the truth.

reply to post by Copernicus


I was amazed that the people stayed in the path of a deadly hurricane myself. I've never understood that desire to challenge death to that degree.

Anyway, if I remember correctly, they made sure to offer all those staying in the area the choice to sign a waiver stating that they wouldn't need any help should they be stranded there after the storm surge left. Quite honestly, they could have walked out to higher ground before the hurricane hit. There's no excuse for anyone to have remained there. They were forewarned that it was approaching for almost a week. I still can't feel any sympathy for those begging for extraction, when they KNEW that a huge storm was coming, and they stayed home anyway.

Last time I checked, it was called something like, "Deny Ignorance". If those people would have done what we do here everyday, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

TheBorg

reply to post by Camar


A very good post. You are preaching to the choir for the most part.

No. I don't have evidence of a conspiracy. Please go back and read my post and you'll see that I was talking about those little, run-of-the-mill conspiracies that are part and parcel of every day life. Here's what I mean:

"Senator XYZ, this is Joe Shmoe, I helped get you elected in the 3rd district."

"Sure, I remember you, Joe. What can I do for you?"

"Well, My company owns ABC Trailer Manufacturing plant in your district, and we're not making the profits we should. And it wouldn't look too good next year when you run again if unemployment is up."

"I agree, Joe. But what can I do?"

"I was thinking that with that big storm down in New Orleans, housing people would be important. Now we've got 437 trailers with some minor problems, but they're good enough for those homeless people."

"Are you wanting to donate them to somebody?"

"Not exactly,Senator. You're on the finance committee for FEMA special purchases, and this would really help your district. Just put this purchase through, and you're the good guy trying to help these people. And it might even mean the difference between you getting another term or not."

"Well, Joe, since you put it that way, I see what you mean. I'll see what I can do, and get back with you in the morning."

Do these little one and two and three person conspiracies happen regularly? Yes, Politicians even pride themselves on how good of deal makers they are, and how much money was spent in their district in a given term.

Do I have specifics? No.

Is this human nature? Yes.

Is this right? No.

Edit for quotation marks and such.




[edit on 19-11-2007 by NGC2736]

[edit on 19-11-2007 by NGC2736]

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c

Originally posted by NGC2736
We need to fire, and then give long prison sentences, to every last professional politician, if for no other reason than being a general drain on humanity.

While I don't see That bill hitting the House or Senate floor anytime soon, I couldn't agree more... regardless of political affiliation.

The catastrophe that was Katrina opened Many an eye, public and otherwise. Unfortunately, and apparently, those with a hand and or influence in the aftermath couldn't see beyond their nose... to include personal interests and or influential desires.

$.02

 

The real catastrophe is ongoing and I am of the same opinion. The general population has witnessed how inept a government is, how insipid the local government official is, and how greedy so many people are. In the process, some of us have also witnessed how a population has been manipulated and molded into blind lemmings. Unfortunately, WE THE PEOPLE WHO KNOW BETTER allow it all to continue by not voicing opposition, concern, or complaints about the way government operates (or doesn't).

Conspiracy??? No
Poor State and Federal policies??? Absolutely!

First, our country established a "new deal" for people decades ago and that "deal" has essentially rendered certain portions of our population to be helpless and quasi-worthless. Code word: apathy. Katrina brought some of the ill effects of the government-induced socioeconomical problems into the homes of most onlookers.

Second, our country also established a mindset that the government will "take care of everything". Not only is this a very dangerous mindset for people to accept/tolerate, but this mindset is nothing more than a delusion to funnel taxpayer dollars into government agencies that will supposedly produce that invisible safety net to everyone living in America. Code word: naive.

Third, our country has allowed the government to not just dictate law upon law (often in direct opposition to our Constitutional Rights), but to force people into situations that could be dangerous or life-threatening. Code word: ignorant.

We know that FEMA was not in New Orleans at the time of the disaster. It has nothing to do with "conspiracy". Simply put, it is not within the FEMA Federal mandate to be present at the TIME of a national disaster. FEMA is also not expected to be the first responder, that falls under the auspices of the Local Emergency Management Agency. Read the U.S. Code.

FEMA made (and continues to make) blunder upon blunder. But the "blame game" can't point to FEMA or Michael Brown alone. What about the State Government? Both Mayor Nagin and Governo Blanco were to have issued the directives for the NOLA and the State of LA, yet they were not prepared. Both are tasked with emergency management roles, yet both Nagin and Blanco failed. The irony here is that both Nagin and Blanco participate in LA Federally-declared disasters each year -- 2 or 3 times each year, in fact. (Check the Federal funds that are funnelled into LA for disaster assistance.)

Katrina is not a conspiracy, but it was a government fiasco of huge proportions that trumped the Cat 5 hurricane. New Orleans has had to cope with a large population of below-poverty level residents. Many of these residents were living in Section 8 housing that is no longer habitable. Until the government can re-create the dependency-relationship these displaced people previously had with them, most will continue to subsist any way they can. Generational Welfare created much of this apathy, this complaicency, and these are fact-based problems that has little to do with bias or media-manipulated images.

NGC2736:
Oh! That kind of conspiracy! Well, Yeah.....OK. Thanks for the break! Heheh. We can certainly agree about that.

Zoltan:
Well said, You obviously have a grasp on the situation. The question remains, however, what is to be done? It is true that "The Great Society" has produced part of the mindset involved here, but how can it be reversed, or dealt with in such a way as to avoid a duplication in another area?

Originally posted by idamae606
I read online that: because the levies were built by the federal government, to admit there was a failure of same was to open the feds to compensation for damages to those in NOLA. Hence, this was called hurricane damage, when in fact, much of the damage was due to levies failing.

Not only did you nail this fact head on- there are many more government failings- too many to be listed and/or mentioned. The poisonous trailers, tainted food, bottled water provisions (later tested which showed toxic levels of fluoride and chlorine, and lets not forget the massive "vaccinations" which occurred at the "refugee" centers.

There is a far more evil agenda happening that is nearly too much to bear- yet it is being exposed and hopefully the people will take this fight into a revolution the likes of which this country has never yet seen. Sadly, this is what is needed to stop the atrocities from our now fully integrated Nazi regime.

They have the concentration camps and trains ready and waiting- they know we are getting a little more than pissed off and annoyed- they are simply waiting for us all to grab our pitchforks and torches. These camps have little and/or nothing to do with illegal immigrants and anyone who believes otherwise- will soon find themselves interned in such a camp scratching their heads and wondering where the rest of their family is.

This galactic a$$hole Bush is the new Hitler- make no mistake about that- actually Cheney is Hitler and Bush is Eichmann.

Originally posted by America Jones
Does anybody else wonder whether the government's delay in responding to Katrina was the result of a psychological operations project to study the mass psychology of an American city being destroyed? A "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity?"



[edit on 18-11-2007 by America Jones]

Interesting but doubtful. I do not think they care how we are going to react or respond to any sort of catastrophe- their actions clearly show they were bent on making it worse by taking advantage of an already devastating disaster. They wanted a bigger death toll and helped it right along- a few less Americans to be rounded up later. Who said hurricanes aren't convenient. (Sarcasm)

dk3000:
Do you really believe that stuff? You know the death toll in N.O. was very small, don't you?

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
reply to post by NGC2736

 

I'd have to agree, NGC.

BUT:
NOT necessarily a fault of the people that comprise this nation, but more a faultering by those who are/were chosen to represent said peoples. NOT that any citizen should expect or feel deserving of a handout, but more that in a situation of such catastrophic enormity there Should have been a more organized and prioritized effort to aide those in need of such. We're not talking ice cream trucks and popsicle parties... just basic needs being fulfilled.

Hindsight being 20/20 and all, sure we can all play Monday morning quarterback, but Honestly... I saw little more than a cluster*bleep* that played out centerstage on the 6 o'clock snewz via the helping hand of overzealous media hounds.

Today in New Orleans...

:shk:

As much as I hate to admit it, and, again, in hindsight... the entirety of it all... public intro of private security contractors, right to hold and or bear arms thrown out the door, along with other inalienable and constitutionally afforded rights going by the wayside. All supposedly in lieu of "public safety" and or "the good of all".

As some may claim regarding 9-11, was it allowed to happen? If only to gauge the response or acceptance thereof pertaining to such adminstrative and or govermental failures?

I'm NOT set in stone either way, but it would seem there are Obvious questions that have yet to be answered and situations yet to be resolved... 'least in my opinion.

? thoughts ?

Glad to see the debate here, this was my first premium submission.


Some events seem unfortunate or disheartening, yet I feel as though others have malevolent aims.

We can see for sure that various civil rights were violated, this is documented.

Several of you mentioned that the entire government reaction, mostly local, was a fiasco. I completely agree here and this was something I did not cover in the article. But it was implied. That concept is worthy of serious debate....government was established (in my opinion) to facilitate lifestyles and better develop society, to ensure rights, etc. I see all around me that people think they are safe. There are police and armies and ballistic missiles and war planes that protect us from enemies. This is all part of the imaginary shield of safety.

Safety is the responsibility of the individual. You cannot help someone unless they want to be helped. Likewise, helpless citizens are merely sheep who will follow direction.

Someone mentioned that a teenager took a bus to save people and he was struck down by the authority of the government. This is exactly the kind of mindset that must be promoted and preserved, yet it was frowned upon. Heroism and initiative are key elements of the people who will survive.

To those posting about conspiracies. As always, it is possible. I like that America Jones mentioned the idea of psychology here. Whether it was intentional or not, this was an immensely important event to record data on how people will react when: their rights are denied and not fought for, they are made to stay or leave (passively or aggressively), they become heavily reliant on others/authority. It is stimulus and response. People can be conditioned.

One of the most powerful psychological stimuli is fear. If you make someone afraid, interesting things happen with how they will relate to others and what they will/will not do.

en.wikipedia.org...
This link has semi-pertinent information about some of the feelings people may have been faced with.

Katrina could be a crystal ball into the future, our future. I believe so. Most big shot predictors, clairvoyants, are seeing bad happenings for the next solar max and 2012. I feel you will see problems like this (Katrina) again.
Still waiting to see when the big pacific tsunami hits. If it is too far out from solar max this time, the US gulf coast could be lost.

[edit on 19-11-2007 by pc is here]

Originally posted by Camar
Zoltan:
Well said, You obviously have a grasp on the situation. The question remains, however, what is to be done? It is true that "The Great Society" has produced part of the mindset involved here, but how can it be reversed, or dealt with in such a way as to avoid a duplication in another area?

Ha, Camar! I would hope I have been able to see into the situation....I'm an ex-FEMA employee. While there, I witnessed countless "disaster victims" use the excuse of a Federally-declared disaster to call into FEMA to receive free assistance funds so that they could have extra cash. It was a well known fact that MANY poor people applying for assistance were supplementing their welfare-income every time LA was hit with a big storm or a hurricane. Most of the claims were questionable and many were downright fraudulent. Some of the water damaged items were from previous storms, but no matter....the money was 'free', brought to them via the hardworking taxpayers of America.

Unless we eliminate the 'free ride', we're doomed. A productive and healthy society can only thrive when people are productive and helpful. Until the 'new deal', people (and their communities) had to fend for themselves and make concerted efforts to live and prosper. These entitlement programs have created such generational issues that we are able to study the outcomes now. Case in point is this one, the Katrina dilemma.

Too many bail-out programs and propped-up entitlements have created a land where government caretakers will provide for an individual or family. If the government dried up and these programs were eliminated, what portion of the recipients of such programs would survive after a life of never having to accept responsibility?

It is my belief that our government needs to stop playing the role of the Almighty Bad Parent....you know, the kind of parent who keeps bailing Junior out of self-made messes. Although unpleasant to think of the immediate outcome, our government needs to back out of "giving financial assistance" and let people gain control of their lives. Our government also needs to allow local communities assist with the plight of their own poor and unfortunate, rather than using the government to attempt to right-the-wrong with some financial assistance. It's not all about money, it is about learning to live, to function in society. Learning to deal with consequences from bad or stupid decisions is what life is about, not calling up some government agency and telling them that they have GOT to give them money.

reply to post by Zoltan


Matthew 25:40 And the King will make answer and say to them, Truly I say to you, Because you did it to the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.

All this talk about " doomsday" makes me wet myself. ------------------PC

reply to post by pc is here


Methinks you overlooked a few other passages:

If a man is lazy, the rafters sag; if his hands are idle, the house leaks.
Ecclesiastes 10:18

The sluggard craves and gets nothing, but the desires of the diligent are fully satisfied.
Proverbs 13:4

Lazy hands make a man poor, but diligent hands bring wealth.
Proverbs 10:4

The sluggard buries his hand in the dish; he is too lazy to bring it back to his mouth.
Proverbs 26:15

Go to the ant, you sluggard; consider its ways and be wise!
Proverbs 6:6

Nothing surprises me anymore after FEMA faked a new interview anything is possible with this government....

And to the comment of people "expecting a handout"...well i gotta say, i dont think help in emergency or help when injured, or any other such things qualify as "handouts" when im a taxpaying citizen. As 1/3 of my pay is taken every month before i even touch it, i consider those as "paid for services" and in truth it bothers me that the government takes such a large chunk of my tax dollars, then gives it away in crooked nepotism and no bid contracts to companies with personal ties to government personell. indeed, I am NOT represented by my government, and i believe in NO taxation without representation. Why is it that people are made to feel oppressed by the moneys spent upon social programs for the needy, when in fact that amount pales in comparison to government subsidies to big oil, big business, and big pharma?? The government is giving BILLIONS of dollars in breaks and aid to these already RICH people, indeed is even paying now for a branch of the FDA to do the drug research FOR big pharma, and freely giving our money to contracters in Iraq and New Orleans with no accountability or quality control, and we gripe with worry that social services, health, and welfare will break us? please. That trillion that has been spent on this war could have paid for our whole countries health care for many years over.
Ok, im rambling now.
To sum it up, public opinion (as shown by polls, pipa report, etc) is vastly different from government policy, and in a true democracy the two should be closely lined up. Its not just that I am not represented, its also that the general public is not represented. The majority of our public is against the war (as per polls), the majority of our public is for massive healthcare reform (as per polls), the majority of our public is for massive tax reform (as per polls) and not one of these has been addressed. Indeed, the majority of the public supports impeaching Bush if he lied (which he has per new reports on the plame incident) and yet impeachment is not on the table. Cheney's doesnt count yet, sorry.