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40million illegals are in america. is there an unofficial immigration policy to usher in ther new wo

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posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 07:11 PM

Originally posted by malakiem

Originally posted by rockets red glare
reply to post by Loki

it's not a lame statisic. Those statisics are "people" 30% of our prison puplation are foreigners. This is a huge problem and platitudes won't solve it!

It's true, it is possible for a terrorist to go under a guide of immigration. It's happened around were I live quite a few times. Most of the mexicans were I live steal, and the guy who works for my sister's landlord broke and entered into my sister's apartment. He stole money, and a camera. Loki, statistics do help, your being to picky and biased for someone who denies ingourance. If the people claim these things, there must be some truth in it, right?

He stole? THAT is "terrorism"?

posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 08:55 PM
reply to post by Loki

Why is this OUR fault?

I am so tired of being called a racist or xenophobe every time the subject of ILLEGAL immigration is brought up. This is the USA and we have laws, rules, and regulations about how people from other Countries are able to enter this Nation. Please come up with an original and logical argument as to why we should make special rules for this group of illegal immigrants?
We should not accept the old argument of "they are doing jobs Americans won't do" because it's not true. I have friends and relatives in the construction industry who were basically put out of business because illegal aliens were taking the jobs for less than legitimate businesses can do.

posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 09:05 PM
I fail to see the problem, america was born from illegal migration

posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 09:49 PM

Originally posted by thesun
I fail to see the problem, america was born from illegal migration

No it wasn't. There were no immigration laws back then.

posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 09:58 PM

Originally posted by jsobecky

Originally posted by thesun
I fail to see the problem, america was born from illegal migration

No it wasn't. There were no immigration laws back then.

At least none the Indians could enforce, eh?

Har har!

posted on Nov, 19 2007 @ 10:32 PM
I have seen a lot of different numbers thrown about on this thread without any one posting links so I thought I's throw some at you all.

First you have The Centre fro Immigration Studies citing 8-9 million but admit many sources put it at a much higher number. They use US Census Bureau numbers.

Then there is this website, Californians for Population Stabilization that has some great articles on it. I wonder if any of our west coast members might know these guys? They claim that the numbers could be as high as 38 million.The four on this page are interesting reads. I have read on full one and skimmed the others. Here's a snippet from one of them.

At the same time, an investigation by the U.S. Department of Justice Inspector General found INS statistics suspect and cited deliberate deception by senior INS officials tampering with immigration statistics. Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus (false in one, false in all).

The DOJ investigation agreed with audits by the Government Accounting Office (now Government Accountability Office, GAO) that an “aura of incompetence and incestuous mismanagement” permeated the INS. Over the years, GAO auditors voiced their concerns to the INS Office of the General Counsel, which was plagued by a swinging door of political appointee General Counsels. Those who pushed for accurate counts were stilled by bureaucratic estoppel, dead-end rewrites, and persistently convoluted and distorted statistics.

Then there is this site. NumbersUSA. It keeps popping up in searches. I haven't gone through the whole site yet but on that page they are talking about a bill introduced in the Senate. It's called The SAVE Act. Sounds kind of interesting. First I have heard of it so I'll save an opinion for later. But it is supposed to be the answer to your immigration problem. Although I don't expect it to be that easy. With roughly 1/10th of your current population being in your country illegally, a piece of legislation is only going to be part of the answer.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:04 AM

Originally posted by jedimiller

Originally posted by poet1b
Mexicans don't want us gringos down in Mexico

That's a false statement. My nephew and I just went to mexico on friday night. He's a full faced gringo as you call it. he managed to meet a mexican lady and get her phone number. today he called and they are dating.

make that 40,000,001 illegals

on the real though just close the borders...and start weeding out the illegals and start shippin em back....would cost buttloads of money though...but imo it would be worth it...same goes for canadas borders too not just mexico as it seems the border with them is even easier to cross

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:27 AM
What I don't understand is why are they trying to turn this country into a country that they decided to leave behind?

The people that are driving the Mexicans out of Mexico are those of European ancestry, particularly those of Spanish origin.
It is a conflict between the have and the have nots.

I go to Mexico often and I really get disgusted with the rude and wealthy fair skinned Mexicans that constantly look down on everyone else and always expect the red carpet treatment no matter what the situation. It is nothing more than the wealthy EuroMex looking down on the poor native MayanMex.

Sound familar?

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:33 AM
This immigration problem is just a political tool to get you to vote for him or her. Before 9/11 this so called problem was not much of an issue in
american consciousness. Politicians are good at manipulating the mind
and passions of the masses, they are like sheperds who ring the bell
and the sheep (masses) follow. Alexandre Dumas said it best in The Count of Montecristo- " Kings and Pawns, Emperors and Fools."

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 01:57 AM
I feel like going down to mexico, picking up a hot girl and bring her back here to san diego. illegally. And marry her
just to prove a point.

Would you send me to prision for doing so? just speculation of course.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 03:12 AM
Data on illegal immigrants kept secret...

Two federal agencies are refusing to turn over a mountain of evidence that investigators could use to indict the nation's burgeoning work force of illegal immigrants and the firms that employ them.
The Internal Revenue Service and the Social Security Administration routinely collect strong evidence of potential workplace crimes, including names and addresses of millions of people who are using bogus Social Security numbers, their wage records, and the identities of the bosses who knowingly hire them.
But they keep those facts secret.

Illegals are more than happy to risk being caught for free medical care, free education for their children who are also here illegally and for jobs. They have no fear of deportation because we have gutless cowards serving in Congress along with the four border governors. In this "new" bill sitting in the senate is a provision for in-state tuition for illegals!

WARNING! US Senate Amnesty Bill Contains In-State Tuition for illegal aliens!

Posted on Tuesday, April 04 @ 10:35:50 CDT
Topic: congress senate illegal Immigration Laws
congress senate illegal Immigration Laws"This bill will replace American children with illegal aliens in the limited seats in college at taxpayer expense! That is why this legislation has failed in Florida, North Carolina, Georgia, MA, and other states!" -- William Gheen, President of Americans for Legal Immigration PAC.

We the people are speaking up. The people are fed up with plans to merge the United States into a North American Union with Canada and Mexico which would destroy American sovereignty.

We are:

# Fed up with the refusal of the Federal government to secure our borders.

# Fed up with armed Mexicans illegally crossing our borders and assaulting Americans.

# Fed up when Americans like border agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean are sent to prison for defending us from drug-smuggling illegals.

# Fed up with the millions of illegals in America costing taxpayers hundreds of billions of dollars every year.

# Fed up with a president who orders 160,000 young Americans into harm’s way, thousands of miles from home, yet refuses to secure America.

# Fed up with politicians who refuse to enforce immigration laws and claim it is “impossible” to deport criminals who are here illegally

# Fed up with illegals who take advantage of free medical services to dump their medical bills on our backs and push our hospitals into bankruptcy.

# Fed up with federal, state, and local systems overrun by illegal aliens costing taxpayers billions each year.

# Fed up with the fact that illegal aliens kill an average of 12 Americans every day.

# Fed up with politicians who pamper illegals with driver’s licenses and free public services.

Americans are fed up with the Mexicanization of America! And finally, we are fed up with a president and members of Congress who consistently work on behalf of illegals and the state of Mexico and against the interests of the American people.

The American people are fed up, mad as hell, and we are not going to take it anymore!

Around the corner from my house... in a quiet older neighborhood here in Las Vegas a Legal Mexican immigrant family moved in to a rented house. Within three months they moved in 'relatives'... Some of these relatives are collecting food stamps, are knocking on doors looking for work... one lady pregnant pushing a baby stroller asked for cleaning work to help her get an immigration lawyer...

The house is now a trash yard several derelict vehicles... The police are there constantly and have several times cordoned off the entire block with helicopters... The young ones have gang vehicles and race around the neighborhood. One night the cops came into our yard at about 2 am with the copter shining its light... and found one of them under our canopy... we were in the living room with guests... The next morning we found a gun tossed under a bush

There are today vehicles that are abandoned on the street. The police tow them when enough of the neighbors complain... but it still goes on... Last month they bought a Humvee...

There is a second house... two blocks from us that was rented to a gang of teenagers......

I have been at 2 Wendy's and 1 Taco Bell where the entire staff speaks Mexican and 2 cases of not having my order understood. Burger joints used to be a place the American teenager got a first job... it was tradition...

All around town we are seeing signs on stores in Mexican only... I thought this was against the law...

Rep. Ron Paul: First, we need to bring home our border patrol agents we have sent to Iraq and get them back guarding our border. I think it is absurd that we are worried more about the borders of Iraq and Syria than we are about our own. Next, we need to immediately end federal mandates compelling states to give state welfare benefits to illegals. Right now, states are required to provide free medical care, education and sometimes even food assistance to illegal immigrants, and this acts as a subsidy for illegal immigration. Free education and medical care? This is a powerful incentive to come here illegally. Why wouldn't people bring their families here? If we cut off the subsidies, a lot of people here illegally would just leave.

And just a note of recent news....

Drug Smuggler In Campean, Ramos Case Indicted
Fri, 11/16/2007 - 11:52 — Judicial Watch Blog

The Mexican drug smuggler who got immunity from the U.S. government to testify against two veteran Border Patrol agents has finally been indicted and arrested for possessing and distributing marijuana months after testifying against the federal officers.

U.S. lawmakers from both parties as well as Americans nationwide were outraged that the Border Patrol agents—Jose Campean and Ignacio Ramos--received 11 and 12-year prison sentences for intercepting a large drug cargo near El Paso while the notorious illegal immigrant trafficker was set free.

Federal prosecutors actually went into Mexico and offered the drug dealer, Osvaldo Aldrete Davila, immunity to testify against Ramos and Campean because they had shot him in the buttocks as he fled south of the border. The agents were subsequently convicted of causing serious bodily injury, assault with a deadly weapon and violating the drug smuggler’s civil rights.

Anyone who doesn't see a problem with any of this...

To end this on a positive note....

Pahrump targets illegal immigrants

Ordinance declares English town's official language, limits flying foreign flags, denies benefits

After a heated public meeting Tuesday night that was repeatedly interrupted by boos and applause, the Pahrump Town Board adopted an ordinance that targets illegal immigrants.

The ordinance declares English the town's official language, sets restrictions on flying foreign flags and denies town benefits to undocumented immigrants.

Approval of the ordinance was met with a standing ovation and cheers by many of the approximately 250 people at the meeting.

One man wore a stars and stripes bandana on his head and a T-shirt that said: Speak English or get the (expletive) out.

Another proponent, Elliott Brainard, who identified himself as a naval officer who served during World War II, said, "These people who don't speak English ... take money and support away from our citizens who need it."

Another man, who said he was an Army veteran, said since this is the United States, there should be only one language.

"I go bananas when I go to Wal-Mart, put my credit card in and they ask me if I want English only," he said.

Our Government tells us "Beware the Arabs" I do not see any Arabs...

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 04:51 AM
How many of you actually live in parts of the USA where illegal immigrants out number Mexican/Latino citizens ?

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 04:55 AM

Originally posted by jedimiller
I feel like going down to mexico, picking up a hot girl and bring her back here to san diego. illegally. And marry her
just to prove a point.

Would you send me to prision for doing so? just speculation of course.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 05:01 AM
I have several communities in my area where this is the case.

Brentwood, NY for one example and several other communities are very close to it as well such as Central Islip, Bay Shore, Huntington Station, Shirly/Mastic/Moriches, Patchogue, Copaigue, Hempstead, Westbury, Mineola, the Hamptons, etc.

They move into a neighborhood that is mostly lower income Blacks or Whites, buy their homes and the next thing you know they make up well over half the communities population. At first its very subtle and the naive ones start talking about the "great amount of diversity" and then it just gets worse and worse to where its pretty much the same situation as Zorgon and his Las Vegas neighborhood.

Anyone who thinks all this is great is either really really naive or in somehow related to or profits from illegal immigration.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 05:02 AM
reply to post by rockets red glare

And what would that point be? That you think they are so low you could just buy her, walk in and walk out. Maybe you think laws don't apply to you? You are aboe it all, right? If you got caught and were charged with human trafficing what would you do? I'm sure you would get no sympathy from your countrymen and women since you obviously have contempt for their point of view.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 05:13 AM

Originally posted by rockets red glare
reply to post by Zoltan

I don't for one min. believe Americans are greedier than any one else and know they are more genourous than most. Wealth is not thing that should just devied up. Wealth is created. Many weathy people are good people. certainly there are the elites who want all they can take and would like to have the free flow of labor just as they have the free flow of goods! As far as our need for energy goes, I believe that is just nothing more than the result of a sucsessfull people. We are no different in that respest than anyone else! If you offered a new (or old) car with a gas guzzling V8 to someone for free you can bet the would take it and drive it!!! Americans are made up from all the peoples in the world. Is it your belief that has soon as someone becomes an american they all the sudden become evil and greedy. Why do you supose all these foreigners want to come here? maybe they want to jump into this "greed fest". No, of course not. They want to come here to join the most advanced and free nation and just nation on earth. American use energy because they have sosiety has advanced beyond the others. But make no mistake THEY WISH THEY WERE IN OUR SHOES. They could easliy be, if they would abandon the ideas of collectivism. Why would anyone want to stay with such a flawed and fail system that has shown itself to breed corruption and failure and ever worse authoritarian paractices. AMERICA IS NOT A PROBLEM OF THE WORLD BUT, THE ONE GREAT HOPE FOR IT!

Which side of your fence are you sitting on now? Re-reading your comments throughout this thread shows contradiction in what you have presented, so I'm really unsure about how to respond. I do stand by my convictions: America is a greedy nation.

As for America being "successful" -- you SURE about that one? The Feds are trying damn hard to cover-up the fact that America is heading into a recession; Bernake is pumping money into our economy while the gov't wants "amnesty" for illegals to help with our entitlement burdens. This is successful?

Sure there are "good" Americans, even some good wealthy Americans. But America, COLLECTIVE AMERICA, is a greedy nation. Look at history. Read the data and study the trends. Offering up such a trite example as someone driving a free V8 'gas guzzler' to prove your point is pathetic rhetoric.

You said:
We can help no one when we are a broken nation ourselv's. But my original point is that our gov. knows this as well as any of us do! So why do they allow it to happen. I think it is because the elites in this country- the powerfull and the weathly and business comunity all want these people here over the objections of the american people and the LAw. There must be some reason for this. I allways say follow the mony but, thats could only be part of it..
You said:
The reason the brokers of power in this country, (those with access to our political leaders or are the finaciers of the polititions) have an agenda. A large part of it is money and another aspect of it is ideaology. They don't care what the consequences are for the average american. They could care less how it affects our standard of living, our personal health, our culture, or the finacial situation of our nation. They want to fundamentally change this country and will stop at nothing to see to it that their vision of the the future for this country and the world happens regardless of the law or what the citizenry of america want for posterity. They want a new n. ameican union and ultamitly a one world government.
You said:
You may think it's hip or virtuous to force to watch the distructiion of the middle class . I don't. americans have payed a pricetag of trillions to end poverty in our own nation. That will never happen if we import poverty on this scale.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:26 AM

Originally posted by ibumenemhet
How many of you actually live in parts of the USA where illegal immigrants out number Mexican/Latino citizens ?

Manassas Park, Va. A little suburb of Washington DC. It is an illegal alien sanctuary city and has been ransacked by illegals and converted within a space of 3 years. The latest statistics show that the LEGAL Hispanics outnumber all other races in this town and that data doesn't even count the number of illegals here which FAR outnumbers the legals. Sit on any corner in town and count people that drive or walk by and you get a consistent 80% Hispanic. All within 3 years. Unless these people come into the fold, start adapting and stop living their corrupt Mexican lifestyles then there will be civil war. You heard it here folks. Prepare for it.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:35 AM
reply to post by Escrotumus

I couldn't agree with you more -- Americans are beyond fed-up, they are angry. Everything you have said in your posts is true, actually you've probably been understating the problems in PW County and Manassas. I'm nearby, in Frederick County. We're getting some of the spillover and the County has just seen the beginning of the problem. I've lived here for 21 years and we are moving out of Virginia in Spring 2009.

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 06:55 AM
I find it funny how all of a sudden we are worried about the immigrants,I think it's a perfect ploy of the government to justify a martial law,scare us all into thinking all of a sudden after all these years they will raise arms against us,The government doesn't need to recruit the people have taken the bait,it's a sad state we are in,and when the smoke clears who will bitch the most when the whip comes down,the very people who helped get us here

posted on Nov, 20 2007 @ 07:46 AM
Why is it that some of you here think that we are sheep who do whatever the government decides that we should do? Do you think that maybe it is US that made the government start to take a look at this problem and not the other way around? I get very frustrated with people when they insinuate that the outcry over illegal immigration is some wispy concept that crooked politicians have created to get people to vote for them. I am angry at illegal immigrants because they have decimated my town and caused my property values to plummet to the basement destroying my ability to move up and out. I am angry because they hang out at 7-11's peeing on the wall and harassing women as they walk in. Most people won't even go into a 7-11 in this town any more due to all the lowlifes hanging around looking for work and acting a fool. The gangs are starting to tag areas now as well and wear colors.

Oldtimer2: You also forgot the key adjective in your last post: ILLEGAL. People aren't concerned about immigration. We are concerned about ILLEGAL immigration. No amount of spin coming from you about how this is an imaginary problem created by politicians or how we all hate immigrants (conveniently missing the key adjective illegal) can change that fact. Nice try though.

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